Toronto Crosstown LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | Arcadis

[smallspy]

Well, it is a giant traffic jam, and for the last little while, turns haven't been allowed. If you are going directly through, you just have to brave the lane restrictions and traffic.

I wouldn't call it a giant traffic jam. Yes, it often takes 2 light cycles to pass through there, but it's only a bit worse than it used to be. (And as a whole, it really seems as if traffic levels are way down all across Eglinton.)

As for turns, while yes they've restricted several of them, they've seemed to have done a good job of managing to keep most of them through the intersection.

People who turn north on Bayview cut onto Bruce Park to by-pass the intersection via Roehampton. People who turn south on Bayview cut onto Soudan. Many people going straight through the intersection east-west also use Soudan-Parkhurst to reach Laird.

As a local resident, I am definitely not a fan of cars using these residential streets as a by-pass. They are usually the impatient types, and have no problem flooring it down Bruce Park, for instance, which is on a hill (so sight lines limited) and doesn't have sidewalks on one-side of the road so often has dog walkers or moms with strollers on the street. (There is a nearby paediatrician office)

People cutting through those neighbourhoods to avoid traffic is nothing new, and has nothing to do with the construction. People were doing it when I was going to Leaside over 20 years ago, and for all I know were doing it 20 years before that as well. It was so prevalent in fact that we referred to the stop signs as "stop-tionals". And even today, they still are.

Dan

 

[TrickyRicky]

Steve X, I’m not so sure people universally want the subway stop without the construction headache. A surprising number of local residents don’t want subway stops nearby at all and actively campaign against them.

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

People cutting through those neighbourhoods to avoid traffic is nothing new, and has nothing to do with the construction. People were doing it when I was going to Leaside over 20 years ago, and for all I know were doing it 20 years before that as well. It was so prevalent in fact that we referred to the stop signs as "stop-tionals". And even today, they still are.

Well, as a local who was here before and present, the number of people doing it has definitely gone up by my observed experience.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

My thoughts on the Bathurst situation:

Traffic on Eglinton between Allen on Yonge is pretty light (relatively speaking) at all times of the day. The east-west traffic bottleneck in the area has never been Bathurst, but rather Allen Road. Now that Eglinton @ Allen has been reconfigured to provide cars entering Allen from westbound Eglinton with their own lane, traffic through the area is relatively smooth sailing

Travelling North-south on Bathurst @ Eglinton remains pretty bad, however.

My preference is to keep the intersection open, with the current lane restrictions in place, even if it means doubling the construction time of the station. Imo, that's a lesser penalty than totally shutting down the intersection to north-south traffic for several months. Of course, this preference comes with the caveat that it should not affect the overall delivery timeline of the Crosstown LRT. If there's even a small chance this could delay project completion, the intersection should be shut down.

 

[Allandale25]

^ update below.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1085648503139778561

 

[W. K. Lis]

^ update below.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1085648503139778561

Now will come the complainers about delays to the construction timeline. Best to bookmark this announcement for future reference.

 

[steveintoronto]

^There could be other factors at work that this will give cover to.

 

[TOareaFan]

Now will come the complainers about delays to the construction timeline. Best to bookmark this announcement for future reference.

You think?

Either Metrolinx did a lousy job of explaining the whats and whys of this plan or there really was no real benefit. They wanted to completely shut down a major intersection so that construction in the intersection would be done by September 2019 as opposed to the end of 2019? For a line that is not going to provide any service to the area until 2021?.....and they expected people to see the benefit in that?

 

[cplchanb]

You think?

Either Metrolinx did a lousy job of explaining the whats and whys of this plan or there really was no real benefit. They wanted to completely shut down a major intersection so that construction in the intersection would be done by September 2019 as opposed to the end of 2019? For a line that is not going to provide any service to the area until 2021?.....and they expected people to see the benefit in that?

well they could divert resources to other parts of the line. Remember, 2021 is not a guarantee especially since the contractors sued to have construction extended. I for one would prefer short term pain for long term gain.
Maybe not freeze an intersection for a long time, but for sure night shifts.

