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Toronto Crosstown LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | Arcadis

BurlOak said:
I do not understand the need for 3 tracks. They have been telling us for the longest time the ridership is so light on this line that there would never be a need for anything close to subway service. Is there an actual ridership number that they gave to warrent this layout? The YUS and B-D line have short-turns all the time for lines that is running near capacity, and it can be done with 2 tracks. Why the extra track here?
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They have also been saying for the longest time that ridership in the mid-town tunnelled section is going to be twice as high or more than the above-ground section to the east. The plan since day one is that half of the trains will turn back at Don Mills.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
smallspy said:
They have also been saying for the longest time that ridership in the mid-town tunnelled section is going to be twice as high or more than the above-ground section to the east. The plan since day one is that half of the trains will turn back at Don Mills.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
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And I would assume that a similar situation would exist in the west once the line is extended there, hence my suggestion of 'mirroring' the terminus stations.
 
GenerationW said:
They touched on this, and basically said a DRL hitting Eglinton was so far into the future that it wasn't an issue.
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Considering they somehow failed to notice the development east of Brentcliffe that's been advertised for YEARS even with the LRT in their on street ads I wouldn't put much faith in their ability to plan for the future.
 
Last edited:
W. K. Lis said:
The Mount Dennis Mobility Hub Study is now available for viewing at this link.

You can download the PDF presentation at this link (93 pages).



The Keele Street to Jane Section and Black Creek Maintenance & Storage Facility Environmental Project Report Addendum Online Consultation is also now available for viewing at this link.

You can download the 2012 − New Proposed Plan/Profile in PDF at this link.

You can also download the PDF presentation (20 pages) at this link.
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Thanks for posting these.

They just keep making this project better and better. My two biggest beefs with the central section of the line have been resolved. Not very much that I would change now from Mount Dennis to Don Mills (other than actually taking into account the DRL in the layout of Don Mills Station).

Now if they can focus on doing something about the eastern section of the line, especially considering that the Auditor General's report on the Metrolinx MOU concluded that they agreed that at-grade portions of the line would affect the reliability of the entire line, and thus the line should be separated from traffic.

I still think there's time to float the idea of the City paying the cost difference and elevating the east portion of the line through the Golden Mile, especially if that means they can run the ECLRT and the SLRT as a single thru-line.
 
gweed123 said:
Thanks for posting these.

They just keep making this project better and better. My two biggest beefs with the central section of the line have been resolved. Not very much that I would change now from Mount Dennis to Don Mills (other than actually taking into account the DRL in the layout of Don Mills Station).

Now if they can focus on doing something about the eastern section of the line, especially considering that the Auditor General's report on the Metrolinx MOU concluded that they agreed that at-grade portions of the line would affect the reliability of the entire line, and thus the line should be separated from traffic.

I still think there's time to float the idea of the City paying the cost difference and elevating the east portion of the line through the Golden Mile, especially if that means they can run the ECLRT and the SLRT as a single thru-line.
Click to expand...

They are actually trying to make this work. I wish the connection to the airport was being built now.
 
gweed123 said:
Thanks for posting these.

They just keep making this project better and better. My two biggest beefs with the central section of the line have been resolved. Not very much that I would change now from Mount Dennis to Don Mills (other than actually taking into account the DRL in the layout of Don Mills Station).

Now if they can focus on doing something about the eastern section of the line, especially considering that the Auditor General's report on the Metrolinx MOU concluded that they agreed that at-grade portions of the line would affect the reliability of the entire line, and thus the line should be separated from traffic.

I still think there's time to float the idea of the City paying the cost difference and elevating the east portion of the line through the Golden Mile, especially if that means they can run the ECLRT and the SLRT as a single thru-line.
Click to expand...

They are actually trying to make this work. I wish the connection to the airport was being built now.
 
Slowly but surely, this line is getting 100% grade separated. With Miller out of the picture who absolutely wanted the LRT on the streets, they aren't going to meet any opposition to make it a "metro" line.

I like that Metrolinx seems to LISTEN to the population while Miller and Giambrone wouldn't listen to anyone to protect their pet project.

Now that the line is separated between Black Creek and Don Mills as well as Kennedy to McCowen and Sheppard. I don't even need the portion between Kennedy and Don Mills underground, just elevate it.

