Toronto Eglinton Line 5 Crosstown West Extension | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx

Steve X said:
The more interesting thing is that the LRT is planned for 60-80 km/h operation at some points. In the noise modelling (Appendix D), we can see that Martin Grove to the portal east of Royal York is planned for 80 km/h while Renforth to Martin Grove and the elevated section from the portal to Mt Dennis is planned for 60 km/h.

It's also interested to note 3 special tracks are indicated at 3 stations, presumably a crossover at Martin Grove, storage track at Kipling and another crossover at Royal York.
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The infrastructure being designed to support those speeds doesn’t actually mean it ever will see those speeds in revenue service. The 1954 Yonge Line is designed to be capable of 80 km/h+ operation and 90 second headways, yet we obviously never see those performance characteristics in revenue service.

Specifically, the numbers you cited appear to be a reasonable worst case scenario for noise and vibration mitigation planning, rather than an actual service plan.

Also, the absolute maximum speed the Flexity Freedom is capable of is 80 km/h. Consistently running equipment at its top speed can induce more ware and tare, so I’d expect actual maximum operational speeds to be substantially slower than that. That’s why TTC operators are generally prohibited from running trains at speeds greater than 60 km/h
 
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TheTigerMaster said:
The infrastructure being designed to support those speeds doesn’t actually mean it ever will see those speeds in revenue service. The 1954 Yonge Line is designed to be capable of 80 km/h+ operation and 90 second headways, yet we obviously never see those performance characteristics in revenue service.

Specifically, the numbers you cited appear to be a reasonable worst case scenario for noise and vibration mitigation planning, rather than an actual service plan.

Also, the absolute maximum speed the Flexity Freedom is capable of is 80 km/h. Consistently running equipment at its top speed can induce more ware and tare, so I’d expect actual maximum operational speeds to be substantially slower than that. That’s why TTC operators are generally prohibited from running trains at speeds greater than 60 km/h
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Trains on Line 2 used to reach 80 km/h in a couple of spots. Whether the still do or not might depend of extended trip time.

Many systems do reach 80 km/h if not 100 km/h. For Toronto to say standard operating practices is too expensive and stick with some non-world class operation is absurd.
 
Steve X said:
Trains on Line 2 used to reach 80 km/h in a couple of spots. Whether the still do or not might depend of extended trip time.

Many systems do reach 80 km/h if not 100 km/h. For Toronto to say standard operating practices is too expensive and stick with some non-world class operation is absurd.
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The reduced speeds likely were requested by bureaucrats and politicians who don't use public transit (except for photo ops).
 
TheTigerMaster said:
In theory you're correct, but in practice, I wouldn't expect to see trains running at 80 km/h+ at any point in the network. If my memory serves me correctly, the fastest point on the subway network is on Yonge southbound between Sheppard and Eglinton, and in that segment the trains never operate faster than 60 km/h, even though the equipment is technically capable of faster operations.
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Trains regularly travel faster than 60km/h at many different places on the subway network. Trains regularly achieve speeds in excess of 70km/h on the sections north of Eglinton Station.

Dan
 
Coolstar said:
The western portion isn't entirely tunnelled. Remember it's elevated from east of Jane to west of Scarlett in order to cross the Humber River.
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And it should be at-grade/elevated West of Martin Grove. You can debate on the merits of tunneling the section from Scarlett to Martin Grove, but the tunnelled portion from Martin Grove to near Renforth is absurd.
 
robmausser said:
And it should be at-grade/elevated West of Martin Grove. You can debate on the merits of tunneling the section from Scarlett to Martin Grove, but the tunnelled portion from Martin Grove to near Renforth is absurd.
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You would think that it would make the most sense to tunnel to just past the 401/427/Eglinton spaghetti junction and travel at-grade or elevated on the north side of Eglinton, but I'm unsure about whether there would be enough space for a launch/extraction shaft between Eglinton and the highway. From a quick look on Google Maps it looks like there should be space right around here but I'm not sure what kind of clearances are needed, although based on where the launch shafts were for the Crosstown, this should be more than enough space.
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LeanMeanMemeMachine said:
You would think that it would make the most sense to tunnel to just past the 401/427/Eglinton spaghetti junction and travel at-grade or elevated on the north side of Eglinton, but I'm unsure about whether there would be enough space for a launch/extraction shaft between Eglinton and the highway. From a quick look on Google Maps it looks like there should be space right around here but I'm not sure what kind of clearances are needed, although based on where the launch shafts were for the Crosstown, this should be more than enough space.
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I think they should just close Eglinton West of The East Mall, and run the LRT there instead at grade. There is no point for that road to exist in my opinion, it barely services anything.
 
