Tamil Protests downtown

[GraphicMatt]

That's a mighty fine straw man you've got there.

Jayomatic advocated for locking the kids up and you agreed with him - that's not a strawman, that's a singing, dancing scarecrow.

Look, here's my thinking on this as I've been following the issue on twitter all night (And I may very well miss an important a.m meeting tomorrow if this continues to the morning):

1) I'd have zero idea about the issues facing Sri Lanka if not for these protesters. Would you?

2) It's very dangerous to claim that there's nothing that would ever justify this kind of protest.

3) If your family was being murdered halfway around the world and no one seemed to care, you'd probably do impulsive things too.

But, yeah, this is an ill-advised protest and for all their good intentions these Tamils don't really seem to have a very thought-out list of demands, but simplifying the issue to little more than "those jerks blocking our roads!" is stupid.

 

[Mustapha]

6pm to about 7pm Sunday: Spadina Avenue between Baldwin and D'Arcy. They're standing in the middle of the street car tracks and roadways. Neither TTC cars or autos are moving. The police aren't doing a thing.

 

[cdr108]

Mods - I just realized there's another thread in Politics .... there are some pics too for others to view.

Please merge if desired ...

 

[salmonz]

???? There's nothing in that video except people marching and protesting. No violence, no damage. As far as I know, we haven't suspended the right of people to protest here.

And they've very nicely moved their protest to a highway the city has declared surplus, and wants to remove; shouldn't inconvenience anyone too much.

The point where the protesters surpassed the police and started running (not marching or walking) for the Gardiner Expressway is where I think people got too emotional. Walking or running onto an expressway in Canada is illegal. Walking or running on a street is less serious than an expressway.

Clearly, this protest went too far. I understand what they're protesting for but doesn't give them the right to take over the highways.

I also saw pictures that depict protesters throwing the police's bicycles off the Gardiner ramp and forcing themselves up the ramp of the Gardiner.

 

[Ramako]

1) I'd have zero idea about the issues facing Sri Lanka if not for these protesters. Would you?

Well, I would, because I've heard about their many previous legal protests. Your personal ignorance of global issues does not justify mass illegal activity.

2) It's very dangerous to claim that there's nothing that would ever justify this kind of protest.

See above. You're suggesting that the ends justify the means. Perhaps that is true in some cases, but certainly not here. Creating marginal awareness is not a justification for breaking the law and seriously disrupting the city. Freedom of expression and freedom of association are not protected where the mode of expression or association is illegal, unless there is a very good justification. The justification given does not come close to meeting that threshold.

3) If your family was being murdered halfway around the world and no one seemed to care, you'd probably do impulsive things too.

You have an odd understanding of the word "impulsive." Good thing you're not a judge.

But, yeah, this is an ill-advised protest and for all their good intentions these Tamils don't really seem to have a very thought-out list of demands, but simplifying the issue to little more than "those jerks blocking our roads!" is stupid.

The issue is not about the roads being blocked. The issue is not about imprisoning children. The issue is that a political group is attempting to shut down a major city to get their way. What kind of precedent would you set by acquiescing to their demands?

 

[Whoaccio]

One thing that grinds my gears about protesting on University is that Queen's Park is literally a few minutes away (depending on what part of Uni). There is no need to block a massive arterial when there is a massive public space *right* there. Or protest in Dundas Square, or Nathan Phillips Square, or any other public space. Don't screw up transit infrastructure. The only routes left at this point for the Tamils to block are the subways and GO Corridor.

Ohh, and don't protest at the US Consulate.

 

[theman23]

That's a mighty fine straw man you've got there.

Maybe not, but then I've been spending a bit too much time reading newspaper comment boards.

The police are probably waiting for the crowd to thin out over the night. Hopefully they'll be able to remove the remaining protesters before rush hour traffic.

EDIT: looks like its ending right now.

 

[GraphicMatt]

Well, I would, because I've heard about their many previous legal protests. Your personal ignorance of global issues does not justify mass illegal activity.

I wasn't speaking only about today's protests, but about all their recent protesting. The protesting does create awareness - today's protests probably created more awareness than any before it.

Does that justify it? Dunno. Probably not entirely. I'm just sick of people claiming this is a simple issue.

