Toronto Printing Factory Lofts | ?m | 8s | Averton | Montgomery Sisam

[Thesb]

Thanks AGTO - still, I think people may be making a big deal over what should amount to very little noise variance between design types. A little more context:

STC What can be heard
25 Normal speech can be understood quite easily and distinctly through wall
30 Loud speech can be understood fairly well, normal speech heard but not understood
35 Loud speech audible but not intelligible
40 Onset of "privacy"
42 Loud speech audible as a murmur
45 Loud speech not audible; 90% of statistical population not annoyed
50 Very loud sounds such as musical instruments or a stereo can be faintly heard; 99% of population not annoyed.
60+ Superior soundproofing; most sounds inaudible

STC Partition type
33 Single layer of 1/2" drywall on each side, wood studs, no insulation (typical interior wall)
45 Double layer of 1/2" drywall on each side, wood studs, batt insulation in wall
46 Single layer of 1/2" drywall, glued to 6" lightweight concrete block wall, painted both sides
54 Single layer of 1/2" drywall, glued to 8" dense concrete block wall, painted both sides
55 Double layer of 1/2" drywall on each side, on staggered wood stud wall, batt insulation in wall
59 Double layer of 1/2" drywall on each side, on wood stud wall, resilient channels on one side, batt insulation
63 Double layer of 1/2" drywall on each side, on double wood/metal stud walls (spaced 1" apart), double batt insulation
72 8" concrete block wall, painted, with 1/2" drywall on independent steel stud walls, each side, insulation in cavities


STC partition ratings taken from: "Noise Control in Buildings: A Practical Guide for Architects and Engineers"; Cyril M. Harris, 1994

 

[AGTO]

I think people may be making a big deal over what should amount to very little noise variance between design types.

What sort of building do you live in now?

The STC rating express attenuation , not absolute levels.

 

[Thesb]

Well, I've been renting for 15 years, and had 7 different apartments in that span, so I've had experience with all kinds of situations re. walls, neighbours, and noise. Anecdotally, I find that the main culprits which interfere with a peaceful unit are:

1. Floor/ceiling design. By far the noisiest unit I ever lived in was a beautiful old 3-story walkup on Avenue Rd. The floorboards creaked, and I could hear my upstairs neighbour's every step. I'd be woken up when he got up to pee at four in the morning - that sort of thing. Even in other units I've lived in, I still find bass from stereo speakers, the clashing of pots and pans, laughter and loud conversation etc. travels from top to bottom rather than through the sides.

2. Front door. Noise from other units (particularly music) seems to seep in through the door more than the walls. It helps in doors don't face each other, and it also helps to install a sweep at the bottom and foam around the inside of the frame.

I've lived in units where I had to use a hammer-drill just to hang a picture, and units where the walls might have been made from white chocolate, and there wasn't much difference between the two as far as I could tell. Neither stopped yapping dogs from ruining a quiet dinner... I guess at the end of the day the courtesy neighbors have for one another is more important that the material the wall is made from.

I'm a purchaser at TPF, and it bothers me a bit that there are people on the forum who insinuate that living in a unit with single-stud walls will be the equivalent of living in a paper bag and that we're idiots for choosing a condo that hasn't been chiselled out of the Canadian Shield.

 

[jayzie]

I'm a purchaser at TPF, and it bothers me a bit that there are people on the forum who insinuate that living in a unit with single-stud walls will be the equivalent of living in a paper bag and that we're idiots for choosing a condo that hasn't been chiselled out of the Canadian Shield.

LOL. I think you've made a great decision to purchase in TPF. The building is coming together nicely and values in the neighbourhood will only go up. Wise investment I'd say. BTW, I've lived in a condo with drywall only and never had a noise problem.

 

[AGTO]

I'm a purchaser at TPF, and it bothers me a bit that there are people on the forum who insinuate that living in a unit with single-stud walls will be the equivalent of living in a paper bag and that we're idiots for choosing a condo that hasn't been chiselled out of the Canadian Shield.

No one has called you an idiot.
It was pointed out that due to a change in building codes, the minimum standard was lowered. In the past, cinder block or poured concrete walls were required, providing a 2 or more hour fire rating. That changed to a minimum of a one hour rating, which can be accomplished with drywall and intumescent paint.
It's a shame they cheaped out on such a beautiful building though.
Single stud drywall partitions are susceptable to transmitting mechanical motion ...just like knocking on a door.

