Sloppy Construction on St Clair ROW

[allabootmatt]

So I am back in town for a visit, and had to go up to Forest Hill Village today to run an errand.

Having not been in that part of the city in about a year, I couldn't believe the sloppiness of the job on St Clair--pretty much all the way from Yonge to St Clair West station.

From Yonge to about Avenue, there are two complete sets of hydro/lighting poles up--the new ones and the old, which are showing no signs of impending removal. Most incredible, the rough-hewn pieces of timber holding up traffic lights at the Yonge and Avenue intersections are STILL there.

Meanwhile, further west, those fancy new luminaires have just been bolted onto old timber hydro poles, with a few new wooden poles, serving no apparent purpose, thrown in for good measure.

And then there's the lack of shelters, but we've heard that story.

I found the whole experience of the street astonishing--while I have no problem with the ROW concept, the implementation here of everything but the actual streetcar track has been utterly botched. What gives? Since the City is planning on rolling out things like this all over town, doesn't it have every incentive to make this one a non-disaster aesthetically?

I would love to know if anyone on the board who lives in the area knows anything about when, if ever, some of these problems are going to be corrected. If they aren't, I would be happy to assist in a letter-writing campaign to Michael Walker and the 'Fixer' in The Star.

 

[lordmandeep]

the hydro poles had nothing to do with the TTC but with Toronto Hydro a private company...

Its their job to fix them you see..

 

[Lone Primate]

the hydro poles had nothing to do with the TTC but with Toronto Hydro a private company...

Its their job to fix them you see..

Well, I believe Toronto Hydro belongs to the City of Toronto...

 

[299 bloor call control.]

we have to remember the crap caused by SOS prior to construction that screwed up schedules, tenders, contracts, and all that stuff that has led to the mishmash of construction going on on St Clair right now... come the end of the project, it will all work out.

 

[allabootmatt]

When is 'the end?'

 

[Hipster Duck]

I have been going up there every two months since April to see if they have [finally] installed the long-promised shelters. I guess I won't be due back until November...

 

[299 bloor call control.]

shelters should be installed by November so you won't have to be disappointed next time, Hipster

Phase 2 of the project kicks off in the fall, and probably won't be finished until the end of 2008, since they won't be doing much construction in Corso Italia during the summer to avoid disruption to the street festivals and BIA etc.

 

[GregWTravels]

Back in July, someone from the "Public Consultation Unit" for the City of Toronto replied to an email that I sent saying that the shelters would be installed in "early fall."

Greg

 

[ShonTron]

Phase 2 of the project kicks off in the fall, and probably won't be finished until the end of 2008, since they won't be doing much construction in Corso Italia during the summer to avoid disruption to the street festivals and BIA etc.

Now that would be a shame, wouldn't it?

 

[299 bloor call control.]

it still appalls me that a lot of the SOS group called for a subway under st. clair... think of the construction havoc if that ever happened... yeeshh...

The ignorami that are opposed to the project along the block really wish we did disrupt their business just to bring in more transit-friendly people.

 

[allabootmatt]

Some good news: noticed today that between Avenue and Yonge the wires between the *old* poles are down, leaving that stretch wire-free except for the actual trolley wire. The poles are still up, but mostly with luminaires removed, etc. etc. At the intersections the awful wooden poles are also still there, but at the corner of Avenue a Hydro truck was working on one so I assume they will be down soon.

The Yonge-Ave Rd stretch will actually look quite stately wire-free and with the nice new streetlights. Unfortunately Avenue-Russell Hill or so is still a mess, but perhaps that can be fixed at a later date.

And still no sign of the damn shelters!

Oh yeah, or streetcars.

 

[CDL.TO]

The substitute buses in effect aren't running in the ROW like I've seen them do on Spadina (and the St. Clair West bus terminal reconstruction project is at least a month behind schedule). This means that two lanes of traffic have been removed from service, but aren't even being used for transit. The buses are getting caught in traffic and reliability is terrible (last time I took the bus from St. Clair station there were FIVE 512 buses parked at the bus terminal!). Night Bus stop poles are located on the near side of each intersection, but the bus substitution stops are located on the far side. People are getting understandably confused and buses often stopping twice at each intersection.

