Toronto Monde | 149.95m | 44s | Great Gulf | Moshe Safdie

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I wonder how long before it feels like a neighbourhood. Aqualina will be fully moved into by this time next year, Monde will be partly moved into, Aquavista partly too? All three will need some retail open. I bet it will be summer 2019 before it hits a critical mass of lived-in-ness…

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interchange42 said:
I wonder how long before it feels like a neighbourhood. Aqualina will be fully moved into by this time next year, Monde will be partly moved into, Aquavista partly too? All three will need some retail open. I bet it will be summer 2019 before it hits a critical mass of lived-in-ness…

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For me, this area won't feel like a neighbourhood until the major roadworks of Lake Shore are complete, and of course only if they wind up being done in a legitimately urban way that significantly reduces the speed of motor vehicles and the width of pedestrian crossing distances.

To me, the built environment between the Gardiner and the lake along this stretch feels like it could be in any old suburb rather than at the heart of Canada's biggest city, and having what for all intents and purposes feels like a major highway running straight through the neighbourhood is a significant barrier to it actually feeling like a hospitable neighbourhood.
 
Agreed, but these first buildings are all east of where Harbour Street is being extended to anyway, so you'll see pretty much zero change to Lake Shore here. It's a rebuilt Queens Quay and its LRT that will really transform the streetscape here…

but I think the area is already going to feel lived-in (but by no means complete) long before that happens.

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interchange42 said:
Agreed, but these first buildings are all east of where Harbour Street is being extended to anyway, so you'll see pretty much zero change to Lake Shore here. It's a rebuilt Queens Quay and its LRT that will really transform the streetscape here…

but I think the area is already going to feel lived-in (but by no means complete) long before that happens.

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Whoops, yes, all my comments above were directed at QQ rather than the Lake Shore. Monday morning coffee hadn't kicked in.
 
ADRM said:
For me, this area won't feel like a neighbourhood until the major roadworks of Lake Shore are complete, and of course only if they wind up being done in a legitimately urban way that significantly reduces the speed of motor vehicles and the width of pedestrian crossing distances.

To me, the built environment between the Gardiner and the lake along this stretch feels like it could be in any old suburb rather than at the heart of Canada's biggest city, and having what for all intents and purposes feels like a major highway running straight through the neighbourhood is a significant barrier to it actually feeling like a hospitable neighbourhood.
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Yep, I agree. To me it's about: LRT, proper streetscaping, and buried hydro. Add people and this just feels like a proper part of the city.
 
Miscreant said:
Yep, I agree. To me it's about: LRT, proper streetscaping, and buried hydro. Add people and this just feels like a proper part of the city.
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Yep, though also worth noting that an LRT isn't a cure-all -- it has to be integrated well into a genuinely urban streetscape that slows down motor vehicles and prioritizes the safe and efficient movement of pedestrians. I'd like to see at least a couple more signalized intersections, narrowed vehicular lanes, 40km/h speed limit, reduced turning radii at intersections, and a whole bunch of greening and general beautification.
 
ADRM said:
Yep, though also worth noting that an LRT isn't a cure-all -- it has to be integrated well into a genuinely urban streetscape that slows down motor vehicles and prioritizes the safe and efficient movement of pedestrians. I'd like to see at least a couple more signalized intersections, narrowed vehicular lanes, 40km/h speed limit, reduced turning radii at intersections, and a whole bunch of greening and general beautification.
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All of which is in the plan for QQE which will be mirror of QQW. Of course, the question is when will it happen!
 
ADRM said:
Yep, though also worth noting that an LRT isn't a cure-all -- it has to be integrated well into a genuinely urban streetscape that slows down motor vehicles and prioritizes the safe and efficient movement of pedestrians. I'd like to see at least a couple more signalized intersections, narrowed vehicular lanes, 40km/h speed limit, reduced turning radii at intersections, and a whole bunch of greening and general beautification.
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Yep, me too. That's really what I meant generally by 'proper streetscaping.' Right now the area is an inchoate mess of messiness. It needs to be built properly.
 
Cant they not bury the LRT? which always looks ugly anywhere with the concrete right of way and the cluttered wires above, instead build an island between the roadways with trees, flowers, grass, fountains etc.:cool:...the city wants Rail Deck parks that they cant afford, well they might as well start here
 
Automation Gallery said:
Cant they not bury the LRT? which always looks ugly anywhere with the concrete right of way and the cluttered wires above, instead build an island between the roadways with trees, flowers, grass, fountains etc.:cool:...the city wants Rail Deck parks that they cant afford, well they might as well start here
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Hard no. I think above-ground transit is beautiful insofar as it signals that a city has risen above the pettiness of "subways, subways, subways."

Above-ground light rail is perfect for this stretch, though I'd love to see them utilize some new tools to make it look better than the other ROWs we have in the city.
 
junctionist said:
The current concrete design is neither aesthetically pleasing nor practical in terms of conveying that the ROW is off limits to novice and out-of-town drivers.
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The new one just up the road from this site between Corktown and the Distillery is the perfect example of this.
 
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