Toronto Ontario Line 3 | ?m | ?s

amnesiajune said:
Patrick Brown is the most supportive of any of them: https://www.ontariopc.com/News/Deta...ick-Brown-on-the-Scarborough-subway-extension
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Exactly!
Read it:
Statement from Ontario PC Leader Patrick Brown on the Scarborough subway extension
March 27, 2017
“Tomorrow, the Toronto City Council will vote on the Scarborough Subway. While the people of Scarborough have been represented by 'subway champions' at City Council, it's unfortunate they haven't had strong voices at the Queen's Park table.

“The Wynne Liberals love to talk about the subway extension during by-elections, but so far all the people of Scarborough have seen are more empty and broken promises. When it comes to the Scarborough subway talk is cheap. The people want to see action. It’s time to put shovels in the ground and give Scarborough the subway it deserves.

"The people of Scarborough have watched as the Wynne Liberal Government has sat on its hands for well-over 13 years as Scarborough's transit needs have been ignored.

"Kathleen Wynne and this Liberal Government have taken Scarborough for granted. Scarborough deserves better. An Ontario PC Government would stand up for the people of Scarborough and deliver the subway they need and deserve.”
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He has not committed spending a cent, there, or anywhere on transit.

I wrote:
If Brown has stated *any* commitment anywhere in terms of funding for transit, please link or reference.
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I'm still waiting....
 
TheTigerMaster said:
Really? That never stopped them when it was politically convenient.

I agree that it's not fiscally prudent to make such commitments when the price is unknown, but let's not pretend that the government would not have committed to the Relief Line if it was politically beneficial for them to.
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I am sure the funding for the design work was already announced previously was it not? I know I heard something
 
OneCity said:
You make some good points and recommendations that I don't take issue with and I know you feel strongly about your opinion, so I respect that. I just took issue with the comment that we should cancel the SSE to fund downtown projects. That is not happening, nor should it. As you say the DRL will be funded and Scarborough has seen enough lack of public investment. The approach to what gets built, how its funded can and should be improved but for now that's not reality and will take decades to even make baby steps there. The best plan of attack given the urgent nature here is to go after those that can actually help before money continues to be spent in other areas across the GTA and help Toronto get moving across the board.
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Hopefully the Infrastructure Bank gets involved so that parties do not need to take the heat when it is cancelled. I doubt in Wynne's heart that she feels the scarborough subway is necessary
 
AlvinofDiaspar said:
Compare and contrast the approach for Spadina extension...where putting money into a trust is apparently on the menu

AoD
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so why does tory not call that out to the liberals. If they can do it for Vaughan and to gather votes it can be done for the DRL so as not to take the votes in Toronto for granted that they will go to her. Why does Tory need to be so politically correct? He should ensure that any funding from the liberals also be put into a trust only to be used for the DRL?
 
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steveintoronto said:
He has not committed spending a cent, there, or anywhere on transit.

I wrote:

If Brown has stated *any* commitment anywhere in terms of funding for transit, please link or reference.
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I'm still waiting....
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First of all, he doesn't have to promise money for the SSE because, despite the misinformation that goes around, it is fully funded unless the price rises by another $200 million.

Second, he's not in government. You can't make any funding announcements when you're in the opposition.
 
amnesiajune said:
First of all, he doesn't have to promise money for the SSE because, despite the misinformation that goes around, it is fully funded unless the price rises by another $200 million.
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No comment...you're on record here of making the claim...eyes roll.

Second, he's not in government. You can't make any funding announcements when you're in the opposition.
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I didn't say "funding announcements". I stated "commitments"

And you sure as hell can.

Let me help you: "If we get elected, we will commit $XXX to YYY Project..."

Here's an example:
Liberals, NDP, not ready to commit to SmartTrack

Opposition parties vow to commit more cash for transit than the Conservatives, but will let Toronto council decide what to spend it on.

Mayor John Tory wants the federal NDP and Liberals to match the Prime Minister’s pledge to spend billions on SmartTrack — but those opposition parties are not prepared, at the moment, to do so.

Prime Minister Stephen Harper delighted Tory on Thursday by saying a re-elected Conservative government would kick in “up to $2.6 billion,” or almost one-third of the transit expansion’s projected $8 billion cost.

On Friday, Tory said hopes Liberal Leader Justin Trudeau and the NDP’s Thomas Mulcair make the same pledge for the 53-kilometre, 22-station line commuter line, using existing GO tracks, on which he campaigned.

“It is not asking too much to have the leaders of all of Canada’s political parties prepared to be quite specific about not just their national plans for investment, but rather what specifically they might do in Toronto,” after this fall’s federal election, Tory said after a Pan Am athletes’ village tour.
[...]
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https://www.thestar.com/news/city_h...ls-ndp-not-ready-to-commit-to-smarttrack.html

See how that works? Brown is not even on record of what his transit plans are, let alone what he'd commit to them.