It really confuses me as to why the ROW wasn't designed to allow buses run in it. Unlike Spadina, several buses actually run on St. Clair for parts of their routes including 33 Forest Hill, 90 Vaughan, 126 Christie (for a pretty good distance), 47 Lansdowne, and 41 Keele.

 

[drum118]

The substitute buses in effect aren't running in the ROW like I've seen them do on Spadina (and the St. Clair West bus terminal reconstruction project is at least a month behind schedule). This means that two lanes of traffic have been removed from service, but aren't even being used for transit. The buses are getting caught in traffic and reliability is terrible (last time I took the 512 bus from St. Clair there were 5 buses parked at the platform!). Night Bus stop poles are located on the near side of each intersection, but the substitution bus stops are located on the far side. People are getting understandably confused and buses often stop twice at each intersection.

It really confuses me as to why the ROW wasn't designed to allow buses run in it. Unlike Spadina, several buses actually run on St. Clair for parts of their routes including 33 Forest Hill, 90 Vaughan, 126 Christie (for a pretty good distance), 47 Lansdowne, and 41 Keele.

I love the comment I heard why buses were not using the ROW at last week TTC that left me shaking my head as this was opposite of was stated during the EA stage.

Some drivers can drive this ROW with one hand on the wheel will others have white knuckles with both hands on the wheels. I have seen buses use the ROW with no problem.

It was also stated that there should been an extra foot per track for the buses vs this shows why centre poles don't work.

It was stated by TTC that *ALL* city vehicles will not have a problem using this ROW from day one at each meeting I attended during the EA stage.

Could never understand why 312 did not use the ROW considering its headway in the first place. Not using the ROW confuses the riders for the 312 if they are new as to where its stop is in the first place.

Time to stop the BS and start using the ROW 100%.

There is Hydro work going on west of Dufferin for the underground work. No real construction as of Sat.

Was told at a meeting in June that most Hydro poles and wires would not come down this year due to lack of funds. Poles still have a life cycle them
and would remain in place until it ran out even if it wasn't doing anything.

Again, Time to bit the bullet and take it down now as it will give a clean look to the street.

 

[allabootmatt]

Drum 118, when you were told poles weren't coming down, did they say *which* poles? The ones between Ave and Yonge pretty obviously look like they are about to, and I can only assume that the "life cycle" argument does not extend to the temporary tree trunks that are currently standing at some of the intersections.

 

[spaced]

St. Clair curb is punishing tires TheStar.com - News - St. Clair curb is punishing tire

September 18, 2007
Jack Lakey
Staff Reporter
A curb that separates the St. Clair Ave. streetcar right-of-way from regular traffic is sometimes missed by motorists – until they are rocked by driving over it.
After years of political battles and endless construction delays, the project to allow streetcars to roll down the middle of St. Clair without getting tangled up in traffic is nearly complete.
The right-of-way has achieved the goal of making TTC streetcars move more quickly, a boon for transit users.
But many of those opposed to the project have sunk their teeth into problems that have since arisen, including landscaping complaints and flaws at intersections.
An email from Collyn Rezsnyak notes that a short length of curb that runs at intervals between the right-of-way and regular traffic can escape the attention of drivers, to their rueful surprise.
The curb borders the lane used by eastbound drivers on St. Clair W. to turn left at Vaughan Rd. and runs for about 20 metres.
It acts as a buffer between vehicles and streetcars, and seems primarily intended to keep traffic turning left from straying into the streetcar lane.
But Rezsnyak says the curb extends so close to the intersection that drivers making a tight left turn are bouncing over it, an unhappy event that poses a threat to their tires and wheel alignment and to the curb itself.
"I know it's not a big issue, but there needs to be some reflective material put on the curb or it should be removed completely," Rezsnyak said.
He's called the city and the TTC about it, "but so far everyone has passed the buck, saying it's someone else's problem."
We checked the spot out and found scrape marks across the top of the curb and pieces of concrete chipped away.
Given these forensics, it looks as though the curb needs to be tapered down to road level as it nears the intersection.
[FONT=helvetica,arial] STATUS: [/FONT]Curb problems are usually transportation services, but the right-of-way is TTC property. We called media officer Marilyn Bolton; she's getting back to us about a possible solution.