nfitz
Superstar
By definition, someone who is only a student is not qualified. Qualifications are what you get when you graduate. If you program is so poor that they have not made you aware of this, I'd be seeking a refund.
Toronto Lower Don Lands Redevelopment | ?m | ?s | Waterfront Toronto
adma
Superstar
"Hey! I won the big jackpot at Casino Niagara! Now what shall I do with this moolah...I know. I'll go to Harvard's Graduate School of Urban Planning and Design! That'll teach those lefty-pinko meanies who pick on me on urban message boards!"
Marko
Active Member
I haven't agreed with much that StCatharinesCitizen has posted, and have my doubts about the whole Harvard thing - but the sneering that you guys are engaging in more or less negates any positive arguments you're trying to make. It's embarrassing, really, the way the group think manifests itself among the spoiled, self righteous blowhards on here.
current
Active Member
Here is a site plan for the Ford's vision for the Port Lands. Toronto Star article:
Waterfront Plan is Not Doug Ford's . . . Yet
Robyn Doolittle
Urban Affairs Reporter
Sept 3 2011
In Waterfront Toronto's vision for the Port Lands, the most valuable acres of real estate would be used to build a man-made river and park space, which would protect Toronto's southeastern shores from flooding in a major storm.
But why not put flood protection on less desirable land?
“That's the kind of analysis people have been doing . . . (and) one of the concerns that was raised,†said architect Mark Sterling, who was hired by the Toronto Port Lands Company about two months ago to explore alternatives to that vision.
Added Eva Varangu, a spokesperson TPLC: “That land is very valuable and there's been a lot of interest. There's not going to be a new waterfront in Toronto. What we have is what we've got. We've got to do it right.â€
A week ago it was revealed the city had plans to seize back control of the Port Lands — Toronto's industrial shoreline southeast of the Don Valley Parkway — from Waterfront Toronto.
The debate about that decision immediately focused on Councillor Doug Ford, who this week told reporters he wanted to see the area turned into a commercial tourism hot spot, with a monorail, the world's largest ferris wheel, a megamall and Venice-inspired waterfront hotel.
Ford said the plans were “very preliminary†and it was not clear whether physical work had been done to make his vision a reality. But because the councillor is the mayor's brother, one of his closest advisers, and an occasional spokesperson for the administration, Ford's comments weren't taken lightly.
Mid-week it was revealed that the Toronto Port Lands officials had seen early renderings, sparking more speculation that Ford had been quietly working behind the scenes on a new direction.
Councillor Paula Fletcher blasted the mayor's brother for bringing back an era of “backroom†deals. On Friday, talk show host John Tory, a former leader of the Ontario Progressive Conservative party and highly respected by the Fords, questioned the judgment of throwing out Waterfront Toronto's council-approved vision, which after years of work was finally ready to be implemented.
“Let's be careful about this because a lot of work has been put into where we are now,†said Tory, speaking in his role as chair of the CivicAction alliance. “It's always fine to review things you've done and make sure you're doing the right thing, but I really think any plan . . . should be subject to transparent, thoughtful and open review.â€....
Read More: http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1048988--waterfront-plan-is-not-doug-ford-s-yet?bn=1
Waterfront Plan is Not Doug Ford's . . . Yet
Robyn Doolittle
Urban Affairs Reporter
Sept 3 2011
In Waterfront Toronto's vision for the Port Lands, the most valuable acres of real estate would be used to build a man-made river and park space, which would protect Toronto's southeastern shores from flooding in a major storm.
But why not put flood protection on less desirable land?
“That's the kind of analysis people have been doing . . . (and) one of the concerns that was raised,†said architect Mark Sterling, who was hired by the Toronto Port Lands Company about two months ago to explore alternatives to that vision.
Added Eva Varangu, a spokesperson TPLC: “That land is very valuable and there's been a lot of interest. There's not going to be a new waterfront in Toronto. What we have is what we've got. We've got to do it right.â€
A week ago it was revealed the city had plans to seize back control of the Port Lands — Toronto's industrial shoreline southeast of the Don Valley Parkway — from Waterfront Toronto.