A mayor candidate promising to:

-pay the difference to elevate the Scarborough section like the Skytrain (will win over many in Scarborough)
-Announcing that the Eglinton-Scarborough Crosstown will add over 20Km (Light Metro) to the current Subway network
-Black Creek to Sheppard East Station under 40 minutes "Unifying" the city

That would get my vote!!!!!

PS:
They could just use some of the Billion dollar from Sheppard East LRT to help pay to elevate Eglinton.
Personally I would use the balance to extend Sheppard to Victoria Park then BRT from there.
 
could they not simply reduce the above ground stop spacing and make it interlined with the SRT? In the east elevated stops would be Sloane, Victoria Park, Pharmacy, Warden, Birchmount, Kennedy. That should allow for speeds fast enough that it can interline?
 
sixrings said:
could they not simply reduce the above ground stop spacing and make it interlined with the SRT? In the east elevated stops would be Sloane, Victoria Park, Pharmacy, Warden, Birchmount, Kennedy. That should allow for speeds fast enough that it can interline?
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Victoria Park and Pharmacy should just be one station; put it east of Victoria Park, then it serves both streets.
 
Solid Snake said:
Slowly but surely, this line is getting 100% grade separated. With Miller out of the picture who absolutely wanted the LRT on the streets, they aren't going to meet any opposition to make it a "metro" line.

I like that Metrolinx seems to LISTEN to the population while Miller and Giambrone wouldn't listen to anyone to protect their pet project.

Now that the line is separated between Black Creek and Don Mills as well as Kennedy to McCowen and Sheppard. I don't even need the portion between Kennedy and Don Mills underground, just elevate it.

A mayor candidate promising to:

-pay the difference to elevate the Scarborough section like the Skytrain (will win over many in Scarborough)
-Announcing that the Eglinton-Scarborough Crosstown will add over 20Km (Light Metro) to the current Subway network
-Black Creek to Sheppard East Station under 40 minutes "Unifying" the city

That would get my vote!!!!!

PS:
They could just use some of the Billion dollar from Sheppard East LRT to help pay to elevate Eglinton.
Personally I would use the balance to extend Sheppard to Victoria Park then BRT from there.
Click to expand...

Wouldn't count on it. The money would be much better spent on other projects and the benefit of doing this is minimal at best. The line will undoubtedly be 100% grade separated in 30 years, but right now this is the best arrangement IMO. I'd much rather spend the few hundred million on the DRL. We both probably agree with each other on this. If you don't agree I'd be fascinated to hear how you think this is more worthy of funding than the DRL.

Now one way that there could be 100% grade separation is if the City of Toronto picked up the difference for grade separation and Metrolinx fully funded the Downtown Relief Line. But for this to happen, Toronto would need to generate hundreds of millions and the money would still be better spent elsewhere. Additionally, Metrolinx would likely have to give up control of the ECLRT, which is something that the bureaucrats there would be less than happy with.
 
but does it need to be elevated to be interlined or can it be at grade if the stop spacing is wide enough?
 
sixrings said:
could they not simply reduce the above ground stop spacing and make it interlined with the SRT? In the east elevated stops would be Sloane, Victoria Park, Pharmacy, Warden, Birchmount, Kennedy. That should allow for speeds fast enough that it can interline?
Click to expand...

That's what I was thinking. The N-S avenue spacing in West Scarborough is perfect for stations at every major arterial, while still remaining relatively walkable.

Elevate it for an extra $50-75 million per km, with the extra paid for by the city. I'm pretty sure that the majority of council would support such a move, unless the "pigheaded" faction of the right is feeling particularly stubborn that day.

An extra couple hundred million for a fully grade-separated line from Black Creek to Sheppard East is worth it in my books.
 
your looking at $400 million to elevate it, and considering council can't find money for the $250 million WELRT I doubt they will throw $400 million into a pot on a whim, no matter how much I wish they would.
 
gweed123 said:
That's what I was thinking. The N-S avenue spacing in West Scarborough is perfect for stations at every major arterial, while still remaining relatively walkable.

Elevate it for an extra $50-75 million per km, with the extra paid for by the city. I'm pretty sure that the majority of council would support such a move, unless the "pigheaded" faction of the right is feeling particularly stubborn that day.
Click to expand...

Looking at the 2013 capital budget it's very clear that current leadership (whomever that is) is extremely anti debt and wants to pay for things with cash instead.

Makes sense for a small business but very little sense for a large business or government, particularly at todays interest rates (30 year bonds are under 4% for the city).
 
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