raptor
Senior Member
Why can't Lawrence East station be constructed AFTER the subway is built, once the SRT is closed? Why does Lawrence East need to be ready by "day 1"?
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SmartTrack (Proposed)
- Thread starter aquateam
- Start date
steveintoronto
Superstar
It's a conundrum of Tory's own making, and he has a choice as to which way he loses on it.
As to 'tips from the inside' to the press that I mentioned in a previous post, it wouldn't surprise me that this story was fed from inside ML. Patience must be growing very thin with shenanigans from both QP and City Hall. ML have a number of peccadilloes of their own to live down (like the background studies for the Richmond Hill Line and Relief Lines). I suspect revisions to those studies are due imminently with the next major announcement on the RL. And a revisit of the Scarborough LRT, which, as we all know, was to be fully funded by QP.
Midtown Urbanist
Superstar
It is kind of hilarious. This is an issue that none of us foresaw but should have seen coming.
Someone remind me when the Scarborough LRT was supposed to be completed and operating?
sixrings
Senior Member
Always wished smarttrack would eventually became rebranding of drl east combined with upx in the west.
Amare
Senior Member
How Tory has gotten away with this "Smarttrack" moniker for almost 4 years is beyond me. So basically all one has to do these days is take an existing program that already exists, improve it slightly, re-brand/rename it, and you'll magically get a new comprehensive "plan". The sad part is that people buy it since they are so uniformed about basic issues in this city and province.
At this point he can get away with anything, like for instance: taking Queen's Park, painting it blue and white and saying that "this building is now owned and operated by the City of Toronto". The whole concept of Smarttrack is just laughable.
At this point he can get away with anything, like for instance: taking Queen's Park, painting it blue and white and saying that "this building is now owned and operated by the City of Toronto". The whole concept of Smarttrack is just laughable.
Palma
Senior Member
that would be pretty neat. I never thought of that
Voltz
Senior Member
2015, then 2020 thanks to McGuinty, then never thanks to Ford, Stintz, GDB Wynn, Tory and a bunch of other spineless weasels.
Midtown Urbanist
Superstar
Do not forget Mitzie Hunter and Brad Duguid.
Voltz
Senior Member
Of course, but I would include them in the spineless weasels group.
Rainforest
Senior Member
Some urban planners believe that every light rail line must stop every 400 m. No problem delaying 200 riders already on the train, in order to serve 5 riders at a minor stop because those 5 can't be asked to use a parallel local bus.
And then, another group of urban planners thinks that GO RER connection to the major Lawrence East bus route isn't desirable. It might cause a few riders from upstream to stop taking transit. So much for the network connectivity.
Btw, the Uxbridge Sub corridor is relatively wide around the Lawrence East station. If there is no need to reserve space for 2 LRT tracks or 2 subway tracks, then it should be possible to have 4 mainline tracks there. One pair for trains that stop at Lawrence East, another pair for passing trains.
And then, another group of urban planners thinks that GO RER connection to the major Lawrence East bus route isn't desirable. It might cause a few riders from upstream to stop taking transit. So much for the network connectivity.
Btw, the Uxbridge Sub corridor is relatively wide around the Lawrence East station. If there is no need to reserve space for 2 LRT tracks or 2 subway tracks, then it should be possible to have 4 mainline tracks there. One pair for trains that stop at Lawrence East, another pair for passing trains.
Midtown Urbanist
Superstar
I acknowledge and agree with the absurdity of this.
That being said, GO-RER is competing with the car. Every minute matters. Whereas, LRTs are meant to be for local travel, high rates of accessibility and satisfy other city building objectives.
But yes, generally speaking I agree. Bringing GO-RER to more people through more stations, and ensuring that LRTs are actually rapid and not a glorified streetcar, is something that planners should think about when planning these things.
TheTigerMaster
Superstar
It’s not just a few riders upstream that’ll stop taking transit. Across the entire RER line, it causes a net decrease in ridership, even when you factor in the ridership that Lawrence East will attract.
The point of transit infrastructure isn’t to make for pretty lines on a map, it’s to move people. If your investment is somehow causing less people to take transit, it’s almost certainly I’ll advised.
robmausser
Senior Member
Ignoring of course the fact that the studies saying that the Lawerence East stop would cause fewer people to take transit upstream was based off of flawed studies that looked at how these new stations would impact the current GO train operations, and NOT GO-RER.
Thats right, the study looked at how adding these stations would affect travel times on the current diesel bi-level GO trains stopping at all these stations. Something that will never actually happen.
M II A II R II K
Senior Member
At least there’s still express like service after Danforth to Union with only a couple of stops in between
Rainforest
Senior Member
That explains nicely the results of modeling that otherwise feel counter-intuitive.
Generally speaking, ridership modeling isn't a precise science. The math methods used there may be quite precise / well-defined, but the outcome of modeling always depends on choosing the input parameters. Selecting those parameters is partly a matter of judgement.
Therefore, if a ridership model gives strange results, then it is usually a good idea to re-examine the assumptions that were put into that model.