The debate about that decision immediately focused on Councillor Doug Ford, who this week told reporters he wanted to see the area turned into a commercial tourism hot spot, with a monorail, the world's largest ferris wheel, a megamall and Venice-inspired waterfront hotel.
Ford said the plans were “very preliminary†and it was not clear whether physical work had been done to make his vision a reality. But because the councillor is the mayor's brother, one of his closest advisers, and an occasional spokesperson for the administration, Ford's comments weren't taken lightly.
Mid-week it was revealed that the Toronto Port Lands officials had seen early renderings, sparking more speculation that Ford had been quietly working behind the scenes on a new direction.
Councillor Paula Fletcher blasted the mayor's brother for bringing back an era of “backroom†deals. On Friday, talk show host John Tory, a former leader of the Ontario Progressive Conservative party and highly respected by the Fords, questioned the judgment of throwing out Waterfront Toronto's council-approved vision, which after years of work was finally ready to be implemented.
“Let's be careful about this because a lot of work has been put into where we are now,†said Tory, speaking in his role as chair of the CivicAction alliance. “It's always fine to review things you've done and make sure you're doing the right thing, but I really think any plan . . . should be subject to transparent, thoughtful and open review.â€....
Read More: http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1048988--waterfront-plan-is-not-doug-ford-s-yet?bn=1
Marko
Active Member
Another key quote:
These are the first genuine Ford plans released and they do seem to retain a lot of park land and flood plain, while maintaining the highly desired mix of housing, retail and public space. That a mall might be in the center of it doesn't have to be a bad thing if executed properly. It doesn't look like it's anywhere close to the lake itself and there doesn't appear to be an expanse of parking lots around the mall either.
We need to see what sort of street grid they have in mind, rather than just colored area descriptions.
It would be nice if the Events Quay somehow emulated Pritzker in Chicago, in terms of some redeeming architecture and public event/gathering space.
I don't think the Ford's care about the actual architecture itself and seem content to let those who know better influence that (ie: Sterling and Kuhne), they just want to get it moving more than anything else, and are willing to include feature elements that help finance it.
Still not a fan of the ferris wheel, but the islanders will be happy that it basically eliminates the noise from the Docks.
These are the first genuine Ford plans released and they do seem to retain a lot of park land and flood plain, while maintaining the highly desired mix of housing, retail and public space. That a mall might be in the center of it doesn't have to be a bad thing if executed properly. It doesn't look like it's anywhere close to the lake itself and there doesn't appear to be an expanse of parking lots around the mall either.
We need to see what sort of street grid they have in mind, rather than just colored area descriptions.
It would be nice if the Events Quay somehow emulated Pritzker in Chicago, in terms of some redeeming architecture and public event/gathering space.
I don't think the Ford's care about the actual architecture itself and seem content to let those who know better influence that (ie: Sterling and Kuhne), they just want to get it moving more than anything else, and are willing to include feature elements that help finance it.
Still not a fan of the ferris wheel, but the islanders will be happy that it basically eliminates the noise from the Docks.
CanadianNational
Senior Member
It doesn't look any more easy to start and make safely operational than the existing Waterfront Toronto plan.
The initial main differences seem to be that the northern end of the Portlands area wouldn't be sculpted to resemble an island, and the Don River mouth will not be naturalized south -westward to flow into the lake. That would seem to entail that flood protection will still have to be done in the section they want to build up, and the soil there would still have to be decontaminated.
On the surface, the city would lose a city-view park and gain an 'events plaza' with a giant wheel between it and the lake - a space, one conjectures, that will be not unlike the Exhibition Grounds. The plan above also would gain space for proposed cafes and such around the entrance to the shipping channel. It proposes a huge amount of boardwalk from the Lake to the Cement Campus and back, which seems unlikely.
Although the big grey-blue expanse the mall will sit on, straddling the road, is slated for 'high density residential', it does look remarkably like a mall in a parking lot in the diagram. It would probably be so, as the mall would need parking, monorail not withstanding. It's likely that towers would be added gradually, much like the ones going in at Sherway Gardens.
The Hearn Ice Palace sounds final. It looks like our minds are being made up for us regarding just what Hearn is for, without consultation or variation. The diagram seems to show it floating in a giant square. Parking.
