wyliepoon
Senior Member
http://www.thestar.com/News/GTA/article/518284
Store bathroom battle escalates
John Spears
City Hall Bureau
Every store in Toronto with a floor area of 3,230 square feet or more should have to provide washrooms for their customers, says the city's licensing and standards committee.
But business owners and some councillors said the city is going too far.
"We're clobbering people every which way in Toronto," complained Councillor Mike Del Grande (Ward 39, Scarborough-Agincourt), who said the move will force some store owners into expensive remodelling.
The committee's proposal, which now goes on to city council for further debate, is the brainchild of Councillor Howard Moscoe, who said he got a complaint from a constituent who was denied access to a department store washroom.
Moscoe (Ward 15 Eglinton-Lawrence) discovered that since 1976, the Ontario Building Code has required stores to provide washrooms – but was silent about whether they were open to customers as well as staff.
Moscoe argued that his proposal will simply open existing washrooms to the public.
To avoid burdening mom-and-pop stores, he proposed exempting stores less than 3,230 square feet – about one-third the size of a typical Shoppers Drug Mart. Stores larger than 3,230 square feet are already required to provide separate men's and women's washrooms (though not necessarily for the public).
Gary Sands, who represents independent grocers and chain drug stores, said that won't solve many problems for retailers.
Washrooms are often located in publicly inaccessible areas, such as storerooms, he said.
And food retailers usually have their washrooms adjacent to food preparation areas, which by law cannot be accessible to the public. That would force food stores to construct new washrooms for customers.
"This measure, if adopted by the city, would add costs to run a business in Toronto and potentially make a retailer think twice about expanding or opening a business in Toronto," said Sands.
He said the city should come up with some research to show that people actually want store washrooms, before it imposes new costs on businesses.
Moscoe brushed that off.
"I don't need a study to tell me that people need to go to the washroom," he said.
Moscoe couldn't say how many businesses will have to open their washrooms to the public if the new rules are passed.
Del Grande said stores with washrooms in areas near storage areas will need "washroom monitors" to make sure people using their toilets aren't helping themselves to merchandise as well.
He suggested that the rule apply only to new businesses, or those undergoing major renovations, but that was defeated.
Councillor Denzil Minnan-Wong (Ward 34, Don Valley East) said the proposed measure is unnecessary.
"This is an example of the city looking for a solution where no problem exists," he said.
"I don't think we need to impose this additional cost, this additional regulation when we can't even show that it's a necessary thing."
Judith Andrew of the Canadian Federation of Independent Business said she's heard no public groundswell demanding washrooms.
"It's another cost and imposition with very little notice," she said after the meeting. Store owners are usually helpful if someone suddenly needs a washroom, she said: "People are understanding; people are people, and you don't have to write everything into law."
Councillor Rob Ford (Ward 2, Etobicoke North) was absent for yesterday's committee vote on the issue. He spent the afternoon coaching his high school football team. Ford said in an interview he is undecided about how to vote on it.
Store bathroom battle escalates
John Spears
City Hall Bureau
Every store in Toronto with a floor area of 3,230 square feet or more should have to provide washrooms for their customers, says the city's licensing and standards committee.
But business owners and some councillors said the city is going too far.
"We're clobbering people every which way in Toronto," complained Councillor Mike Del Grande (Ward 39, Scarborough-Agincourt), who said the move will force some store owners into expensive remodelling.
The committee's proposal, which now goes on to city council for further debate, is the brainchild of Councillor Howard Moscoe, who said he got a complaint from a constituent who was denied access to a department store washroom.
Moscoe (Ward 15 Eglinton-Lawrence) discovered that since 1976, the Ontario Building Code has required stores to provide washrooms – but was silent about whether they were open to customers as well as staff.
Moscoe argued that his proposal will simply open existing washrooms to the public.
To avoid burdening mom-and-pop stores, he proposed exempting stores less than 3,230 square feet – about one-third the size of a typical Shoppers Drug Mart. Stores larger than 3,230 square feet are already required to provide separate men's and women's washrooms (though not necessarily for the public).
Gary Sands, who represents independent grocers and chain drug stores, said that won't solve many problems for retailers.
Washrooms are often located in publicly inaccessible areas, such as storerooms, he said.
And food retailers usually have their washrooms adjacent to food preparation areas, which by law cannot be accessible to the public. That would force food stores to construct new washrooms for customers.
"This measure, if adopted by the city, would add costs to run a business in Toronto and potentially make a retailer think twice about expanding or opening a business in Toronto," said Sands.
He said the city should come up with some research to show that people actually want store washrooms, before it imposes new costs on businesses.
Moscoe brushed that off.
"I don't need a study to tell me that people need to go to the washroom," he said.
Moscoe couldn't say how many businesses will have to open their washrooms to the public if the new rules are passed.
Del Grande said stores with washrooms in areas near storage areas will need "washroom monitors" to make sure people using their toilets aren't helping themselves to merchandise as well.
He suggested that the rule apply only to new businesses, or those undergoing major renovations, but that was defeated.
Councillor Denzil Minnan-Wong (Ward 34, Don Valley East) said the proposed measure is unnecessary.
"This is an example of the city looking for a solution where no problem exists," he said.
"I don't think we need to impose this additional cost, this additional regulation when we can't even show that it's a necessary thing."
Judith Andrew of the Canadian Federation of Independent Business said she's heard no public groundswell demanding washrooms.
"It's another cost and imposition with very little notice," she said after the meeting. Store owners are usually helpful if someone suddenly needs a washroom, she said: "People are understanding; people are people, and you don't have to write everything into law."
Councillor Rob Ford (Ward 2, Etobicoke North) was absent for yesterday's committee vote on the issue. He spent the afternoon coaching his high school football team. Ford said in an interview he is undecided about how to vote on it.
