MrGoose
Active Member
Why wasn't the Leslie Station grade separated?
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H4F33Z
Active Member
Cost issues. They were planning to actually scrap Leslie Station. but the councillor and residents voice, it was negotiated to just a surface stop.
Allandale25
Senior Member
Midtown Urbanist
Superstar
Just me or do none of these look anywhere close to completion?
rbt
Senior Member
They're not going to hit the original 2020 date, that's for sure.
Opening 2022 (current target) doesn't seem unreasonable; though I expect Yonge/Eglinton station will still have some work ongoing in 2024.
robmausser
Senior Member
While I think transit planners should push for this to be changed, bureaucratically right now as it stands, its out of their hands.
Signal priority is determined by the department of Traffic Systems Operations in Toronto, and they are a very old school pro-car crowd of people.
What needs to happen is that signal priority needs to be handed off to a third party in the city that decides based upon empirical evidence of whats best for all transit users.
hw621
Senior Member
Which means this bunch of people will lose their power, budget and even their jobs...
robmausser
Senior Member
It will only change when the "pre-2000's Toronto" boomers who run this city die.
They are part of a group that understand Toronto from the context of when we used to cheers to the Queen when we drank at bars on the Esplanade. When parking lots filled the city. When Dundas Square was nothing more than a bunch of clothing stores. Not the megacity we are today.
Their Toronto is long but dead but they desperately hold onto these old ways.
robmausser
Senior Member
Bunching in the tunnel at Laird, here we come!!
H4F33Z
Active Member
I have a feeling that Leslie will become grade seperated in the 2030s. Not just because of the intersection itself but also because it would much more reasonable to short-turn vehicles at Don Mills (Science Centre). Also with OL and RLN. It's kind of a necessity.
I never thought a city-changing LRT costing billions of dollars is actually being held up by the cars who we thought that LRT's were supposed to have priority over
I never thought a city-changing LRT costing billions of dollars is actually being held up by the cars who we thought that LRT's were supposed to have priority over
crs1026
Superstar
They sure don't look like they were at a point two years ago, or a year ago, that would have allowed anyone to say confidently that the project would finish on time. Yet, that's what everyone - ML, last government's politicians, and this government's politicians - all said.
I wonder how long ago they first realised that the target date wouldn't be met.
I'm not surprised by any of the delays. In the context of a project of this size, delays and schedule slippage is to be expected. Crosstown hasn't had the kind of huge halts - construction worker fatalities, or technical showstoppers, or rework - that would imply bad management.
To me, the lesson learned is that any future transit project in this city must have an oversight/audit office that is beyond arms length from both the project sponsor and the politicians. That office has to have access to every bit of data and have a mandate to report publicly on project status - spending, work completion, and work targets - without influence from politicians or project management. Kind of a super-Auditor General, super-SIU kind of role.
The issue is truthfulness. There has been none of that on this project.
- Paul
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sche
Active Member
Here's a proposal for grade separating Brentcliffe to Don Mills:
It looks like there is enough space to move all of Eglinton north of the LRT tracks without moving the tracks, which could probably be built without interrupting LRT service. I think this could probably be cheaper than regrading Eglinton, since that would probably require building a taller bridge over the Don. The existing eastbound lanes could become a sidewalk and a two way cycle track (probably the most generously sized in the city, this would allow the Eglinton on the north side to be slightly less wide and thus cheaper).
Brentcliffe Portal (this one is quite a bit of a squeeze - we would probably need a big retaining wall on the north side. But, I think there's probably enough space to fit four car lanes and a narrow sidewalk on the north side (which isn't that necessary actually, given the sidewalk on the south side, so this could probably be eliminated).
Red = road, Green = cycle track + sidewalk on south side
Leslie:
Red = road, Green = cycle track + sidewalk on south side, yellow = pedestrian bridge (If we need full grade separation for ATC, then this is probably necessary), blue = stairs
The bridge over the Don would need widening and I also included a better accessible connection to ET Seton Park. The CP bridge would also need to be lengthened; this could probably be done by building a new bridge east of the existing one
Finally, the Celestica interchange would be replaced with a normal intersection, and the rest is pretty simple:
It looks like there is enough space to move all of Eglinton north of the LRT tracks without moving the tracks, which could probably be built without interrupting LRT service. I think this could probably be cheaper than regrading Eglinton, since that would probably require building a taller bridge over the Don. The existing eastbound lanes could become a sidewalk and a two way cycle track (probably the most generously sized in the city, this would allow the Eglinton on the north side to be slightly less wide and thus cheaper).
Brentcliffe Portal (this one is quite a bit of a squeeze - we would probably need a big retaining wall on the north side. But, I think there's probably enough space to fit four car lanes and a narrow sidewalk on the north side (which isn't that necessary actually, given the sidewalk on the south side, so this could probably be eliminated).
Red = road, Green = cycle track + sidewalk on south side
Leslie:
Red = road, Green = cycle track + sidewalk on south side, yellow = pedestrian bridge (If we need full grade separation for ATC, then this is probably necessary), blue = stairs
The bridge over the Don would need widening and I also included a better accessible connection to ET Seton Park. The CP bridge would also need to be lengthened; this could probably be done by building a new bridge east of the existing one
Finally, the Celestica interchange would be replaced with a normal intersection, and the rest is pretty simple:
CapitalSeven
Senior Member
I made this crude mock-up in Paint 7 years ago, probably for this thread. Everyone ignored it then. Here it is to ignore again. Grade separate the traffic, not the transit. Then add in the station with a simple crosswalk.
Voltz
Senior Member
I like the idea
44 North
Senior Member
A bit of a de-urbanization approach. But by golly it gets the job done.