Toronto Lower Simcoe Ramp | ?m | ?s | City of Toronto

Please tell us how bike lanes and sidewalk are going to work at Simcoe St when the photo clearly shows no room for both??

Plans may say one thing, but on site info saids something different. I am going by what I see in person.
The plan is to have a shared bicycle/pedestrian path west of Bay street.
 
The plan is to have a shared bicycle/pedestrian path west of Bay street.
Based on my photo, how do you plan on doing that for the Simcoe area?? Go there in person and try to figure how you can fit both in the same narrow space.

Plans can be change anytime.
 
Based on my photo, how do you plan on doing that for the Simcoe area?? Go there in person and try to figure how you can fit both in the same narrow space.

Plans can be change anytime.
I understand your point. But I think there is enough space for a shared pedestrian/bicycle path. It will be narrow, but still better than what it was before. And I don't need to go there. I live there, and see it every day :)
 
I love cycle tracks/bike trails, but I'm stupefied by the decision to add this for a short block when we already have the MGT on Queen's Quay. Not sure what the logic was, here. The MGT is an excellent piece of infrastructure since the revitalization, people can easily just head up/down on York/Bay and either ride across on the street or walk their bike 30 seconds.

The MGT has been great, and really popular, and a place where commuting cyclists often clash with slower moving touring cyclists and pedestrians. Prior to the ramp coming down, there were already cyclists using the beat up old asphalt path parallel to Lake Shore and Harbour to avoid the crowds along the MGT. The City has recognized the need to put a cycle track on Lake Shore/Harbour as an alternative, and I am 99% certain that Drum is wrong: there is enough width beside the parking garage for both a sidewalk and cycle track: the two will share a 3-and-a-half to 4 metre wide corridor up against the garage.

Aug 13
As you can see in the photo looking east from Simcoe St, this is a very narrow area to the point you can't have a cycle lane.

I've copied Drum's two most relevant photos below.

You can easily see in the first one where the 4 metres can be found: at the middle bottom of the shot, and then continuing up, you have the future curb for the street, and the street to the north of that. The area—pretty much what's in shadow—to the south of the curb is the 4 metre right of way where the sidewalk and cycle track will run. Those pylons are each about a metre tall: knock'em over, and you can imagine the 4 metres there pretty easily.
36159812890_6e0c2bfe7f_b.jpg


It's harder to see in this image at the west end of the garage, but you've got to mentally remove the fence. There's about 2 metres to the south of it, and about a metre-and-a-half to the north of it. It's a bit more squished here, but it will still work.
36159806450_a95e75ef02_b.jpg



That pillar jutting out seems unnecessary given the new configuration. It also prevents them from moving the roadway to give enough sidewalk space next to the garage. That pinch point is going to be problem until they knock down the garage some day.

The pillar can be seen in the image above. They're putting one of the three new lanes to the north of it, and the other two to the south. With an earlier merge with Lake Shore traffic, drivers wanting to head north on York will be directed into that leftmost lane so they can make it into the left turn lane for York. The southern two lanes will be signed for Bay and Yonge.

Please tell us how bike lanes and sidewalk are going to work at Simcoe St when the photo clearly shows no room for both??

Plans may say one thing, but on site info saids something different. I am going by what I see in person.
The plans were drawn up by MMM Group (now part of WSP). They know what they're doing.

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The MGT has been great, and really popular, and a place where commuting cyclists often clash with slower moving touring cyclists and pedestrians. Prior to the ramp coming down, there were already cyclists using the beat up old asphalt path parallel to Lake Shore and Harbour to avoid the crowds along the MGT. The City has recognized the need to put a cycle track on Lake Shore/Harbour as an alternative, and I am 99% certain that Drum is wrong: there is enough width beside the parking garage for both a sidewalk and cycle track: the two will share a 3-and-a-half to 4 metre wide corridor up against the garage.

It's unfortunate the made the MGT so narrow. They should had took a page from Vancouver's seawall and make it wide enough for multi-users.
 