Meantime, for short memories:
PC’s Patrick Brown urges Wynne to derail John Tory’s road tolls

Progressive Conservative Leader Patrick Brown wants Premier Kathleen Wynne to erect a roadblock to Mayor John Tory’s plan to toll the DVP and the Gardiner.
[...]
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https://www.thestar.com/news/canada...ect-tolls-on-gardiner-don-valley-parkway.html

And at the same time:

Patrick Brown‏Verified account@brownbarrie
We need serious investments in transit, roads and our infrastructure. Not gimmicks. Ontario needs smart government #onpoli 6/6

So what is his plan? Let's make this easy:

What has he stated on the Relief Line? What are "serious investments"?

And I ask again, what has Brown *committed to funding* re the Relief Line?
 
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OneCity said:
The only clarity is Browns strong support to deliver the SSE and everything else will be known as we get closer to election day.
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And here is Brown's statement on that:
Statement from Ontario PC Leader Patrick Brown on the Scarborough subway extension
March 27, 2017
“Tomorrow, the Toronto City Council will vote on the Scarborough Subway. While the people of Scarborough have been represented by 'subway champions' at City Council, it's unfortunate they haven't had strong voices at the Queen's Park table.

“The Wynne Liberals love to talk about the subway extension during by-elections, but so far all the people of Scarborough have seen are more empty and broken promises. When it comes to the Scarborough subway talk is cheap. The people want to see action. It’s time to put shovels in the ground and give Scarborough the subway it deserves.

"The people of Scarborough have watched as the Wynne Liberal Government has sat on its hands for well-over 13 years as Scarborough's transit needs have been ignored.

"Kathleen Wynne and this Liberal Government have taken Scarborough for granted. Scarborough deserves better. An Ontario PC Government would stand up for the people of Scarborough and deliver the subway they need and deserve.”
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http://www.ontariopc.com/News/Detai...ick-Brown-on-the-Scarborough-subway-extension

And where, exactly, is his commitment to funding? The man talks a lot, he says nothing, let alone makes any kind of commitment.

So you at least agree that Brown has stated nothing in the way of a commitment on the Relief Line?
OneCity said:
I would take an educated guess Brown is going to support whatever plans Doug Ford supported for Toronto.
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Which plan?

Doug Ford says building the Downtown Relief Line is his first subway priority, an interesting turn for a campaign heavily focused on the suburbs.

At a press conference in his Etobicoke campaign office on Thursday, Councillor Ford, now a mayoral candidate, advocated for the same subway plan his brother, Mayor Rob Ford, unveiled in August and he continued attempts at discrediting John Tory’s SmartTrack line.
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http://news.nationalpost.com/toront...-relief-line-before-extending-sheppard-subway

Or this one?
Fords put a Scarborough subway extension ahead of Downtown Relief Line
[...]
Toronto Mayor Rob Ford says his transit priority is to extend the Sheppard subway into Scarborough, not to build the proposed Downtown Relief Line, setting the stage for another battle with the Toronto Transit Commission chair and some city councillors.
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https://www.theglobeandmail.com/new...head-of-downtown-relief-line/article10176582/

At least Brown has the sense to keep his mouth shut and not reveal how he hasn't a clue, not unlike some of his buddies...

So who has committed funding to building the Relief Line? Everyone it seems is on Wynne's case, and yet she has committed to funding the study on it. Brown is not on recored of even supporting that.

Please, by all means, if I've missed Brown's commitment to the planning study, let alone building the Relief Line, post it.
 
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steveintoronto said:
And here is Brown's statement on that:

http://www.ontariopc.com/News/Detai...ick-Brown-on-the-Scarborough-subway-extension

And where, exactly, is his commitment to funding? The man talks a lot, he says nothing, let alone makes any kind of commitment.
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.... An Ontario PC Government would stand up for the people of Scarborough and deliver the subway they need and deserve.”

It reads like a very strong statement in support to an already funded project. Thats all I know

steveintoronto said:
So you at least agree that Brown has stated nothing in the way of a commitment on the Relief Line?
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Too early to know where he stands here or debate something we dont know anything about. We'll surely find out further into the campaign.

steveintoronto said:
Which plan?
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The Done Mills plan - http://news.nationalpost.com/toront...ap-after-releasing-same-transit-plan-as-mayor


steveintoronto said:
So who has committed funding to building the Relief Line? Everyone it seems is on Wynne's case, and yet she has committed to funding the study on it. Brown is not on recored of even supporting that.
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Nothing wrong with pressure to get this funded. Also Tory may need the Liberals to support his entire plan from top to bottom if DoFo happens to run locally alongside Brown. Its important for Tory optically to get some verbal commitment before the election https://www.thestar.com/news/city_h...g-ford-vows-a-return-to-politics-in-2018.html

steveintoronto said:
Please, by all means, if I've missed Brown's commitment to the planning study, let alone building the Relief Line, post it.
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Again too early. We will all find out soon enough and any relevant Brown statement will surely be posted
 
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Tuck said:
The best fantasy, maybe.
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They're all pretty bad in retrospect. Some are worse than others. No wonder we ended up where we are now on this. The projected costs quoted were complete fantasy. And it continues under this Council and Mayor. Or it did, until the money tree died.
 
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