robmausser said:
I think they should just close Eglinton West of The East Mall, and run the LRT there instead at grade. There is no point for that road to exist in my opinion, it barely services anything.
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Eglinton Avenue West in the vicinity of Pearson Airport is an alternative route for motorists to use in case of construction, collisions, and non-rush hour traffic congestion. If you use Waze, it'll use Eglinton Avenue West, except if there is traffic congestion during the rush hours. Avoid the Eglinton and Martin Grove intersection during the rush hours.
 
Eglinton Ave literally serves a purpose so that Eglinton can be continuous between Toronto and Mississauga.
Otherwise, there's no way to get from one part of Eglinton to the other part, without a large detour.

The nearest connection between the two parts would be via Dixon Rd, Carlingview and Renforth, a 6km detour.
 
robmausser said:
And it should be at-grade/elevated West of Martin Grove. You can debate on the merits of tunneling the section from Scarlett to Martin Grove, but the tunnelled portion from Martin Grove to near Renforth is absurd.
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As I mention before, there is no good place to start tunneling around the Martin Grove/Eg area. That intersection should not be at-grade as it's the worst intersection on this extension. It cannot be elevated without relocating the hydro corridor. That only leaves a shallow underground station as the only option if the launch shaft is east of Martin Grove along with a possible rerouting of Mimico Creek.

An elevated alignment would be interesting as it would have to cross a number of major highways (highway 27, 401W>427S, 427N>401E, 427N and 427S). Lane closures and access would be challenging.

The at-grade option remains the easiest but Eglinton might not be wide enough for additional lanes and maintaining the bike trail.

Considering how busy traffic is around this area, this is certainly going to delay construction by months as it would be very difficult to get things in and out of the site. The Renforth site is way better for long term construction.
LeanMeanMemeMachine said:
You would think that it would make the most sense to tunnel to just past the 401/427/Eglinton spaghetti junction and travel at-grade or elevated on the north side of Eglinton, but I'm unsure about whether there would be enough space for a launch/extraction shaft between Eglinton and the highway. From a quick look on Google Maps it looks like there should be space right around here but I'm not sure what kind of clearances are needed, although based on where the launch shafts were for the Crosstown, this should be more than enough space.
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That 427 southbound lanes is a real bottleneck in afternoon rush. They certain can't close any lanes there making that area a challenge.
 
Eglinton Avenue West, west of Marting Grove Avenue and east of The East Mall, is in a flood plain. Expect the use of sump pumps in any of the tunnels under Mimico Creek.

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From link.

The image shows that Highway 27 would be flooded under Highway 401, as well as the Eglinton West 401/427 access ramps, in a "Hurricane Hazel" scenario.
 
W. K. Lis said:
Eglinton Avenue West, west of Marting Grove Avenue and east of The East Mall, is in a flood plain. Expect the use of sump pumps in any of the tunnels under Mimico Creek.

View attachment 251956
From link.

The image shows that Highway 27 would be flooded under Highway 401, as well as the Eglinton West 401/427 access ramps, in a "Hurricane Hazel" scenario.
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A floodway could have been built along the hydro corridor parallel to Willowridge Road from the 401 to Eglinton just east of Mimico Creek as well.
 
Steve Munro reviewed the latest IO report.

Eglinton Crosstown
The main part of the Crosstown project is already under construction and, therefore, it does not appear in the IO project list.

On the proposed western extension, the tunnel portion has become a separate contract as with the Scarborough extension. It is now in the RFQ stage with the intent of the RFP issuing in Summer 2020 and financial close in Spring 2021. The fact that this work is already “in market” shows that the government has no intention of entertaining any option for surface operations through much of Etobicoke.

There is no date even for an RFQ let alone actual construction of the extension.
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Considering the EA is already completed, this project is the most progressive and closer to shovel ready than the other 3.
 
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