See above. You're suggesting that the ends justify the means. Perhaps that is true in some cases, but certainly not here. Creating marginal awareness is not a justification for breaking the law and seriously disrupting the city. Freedom of expression and freedom of association are not protected where the mode of expression or association is illegal.

I'm suggesting that EVERYBODY has an issue that, in their minds, would justify this kind of action. If protestors had taken to the highways in the 1950s to call for civil rights, we'd celebrate that today. If Californians had taken to the highways to protest the Prop 8 vote in November, we'd see much broader support from people across the Internet.

The difference with the Tamils is that you and I don't really care that much, because it's happening so far away.

Thank god you're not a judge. The law doesn't work in reality like it does in movies.

I'm not talking about the law, because any reasonable person knows it would be incredibly stupid to arrest anyone involved in today's events that didn't do anything violent. I'm just saying that these are, by and large, just people who want someone to notice that their people are dying.

 

[nfitz]

Walking or running onto an expressway in Canada is illegal.

Oh good grief ... thousands of people dead, and your whining about an expressway being blocked for few hours on a Sunday. It was closed last weekend for repairs - everyone lived.

 

[Automation Gallery]

The point where the protesters surpassed the police and started running (not marching or walking) for the Gardiner Expressway is where I think people got too emotional. Walking or running onto an expressway in Canada is illegal. Walking or running on a street is less serious than an expressway.

Clearly, this protest went too far. I understand what they're protesting for but doesn't give them the right to take over the highways.

I also saw pictures that depict protesters throwing the police's bicycles off the Gardiner ramp and forcing themselves up the ramp of the Gardiner.

Years ago a couple of hippie backpack hitchhiking friends of mine started out on this same ramp and were put in the slammer even before they started, they eventually ended up in Vancouver but not without getting arrested various times for trespassing our highways.

This is Totally Insane.

Tamil protesters move up the Spadina Avenue ramp onto the westbound Gardiner Expressway on Sunday, May 10, 2009. (Jesse Park / MyNews.CTV.ca)

Toronto police move into position as Tamil supporters block the Gardiner Expressway in downtown Toronto as traffic is snarled along Lakeshore and other major routes in the downtown core, Sunday, May 10, 2009. (Drew Hyttenrauch / MyNews.CTV.ca)

 

[Ramako]

I wasn't speaking only about today's protests, but about all their recent protesting. The protesting does create awareness - today's protests probably created more awareness than any before it.

No one's talking about their previous protests. Those were legal and did indeed raise awareness. This protest, on the other hand was illegal, and was not simply done to raise awareness, but to hold the city hostage.

I'm suggesting that EVERYBODY has an issue that, in their minds, would justify this kind of action. If protestors had taken to the highways in the 1950s to call for civil rights, we'd celebrate that today. If Californians had taken to the highways to protest the Prop 8 vote in November, we'd see much broader support from people across the Internet.

You're right, some protests are more justified than others. It is somewhat justified to protest a Californian law in California. It is less justified to protest another government's bahaviour in a place that is wholly unconnected to the issue.

But as I've already said, this wasn't even just about protesting. This was about holding the city hostage.

I'm not talking about the law, because any reasonable person knows it would be incredibly stupid to arrest anyone involved in today's events that didn't do anything violent.

Yeah? Then watch them do it over and over again.

 

[SP!RE]

Bottom line: You fly the flags of a terrorist organization and you have nullified your cause in my eyes.

 

[lxmoss]

GET OFF THE EXPRESSWAY! Either that or the police should re-open the expressway and let the protesters figure out what to do.

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

3) If your family was being murdered halfway around the world and no one seemed to care, you'd probably do impulsive things too.

There are horrific large scale slaughters, genocide and the displacement of tens of millions of people all over the world ("never again"), how can all this possibly ever be dealt with?
Perhaps if Exxon & friends find some oil under these troubled regions there might be an interest. I'm just really jaded and sad about it all.

 

[Ramako]

One thing that grinds my gears about protesting on University is that Queen's Park is literally a few minutes away (depending on what part of Uni). There is no need to block a massive arterial when there is a massive public space *right* there. Or protest in Dundas Square, or Nathan Phillips Square, or any other public space. Don't screw up transit infrastructure. The only routes left at this point for the Tamils to block are the subways and GO Corridor.

Ohh, and don't protest at the US Consulate.

That's the point though. They're not just trying to raise awareness. They're trying to exert pressure on the city so that their demands are met.