 

[Allandale25]

I'm just speculating here but I do wonder about the Crosslinx-Metrolinx dynamic. Is it possible that Crosslinx waited until the last minute to tell Metrolinx what they would specifically need to do at this intersection and that prevented more consultation with local residents and politicians?

 

[TOareaFan]

well they could divert resources to other parts of the line. Remember, 2021 is not a guarantee especially since the contractors sued to have construction extended. I for one would prefer short term pain for long term gain.

I too am generally of that mind.....but the balance between pain and gain (cost and benefit ) has to be right.

Maybe not freeze an intersection for a long time, but for sure night shifts.

. But that is what was on the table....complete closure of Bathurst north of Eglinton, or continue with the current program of partial closures. We are not dealing with a theoretical/hypothetical.....

.....and that 7 month complete closure would mean a completion of the intersection at ~ September 2019 as opposed to December 2019 as planned (ML estimates not mine)..... I don’t live in the area but it sure looks like the pain:gain ratio was a bit out of whack here.

 

[crs1026]

I'm just speculating here but I do wonder about the Crosslinx-Metrolinx dynamic. Is it possible that Crosslinx waited until the last minute to tell Metrolinx what they would specifically need to do at this intersection and that prevented more consultation with local residents and politicians?

Quite possibly. However, ML handles the communications, and they certainly ran with communicating the initial plan, right up til they reversed themselves. Makes one wonder what level of oversight ML exercises, and are their communications people thinking about community engagement versus just running with whatever the technical people tell them is happening. Pretty hard for ML to say they were presented with a non-starter plan that they opposed from their first (belated) discovery of it.

When the local councillor tells you two weeks in advance that they aren’t supportive of your plan and will be so stating at the next community meeting, you probably were talking past your stakeholders, not talking with them. #Davenport2.0

- Paul

 

[TheTigerMaster]

well they could divert resources to other parts of the line. Remember, 2021 is not a guarantee especially since the contractors sued to have construction extended.

Is there still a chance construction might be extended? Didn't we just pay Crosslinx another $240 Million to ensure its completed on time?

 

[BurlOak]

You think?

Either Metrolinx did a lousy job of explaining the whats and whys of this plan or there really was no real benefit. They wanted to completely shut down a major intersection so that construction in the intersection would be done by September 2019 as opposed to the end of 2019? For a line that is not going to provide any service to the area until 2021?.....and they expected people to see the benefit in that?

I too am generally of that mind.....but the balance between pain and gain (cost and benefit ) has to be right.

. But that is what was on the table....complete closure of Bathurst north of Eglinton, or continue with the current program of partial closures. We are not dealing with a theoretical/hypothetical.....

.....and that 7 month complete closure would mean a completion of the intersection at ~ September 2019 as opposed to December 2019 as planned (ML estimates not mine)..... I don’t live in the area but it sure looks like the pain:gain ratio was a bit out of whack here.

Agree - saving 3 months to close a major intersection does not seem like enough benefit.

I would say that the numbers would be something like this.

1. Design for road open. Construction with road open = 10 months.
2. Design for road open. Construction with road closed = 7 months.
3. Design for road closed. Construction with road closed = 2 months.??

Closing the road should have yielded much greater benefits if planned properly from the start (i.e. taking advantage of precast concrete, etc.). Now they wanted to to the same time consuming construction techniques, but just speed them marginally by not working in live traffic.

 

[rbt]

Is there still a chance construction might be extended? Didn't we just pay Crosslinx another $240 Million to ensure its completed on time?

Yes. Crosslinx claimed additional expenses as a result of Metrolinx not meeting contractual obligations in a timely manner but the joint statement after the settlement indicated both sides were committed to the existing timeline. It looked like Crosslinx would be adding more night crews on below ground sections where noise isn't a concern.