Regardless, this part should be exhibit A regarding Ford's ties to his developer friend in Vaughan who holds the contract for the property.
Gains:
A big mall.
A flat park running through the Portlands.
A definitive narrow use for Hearn.
A ferris wheel.
A blank plaza.
A greener Keating Channel.
A lengthy boardwalk
A narrow strip of stores and restaurants.
One, if not two, major parking lots.
A monorail?
Losses:
A major city park with unimpeded views of the harbour.
A naturalized Don River mouth with attendant wetlands, ecological benefits and topological interest, with thorough, lasting flood protection.
An urbanized Keating Channel, lined with stores and restaurants and a boardwalk.
Urban neighbourhood scale mixed-use development north and south of the new Don River Mouth.
A variety of attractions at a refurbished Hearn that would appeal to the whole city - or, major new attractions there that might function as a tourist draw.
Comprehensive, flexible ground transit additions to the TTC.
Improved bridge connections from the portlands to the city.
Possibly improved cycling connections.
The initial main differences seem to be that the northern end of the Portlands area wouldn't be sculpted to resemble an island, and the Don River mouth will not be naturalized south -westward to flow into the lake. That would seem to entail that flood protection will still have to be done in the section they want to build up, and the soil there would still have to be decontaminated.
On the surface, the city would lose a city-view park and gain an 'events plaza' with a giant wheel between it and the lake - a space, one conjectures, that will be not unlike the Exhibition Grounds. The plan above also would gain space for proposed cafes and such around the entrance to the shipping channel. It proposes a huge amount of boardwalk from the Lake to the Cement Campus and back, which seems unlikely.
Although the big grey-blue expanse the mall will sit on, straddling the road, is slated for 'high density residential', it does look remarkably like a mall in a parking lot in the diagram. It would probably be so, as the mall would need parking, monorail not withstanding. It's likely that towers would be added gradually, much like the ones going in at Sherway Gardens.
The Hearn Ice Palace sounds final. It looks like our minds are being made up for us regarding just what Hearn is for, without consultation or variation. The diagram seems to show it floating in a giant square. Parking.
Regardless, this part should be exhibit A regarding Ford's ties to his developer friend in Vaughan who holds the contract for the property.
Gains:
A big mall.
A flat park running through the Portlands.
A definitive narrow use for Hearn.
A ferris wheel.
A blank plaza.
A greener Keating Channel.
A lengthy boardwalk
A narrow strip of stores and restaurants.
One, if not two, major parking lots.
A monorail?
Losses:
A major city park with unimpeded views of the harbour.
A naturalized Don River mouth with attendant wetlands, ecological benefits and topological interest, with thorough, lasting flood protection.
An urbanized Keating Channel, lined with stores and restaurants and a boardwalk.
Urban neighbourhood scale mixed-use development north and south of the new Don River Mouth.
A variety of attractions at a refurbished Hearn that would appeal to the whole city - or, major new attractions there that might function as a tourist draw.
Comprehensive, flexible ground transit additions to the TTC.
Improved bridge connections from the portlands to the city.
Possibly improved cycling connections.
nfitz
Superstar
It's embarrassing that some have nothing left but name-calling left when they know they are wrong.
jaycola
Active Member
Don't worry about what Ford says about this site. The land mass here is huge. Really really huge.
Ford, in his soon to be short administration, will have little impact on this piece of land.
I don't see that his plan is fully zoned and you can't tell me developers are going to build crap housing in shitty neighbourhoods because Ford, who knows nothing about urban planning says he wan't to rebuild Regent Park, the developers won't build it.
So the brothers ford want a monorail? Who cares? This is not simply "I wish it so, so let it be done". If a mono rail makes economic sence, look at the proposal. Maybe if you ask Ford for a crosstown monorail, tell him how sparkly it will be, you'll get your Downtown Relief line.
Urban planners will have their hands over this site for decades to come. Ford could barely mar this site.
If he can do anything to kickstart development there, all the better. If there are projects that could be in the pipeline in short order, give them priority.
On the Ice Palace at the Hearn, who says there won't me mixed developments along the chanels? Where in the Ford plan does it say Ice only? We need the ice space and this could be an Iconic sports facility for the city.
