Toronto Pinnacle Lakeside (Phase 1) | 174.86m | 54s | Pinnacle | Hariri Pontarini

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skywalker said:
Hi Mastec, thank you for your feedback on the development of the Lakeside complex. I realized that July 2022 occupancy was impossible and that 2024 was plausible if they get going in ernest now.
Your statement about the Summer 2024 occupancy was not so clear. Did you mean that you think it might be ready by Summer 2024 and that afew floors are already completed in the first buiding?

The only silver lining right now is that the building will be completed at some point, and the deposit amount will multiply by 2, 3 or 4 times, if the price current uptrend continues. Yes, I pray that developer will not cancel the project...lol. I understand that then I would get my deposit back with some interest. What a freaking journey!!!!
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I was referring to a different development in the city which already has a few floors up and I still don't expect the occupancy to occur before 2024.

Hence, from my personal perspective, Lakeside, which virtually hasn't even started yet but with a significantly larger scope than my reference point, has close to zero chance to initiate occupancy before 2026.

Again, I don't mean to upset anyone, and I could be wrong in my estimates, but, at this point, I just honestly believe that relying on 2024 completion might result in disappointment. And the more the active construction phase gets delayed, the more I'll become convinced in my expectations.
 
Mastec said:
I was referring to a different development in the city which already has a few floors up and I still don't expect the occupancy to occur before 2024.

Hence, from my personal perspective, Lakeside, which virtually hasn't even started yet but with a significantly larger scope than my reference point, has close to zero chance to initiate occupancy before 2026.

Again, I don't mean to upset anyone, and I could be wrong in my estimates, but, at this point, I just honestly believe that relying on 2024 completion might result in disappointment. And the more the active construction phase gets delayed, the more I'll become convinced in my expectations.
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Thanks for your perspective. I tend to agree with your outlook.
 
TheSix said:
I'm betting 2026 for the initial occupancy for the first building, that is if this development doesn't go bankrupt beforehand.
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With the building costs skyrocketing every month as we speak, the only way Greenland builds is at a lost to just cover their name/brand. Given the history with overseas builders I highly doubt they will do that. I'd love to be wrong though.

Speaking with someone who had their project canceled 2 years ago. :(
 
Mastec said:
I was referring to a different development in the city which already has a few floors up and I still don't expect the occupancy to occur before 2024.

Hence, from my personal perspective, Lakeside, which virtually hasn't even started yet but with a significantly larger scope than my reference point, has close to zero chance to initiate occupancy before 2026.

Again, I don't mean to upset anyone, and I could be wrong in my estimates, but, at this point, I just honestly believe that relying on 2024 completion might result in disappointment. And the more the active construction phase gets delayed, the more I'll become convinced in my expectations.
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skywalker said:
Thanks for your perspective. I tend to agree with your outlook.
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To confirm @Mastec's guess: there is no way this will occupy in 2024. None at all.
 
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DogLover said:
With the building costs skyrocketing every month as we speak, the only way Greenland builds is at a lost to just cover their name/brand. Given the history with overseas builders I highly doubt they will do that. I'd love to be wrong though.

Speaking with someone who had their project canceled 2 years ago. :(
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AFAIK, Greenfield had bought multiple land parcels in TO over the years and has(had?) big development plans in the city. Failing Lakeside would mean exiting Canadian market altogether; no one would trust them (or any Chinese developer for that matter) for a loooong time here.

Though, understandably, not that it matters in a bankruptcy proceeding. Unless they find a way to avoid it.
 
Mastec said:
AFAIK, Greenfield had bought multiple land parcels in TO over the years and has(had?) big development plans in the city. Failing Lakeside would mean exiting Canadian market altogether; no one would trust them (or any Chinese developer for that matter) for a loooong time here.

Though, understandably, not that it matters in a bankruptcy proceeding. Unless they find a way to avoid it.
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I have zero confidence Greenland can complete this project. As you note, if a company goes under, exiting the market does not matter becasue the company is gone anyway.

There are zero chinese developers currently unscathed, the question comes down to which ones have it the worst. Thus far Greenland has managed to stay afloat, I suspect by the summer and certainly by the end of this year we will know definitely if they're going to be able to stick out the crisis or fold.
 
Mastec said:
AFAIK, Greenfield had bought multiple land parcels in TO over the years and has(had?) big development plans in the city. Failing Lakeside would mean exiting Canadian market altogether; no one would trust them (or any Chinese developer for that matter) for a loooong time here.

Though, understandably, not that it matters in a bankruptcy proceeding. Unless they find a way to avoid it.
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It would surely ruin their name, but a few builders have canceled and then resold the project after and are still building projects today. IE Liberty/Gupta Group Etc...
 
DogLover said:
It would surely ruin their name, but a few builders have canceled and then resold the project after and are still building projects today. IE Liberty/Gupta Group Etc...
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Again just to emphasize. Ditching these projects would be a last case, worst case scenario, but if a company is going under, there's not much left to ruin.
 
WeirdFishes said:
Not a good sign. I noticed the same. All other construction sites buzzing, except Lakeside.
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I noticed them digging a few times over the holidays as I walked the toddler down to Sherbourne Common for his first skating experience. But for the last number of months, any activity there has been very sporadic. There's obviously no push to actually accomplish anything, just to sort of keep things moving very slowly.
 
Bjays92 said:
Again just to emphasize. Ditching these projects would be a last case, worst case scenario, but if a company is going under, there's not much left to ruin.
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The point I am making is a company does not need to go under to cancel a project tons of developers have.
 
DogLover said:
The point I am making is a company does not need to go under to cancel a project tons of developers have.
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But it will have different implications for Chinese developers, giving what's going on with them and China's reputation in the world, then for locals.

And even cancelations by locals will have the buyers thinking trice before signing up with them. Builder's reputation is their largest asset.
 
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