Toronto Aga Khan Museum + Ismaili Centre | ?m | ?s | Aga Khan Dev. | Maki and Associates

Walli, if you'd read the previous postings. you would have read numerous speculations as to why this project is not going ahead. One rumour was that it had to do with the collapsing price of oil, assuming that that is the business that The Aga Khan is in. Also I was trying to defend you against increasingly vociferous criticism.

However, I think I can now understand why people get frustrated with your postings. You are very coy and never provide any real information. So speculation runs wild and all people have is the rubble of a once respected piece of architecture to base their reactions on. My suggestion is that you stop posting here until there is something real and concrete to write about.
 
urbanvillageboy said:
Walli, if you'd read the previous postings. you would have read numerous speculations as to why this project is not going ahead. One rumour was that it had to do with the collapsing price of oil, assuming that that is the business that The Aga Khan is in.
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Sorry urbanvillageboy. I must have missed the prior speculation about oil. The Aga Khan, to my knowledge, has absolutely no connection to the oil business whatsoever. Additionally, I believe the museum would be a project of the Aga Khan Trust for Culture (AKTC), and not necessarily connected to the Aga Khan's personal work. The AKTC, an agency of the Aga Khan Development Network, is funded by a broad number of funders. You can read more about the AKTC from the AKDN web-site (click agencies and then AKTC). According to the 'about' tab on the AKDN web-site, their budget for non-profit development activities in 2008 was approximately US$450 million. It is possible the museum would be funded out of this same line-item distributed over a number of years. I believe the Ismaili Centre dollars, however, would come from elsewhere.
 
Clearly interchange42's earlier comment regarding the price of oil was a low blow based strictly on ignorance.

Reading over the history of this thread, Walli has provided a significant amount of information on this project, and his tone only changed after repeated attacks.

WRT the Bata building, I'm all for historic preservation, however, the building was beginning to show signs of neglect and imo, had become a great eye sore.

IMO, the Museum and Ismaili Centre will bring a refreshing change to this neighborhood and will draw in a lot more positive attraction than the Bata building ever could.
 
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ArcticS said:
WRT the Bata building, I'm all for historic preservation, however, the building was beginning to show signs of neglect and imo, had become a great eye sore.
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Well, naturally it was showing signs of neglect and becoming an eyesore, because it was disused in preparation for Aga Khan. But before being sold, it was still well used and anything but an eyesore. So what you're saying is, technically, unfair--and besides, you might as well use the neglect/eyesore argument to write off *any* heritage building out there. (It's how 999 Queen got lost in the 70s, after all.)
 
ArcticS said:
WRT the Bata building, I'm all for historic preservation, however, the building was beginning to show signs of neglect and imo, had become a great eye sore.
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The reason Bata was looking like an eye sore is because it was purchased by the AKF in 2002 and left to rot.

I am proposing a poll on the eventual disposition of this project:

1. The project will be built as proposed.

2. A portion of the project will be built.

2. Nothing will be built, and the land sold to a comdominium developer.
 
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barit said:
The reason Bata was looking like an eye sore is because it was purchased by the AKF in 2002 and left to rot.

I am proposing a poll on the eventual disposition of this project:

1. The project will be built as proposed.

2. A portion of the project will be built.

2. Nothing will be built, and the land sold to a comdominium developer.
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This is a definite 1.

Historically, does The AKF have a reputation for not completing their projects? Does anyone have any evidence of any project left incomplete?

Further to the discussion of the Bata building and it's impact to the area, I would much rather have a structure that not only reflects the cultural diversity of the city, but contributes greatly to the arts, rather than a structure built strictly for corporate profit and greed, particularly in such a high profile location.
 
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I posit that the AKF will ultimately walk-away from this project, citing there isn't enough money and that the project will actually in fact be built in England, where they initially wanted it.

p5
 
barit said:
I am proposing a poll on the eventual disposition of this project:

1. The project will be built as proposed.
2. A portion of the project will be built.
3. Nothing will be built, and the land sold to a comdominium developer.
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It is definitely #1 in my mind. I agree with the ArcticS who pointed to the fact that AKF/AKDN projects have never not been completed after reaching this far. They have, however, been known to be particularly prudent and so I wouldn't be surprised if some of this still has to do with timing and getting the best quotes.

I do believe that the Ismaili Centre (West half of the 17 acre combined lot) is to come up first - so it will definitely be phased.

As an interesting aside, even after 40 years, the Bata headquarters never was built out as originally proposed and only the smaller portion of the project was constructed.
 
catcher_of_cats said:
There is quite a lot of postings (here's another) in this thread considering nothing is happening at this site.
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catcher_of_cats said:
I am still awaiting the day when this project is dead. If you announce that you will build something, FFS then do it.
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Catcher_of_cats - While I respect your right to post, it is ironic that your first comment actually knocked others that are responding to posts or adding to the discussion, while at the same time you've actually not contributed anything material and have made unfounded or unsubstantiated statements.

You wrote "I am still awaiting the day when this project is dead" - somehow I'm not surprised at the immaturity of your comment.
 
As much as I regret Bata's demolition and feel the "deteriorating eyesore" alibi's a little slumlord-sleazy in effect, I'm not welcoming or hoping or wishing for the death of the present project.

Re Bata, what's done is done. And I wish no evil on the AKF.
 
Agreed - neither do I wish any trouble befall this project - bring it on... but that does not mean I will ever be happy that Bata, whether it was only a portion of what was originally envisioned or not, was demolished.

Aren't we all getting somewhat impatient for a sod-turning though? A press release telling us when all will unfold? A snippet of official information? Anything?

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There is no doubt in my mind that the Toronto Ismaili Centre, Gardens and the Aga Khan Museum will be built. There are loftier projects around the world that are either well underway or have already been completed under the patronage of the Aga Khan. 3xotic is right about the timeline though. It's anyone's guess as to when foundation stones will be laid and work will begin given the sheer paucity of information surrounding the projects but hopefully work will begin soon...

It would be a mistake to dismiss the Aga Khan's vision and reputation simply because the only project of his that you are aware of hasn't yet broken ground.
 
It would be a mistake to believe that I am only aware of this Aga Khan project, or that I am dismissing his vision and reputation. My complaint is merely that we have had no official information or movement on this project in ages, and that complaint is valid no matter what the Aga Khan's vision or reputation is, no matter what other projects of his are progressing (or have been completed) around the world.

Or because the Aga Khan is involved, am I not allowed to lodge a complaint at all? That seems to be the implication in some posts here.


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