Toronto The Berczy | 41.76m | 13s | Concert | Arcadis

[ProjectEnd]

Well, Undoubtedly you are not even close to the idea that I have about what a "stunning" human is. What a disrespectful person you are! we all have different points of view and you should respect that and listen... shame on you

I'll agree that the Korean model jab was a bit much (apologies) but my underlying point still stands. If we accept, much less promote the kind of crap-itecture displayed at The Jerkzy, we fail to feed the very culture that can bring us superior results in the first place. I understand that 'we all have different points of view' but in many ways architecture isn't as subjective as you'd make it seem. One can keep bad art hidden away at home. Bad architecture (especially multi-unit residential) on the other hand, embarrasses us as a city since it makes manifest our pursuit of immediate profit over long-term legacy. I have neither time nor respect for someone who thinks that this regressive, lazy, pile of nothing is a 'stunning' piece of design.

Some very wise posts by SP!RE, Ramako and isaidso as well. Kudos.

 

[Tewder]

Many of the comments here about the Berczy are overwrought, though I do agree the choice of materials on the upper half could have been better.

I prefer aA's approach (see Market wharf down the street, minus tower) but I have a feeling that the Berczy will settle in well over time.

 

[carturo15]

I'll agree that the Korean model jab was a bit much (apologies) but my underlying point still stands. If we accept, much less promote the kind of crap-itecture displayed at The Jerkzy, we fail to feed the very culture that can bring us superior results in the first place. I understand that 'we all have different points of view' but in many ways architecture isn't as subjective as you'd make it seem. One can keep bad art hidden away at home. Bad architecture (especially multi-unit residential) on the other hand, embarrasses us as a city since it makes manifest our pursuit of immediate profit over long-term legacy. I have neither time nor respect for someone who thinks that this regressive, lazy, pile of nothing is a 'stunning' piece of design.

Some very wise posts by SP!RE, Ramako and isaidso as well. Kudos.

If you do not have time or respect for other's opinions then you should not be in this forum.

 

[ProjectEnd]

Well be the bigger man/woman and defend why the building is 'stunning.' I've given you two tough but legitimate responses and you've done nothing but critique my prose.

 

[carturo15]

Well be the bigger man/woman and defend why the building is 'stunning.' I've given you two tough but legitimate responses and you've done nothing but critique my prose.

I am not criticizing your opinion about the building. I have a different point of view but I respect your thoughts about the building. What I do not agree with is the way you disrespect other's opinions, don't agree with them... fine but have some respect, otherwise you should not participate in this forum. and yes, for me Berczy is a stunning building, at least they tried to do something different in this city and not the typical glass box like Cityplace and all those new towers. they way the combined that beautiful brick with the black spandrel and black glass is unique in this city, nobody else has done anything similar. the lower section is beautiful and it goes accordingly with the neighborhood's architecture . the renovation of the old small building on Church was great using the old brick. the gray spandrel with the black balcony glass and black windows looks good in person, way much better than what we see in pictures in this forum. I think we should give to Concert some credit for it.

 

[SP!RE]

Just walked past it. A pretty nice experience at ground level and I've heard people nearby say nice things about it whenever I've been walking past or showing the neighbourhood to friends. Not sure why they are using such a dark glass on the ground level though-- very clear windows would be better for the retail here and the resulting streetscape.

 

[LowPolygon]

... and yes, for me Berczy is a stunning building, at least they tried to do something different in this city and not the typical glass box like Cityplace and all those new towers...

if you think that Berczy is unique you need to get out more. the base is the same-old vaguely ye-olde historicist schlock that one finds all over the city, in both "high-end" and low-end iterations. the only thing stunning about it is how stunningly banal it is.

 

[carturo15]

I don't think those buildings from the pictures you attached are somehow close to what was built by Concert. Berczy is way much better. I am sorry but I have not seen anything similar in Toronto, maybe in Montreal

 

[kweku]

I don't think those buildings from the pictures you attached are somehow close to what was built by Concert. Berczy is way much better. I am sorry but I have not seen anything similar in Toronto, maybe in Montreal

Sorry but the last picture "The Prince Arthur" to me is one of the Gems at Yorkville.
Berczy has nothing on that Building. The bottom part of Berczy comes close but the top half is just blaaaarrr ......

 

[Tewder]

I have to confess that I haven't seen it in person yet (only from a distance) but the Berczy strikes me more as contextual than historicist, and there is already a strong precedent for this in the area... in other words, the contextual is itself contextual.

I get that this isn't an architectural masterpiece but some here have truly gone off the deep end!

 

[LowPolygon]

the contextual is itself contextual.

er, its hard to argue with that i suppose....a bit Clintonian but whatever.

I get that this isn't an architectural masterpiece but some here have truly gone off the deep end!

you're right, the base isn't hard core ersatz historicist, but its pretty close on the corner. either way, it remains punishingly, mind-bendingly, mediocre.

as for deep ends, i think this reaction is the natural corallory of 'so and so' declaring an insanely dull development such as this 'stunning', or 'a beautiful addition to the city', declarations which are, in their way, far more 'off the deep end' than calling out a developer for depositing yet another mindless pile of nothing on the city.

 

[RiverCity1]

I have to confess that I haven't seen it in person yet (only from a distance)...

Haha, well if you live in TO or come here for visits come and see the building for yourself. You may hate it in person. Or maybe you will think that it is an architectural masterpiece.


p.s. I just realized today that, perhaps I love ugly buildings. Don't get me wrong, I think the Berczy is beautiful. But I was thinking today how much I have loved the Sheraton Centre and the Manulife Centre since I can remember...and many people (maybe most people) consider them ugly. My condo at River City has sections of exposed concrete formed with the woodgrain pattern from barnboard. I think that it looks beautiful. A lot of people I know think that it looks ugly. I also love black window mullions, like used here, and yet many people don't respond to black anything. Was thinking that, maybe my opinion of architectural beauty would change if I went to a true school of architecture to learn precisely how to make a building beautiful. One that everyone in the land loved. And then also learn how to create an entire city of them in precisely the same way...because it is a science after all that one should be able to replicate over and over again to evoke the exact same emotion. I think my eyes would then be opened up to how awful buildings truly are, from this precise science standpoint, of course. I'd be able to develop a critical eye for such awfulness. Who needs art, and finding the beauty in imperfection? Toronto certainly doesn't

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Rivercity:

To be fair though, River City is an exercise in calculated design that went through multiple reviews. I can't sincerely call the "podium" level (street perhaps is a better phrase) treatment of Berczy ugly - more like well-executed crowd-pleaser conservative. My personal beef has always been with the more problematic slab portion of the development - and to put it in analogy, someone slapping a RoCP I like tower atop a street level treatment a la 1 St. Thomas.

AoD (not MoD)

 

[TheKingEast]

I think some people will never be satisfied.

 

[ProjectEnd]

Rivercity:

To be fair though, River City is an exercise in calculated design that went through multiple reviews. I can't sincerely call the "podium" level (street perhaps is a better phrase) treatment of Berczy ugly - more like well-executed crowd-pleaser conservative. My personal beef has always been with the more problematic slab portion of the development - and to put it in analogy, someone slapping a RoCP I like tower atop a street level treatment a la 1 St. Thomas.

AoD (not MoD)

Agreed, and that's giving the podium more credit then it likely deserves.