BTW, I've lived in a condo with drywall only and never had a noise problem.

Which one?

 

[Thesb]

No worries AGTO - I'm not pointing fingers, just commenting on the tone of the forum in general (this thread and the "Noisy Condo Tenants" thread in the Real Estate section). My occupancy is scheduled for the end of September, so I'll find out soon enough if there's going to be sound issues. If there is, you guys will be able to hear my screams of frustration - whether you live in units with concrete walls or not.

 

[slowtyper]

Does anybody know if they are offering any additional incentives at this time?

 

[Thesb]

Does anybody know if they are offering any additional incentives at this time?

Not sure - when I bought, it was free Rogers digital cable, highspeed internet, and phone for one year, and $3000 off the purchase price or $5000 in upgrade credit. Mind you, that was May 2007 when things were in the developer's favour. Might be more on offer now.

 

[jayzie]

My occupancy is scheduled for the end of September, so I'll find out soon enough if there's going to be sound issues. If there is, you guys will be able to hear my screams of frustration - whether you live in units with concrete walls or not.

Keep it down wouldja? My house is right across the street!

Seriously though, good news about the end of September occupancy (I'm personally looking forward to and end to the noise and dust). As of this morning, windows have been installed up to the 7th floor, about half of the courtyard has been poured and the townhouses facing Boston are starting to take shape.

 

[Thesb]

Keep it down wouldja? My house is right across the street!

Seriously though, good news about the end of September occupancy (I'm personally looking forward to and end to the noise and dust). As of this morning, windows have been installed up to the 7th floor, about half of the courtyard has been poured and the townhouses facing Boston are starting to take shape.

Pleasedtomeetya, Jayzie. I hope you don't mind a couple of questions from a future neighbor...

1. How long does it take to get from Queen/Carlaw to the Queen subway station on the 501 streetcar between say, 7 and 9 am?

2. Are there any plans afoot to renovate the Shoppers Drugmart on the corner?

Cheers!

 

[Marrelli]

Does anybody know if they are offering any additional incentives at this time?

I purchased a couple weeks ago they were offering $5k off the price or $7.5k in upgrades. As well, there is some sort of a referral bonus for current owners, where I believe both the purchaser and the referral receive $2.5K off, not a 100% on how that works.

So you know who to reach to if you are going to buy there

 

[Thesb]

I purchased a couple weeks ago they were offering $5k off the price or $7.5k in upgrades. As well, there is some sort of a referral bonus for current owners, where I believe both the purchaser and the referral receive $2.5K off, not a 100% on how that works.

So you know who to reach to if you are going to buy there

Hang on there Marrelli. Since you got a bigger discount, I think it's only fair that we split Slowtyper's referral bonus

 

[shilly]

Pleasedtomeetya, Jayzie. I hope you don't mind a couple of questions from a future neighbor...

1. How long does it take to get from Queen/Carlaw to the Queen subway station on the 501 streetcar between say, 7 and 9 am?

2. Are there any plans afoot to renovate the Shoppers Drugmart on the corner?

Cheers!

Sorry...like a good resident of the east end...I'm putting in my two cents,


The streetcar from Carlaw and Queen takes approx...15 minutes to get from Carlaw to Yonge. Traffic moves quite quickly along queen with no parking.

The shoppers drug mart has an amendment to the official zoning act in place that would renovate it. I think they also want to add some office space above.

Peace.

 

[jayzie]

1. How long does it take to get from Queen/Carlaw to the Queen subway station on the 501 streetcar between say, 7 and 9 am?

2. Are there any plans afoot to renovate the Shoppers Drugmart on the corner?

Howdy future neighbour!

1. Queen streetcar takes anywhere from 15-20 minutes from Carlaw to Yonge depending on traffic. I go as far as Spadina and it's about 25-40 minutes.

2. Apparently. That Shopper's has been a blight on the 'hood for over 10 yrs. I believe it's "owned and operated" and the owner can't be bothered to fix it up. There are "notices of application" posted on the windows for renovations, but haven't heard when those might start.

http://app.toronto.ca/ApplicationStatus/details.do?folderRsn=2453685

 

[greenleaf]

If you are looking to get to the subway the fastest, the Pape bus runs in front of the printing factory up to Pape Station and takes only about 5-7 minutes. I believe it runs every 10-12 minutes, so if you time it right, it's much faster than the streetcar.