Maybe the Mall will be a bright open space with shops on the street scape. Maybe it will have a community componant, a community centre or outdoor theatre. Why hate an idea because it's called a mall.
This is earliest discussion phase only. It's not like ford will be down at city hall handing out building permits. If you are concerned about grift by Ford or his administration, keep an eye on the dealings of individuals.
Have a look at the size of the Portland site.
http://g.co/maps/zcg7 Google map
Ford, in his soon to be short administration, will have little impact on this piece of land.
I don't see that his plan is fully zoned and you can't tell me developers are going to build crap housing in shitty neighbourhoods because Ford, who knows nothing about urban planning says he wan't to rebuild Regent Park, the developers won't build it.
So the brothers ford want a monorail? Who cares? This is not simply "I wish it so, so let it be done". If a mono rail makes economic sence, look at the proposal. Maybe if you ask Ford for a crosstown monorail, tell him how sparkly it will be, you'll get your Downtown Relief line.
Urban planners will have their hands over this site for decades to come. Ford could barely mar this site.
If he can do anything to kickstart development there, all the better. If there are projects that could be in the pipeline in short order, give them priority.
On the Ice Palace at the Hearn, who says there won't me mixed developments along the chanels? Where in the Ford plan does it say Ice only? We need the ice space and this could be an Iconic sports facility for the city.
Maybe the Mall will be a bright open space with shops on the street scape. Maybe it will have a community componant, a community centre or outdoor theatre. Why hate an idea because it's called a mall.
This is earliest discussion phase only. It's not like ford will be down at city hall handing out building permits. If you are concerned about grift by Ford or his administration, keep an eye on the dealings of individuals.
Have a look at the size of the Portland site.
http://g.co/maps/zcg7 Google map
W. K. Lis
Superstar
And if someone quits university without graduating, they are also not qualified. BTW, Rob Ford quit Carleton University where he took political science courses, he actually left school two credits short of graduating. I guess that makes him unqualified as well.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
Any Ferris wheel belongs at Exhibition Place or Ontario Place. And since city council already approved in principle a hotel in Exhibition Place, are we now going to burn up those plans?
nfitz
Superstar
He said he left 2 credits short of graduating. But remember, when the media looked into it, Rob Ford attended Carlton only for 1989-1990 but Rob Ford dropped out after the first year - with no indication he'd passed the first year. It was later revealed that Rob Ford took six first-year courses at York in 1990-1991, and failed to complete them all.
So the 2 credits short of graduation, actually means Rob Ford dropped out of 1st Year at both Carlton and then York.
It's stuff like this that makes my head spin. In any real job, if you fake your resume like this you get fired, not promoted.
ibhattac
New Member
I think, as a planner, the concern is more about what they intend to do with the mouth of the Don, more than any concern about a seasonal attraction in this part of the City, though, that too is a concern.
The stories about TEDCO's (the previous name of the TPLC/Build Toronto/Invest Toronto) stonewalling when it came to the waterfront, thus leading to the necessity of Waterfront Toronto are a dime a dozen in my professional circles.
To me, this whole thing doesn't really add up - something else is going on.
Torontovibe
Senior Member
You got that WRONG! Ford did not even finish his first year at university. His original story was he was a few credits short of graduating but then when the media checked into it, and found out the truth, he admitted, that he left the university in his first year. Did he drop out or was it the university that asked him to leave? Ford claims he took a few more university courses, after he returned to Toronto.
So please stop spreading misinformation that Ford almost graduated, when that's just not true.
^^ Whoops, sorry, I did not see the above posting before I wrote this.
Last edited:
Torontovibe
Senior Member
Ontario Place would be a much better place for a ferris wheel just due to the beauty of the area. There is a lot more to see out there but it is still a fair distance from the downtown core, which is what most people would want to look at. The CN Tower is the best location for viewing the whole city. I like to be right over top of the buildings.
adma
Superstar
But you see, Rob Ford was elected by the constituents, not appointed (or fired/disallowed) by some pointy-headed higher authorities. The lumpen have spoken.
...Readin'...nope
...Writin'...nope
...'Rithmatic...nope
...FINGERPAINTIN', MAN! That's what we need!
And so, you see, the masses have spoke. Fingerpainting rules the day.