It's unfortunate the made the MGT so narrow. They should had took a page from Vancouver's seawall and make it wide enough for multi-users.
There is only so much space there—and as it's an area where there will be very few pedestrians, it should be fine for cycling through there.

(Now we just have to get the parking garage redeveloped, put underground with something more street friendly built above ground.

42
 
The MGT has been great, and really popular, and a place where commuting cyclists often clash with slower moving touring cyclists and pedestrians. Prior to the ramp coming down, there were already cyclists using the beat up old asphalt path parallel to Lake Shore and Harbour to avoid the crowds along the MGT. The City has recognized the need to put a cycle track on Lake Shore/Harbour as an alternative, and I am 99% certain that Drum is wrong: there is enough width beside the parking garage for both a sidewalk and cycle track: the two will share a 3-and-a-half to 4 metre wide corridor up against the garage.



I've copied Drum's two most relevant photos below.

You can easily see in the first one where the 4 metres can be found: at the middle bottom of the shot, and then continuing up, you have the future curb for the street, and the street to the north of that. The area—pretty much what's in shadow—to the south of the curb is the 4 metre right of way where the sidewalk and cycle track will run. Those pylons are each about a metre tall: knock'em over, and you can imagine the 4 metres there pretty easily.
36159812890_6e0c2bfe7f_b.jpg


It's harder to see in this image at the west end of the garage, but you've got to mentally remove the fence. There's about 2 metres to the south of it, and about a metre-and-a-half to the north of it. It's a bit more squished here, but it will still work.
36159806450_a95e75ef02_b.jpg





The pillar can be seen in the image above. They're putting one of the three new lanes to the north of it, and the other two to the south. With an earlier merge with Lake Shore traffic, drivers wanting to head north on York will be directed into that leftmost lane so they can make it into the left turn lane for York. The southern two lanes will be signed for Bay and Yonge.


The plans were drawn up by MMM Group (now part of WSP). They know what they're doing.

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Drum is wrong, there is enough space for a shared bicycle/pedestrian path between the parking garage and Simcoe St. Picture and opinions are often incorrect when one individual is creative/manipulative with a description of what is actually occurring in that area. Looking at the actual plans will always trump an inappropriate critic of what is or will be actual outcome.
 
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36159806450_a95e75ef02_b.jpg


The pillar can be seen in the image above. They're putting one of the three new lanes to the north of it, and the other two to the south. With an earlier merge with Lake Shore traffic, drivers wanting to head north on York will be directed into that leftmost lane so they can make it into the left turn lane for York. The southern two lanes will be signed for Bay and Yonge.

42

Had the now unnecessary pillar been moved, we wouldn’t be having this discussion. It would have allowed the road to be moved several metres north freeing up plenty of space for both a bike path and a wide sidewalk.

Ut5gs3n.jpg


That pillar and beam was only there to support the now removed overpass. It should have been replaced with a standard bent like the ones that can seen ahead of it.
 
It's the pedestrian shown walking on the bike trail in that rendering who represent what's wrong in that image, not the other way 'round. In the end, that's an area where there will be very few pedestrians: there's just about nothing to attract them to the blank wall of the garage. That area will be a cycle highway, and it should work just fine. Suggesting that cyclists should be on the round there is stupidity.

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It's the pedestrian shown walking on the bike trail in that rendering who represent what's wrong in that image, not the other way 'round. In the end, that's an area where there will be very few pedestrians: there's just about nothing to attract them to the blank wall of the garage. That area will be a cycle highway, and it should work just fine. Suggesting that cyclists should be on the round there is stupidity.

42
Why do we have to keep catering to people that want to ride bikes everywhere. We give them marked parts of roads but they still ride on the sidewalk. We give them a shared path and they ride like maniacs on it and want to ignore lights. They ignore crosswalk signals and give you a dirty look well they ring there bell at you. They have no respect for the pedestrians.
 

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