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Should we add two more track to the subway system?

Electrify said:
Seeing as Davisville is a triple track setup, I'd like to see express trains use the extra track for express service. Morning trains southbound could skip it, while evening trains northbound would skip it.
Click to expand...

And what do you do with those trains once they get to the end of the line?

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
Electrify said:
Seeing as Davisville is a triple track setup, I'd like to see express trains use the extra track for express service. Morning trains southbound could skip it, while evening trains northbound would skip it.
Click to expand...

It's just one stop skipped. The train is still going to have to stop at Bloor-Yonge.
 
Johnny Au said:
If two more tracks are being added, some of the stations will be converted to Spanish solution (or even super Spanish solution) anyways.
Click to expand...

And how are you going to do it without shutting the system down for decades?

You have to build a 2nd line under the existing one with express stations under the existing one. You need to come up with a solution how to get riders from those express station bypass the current access to the current station.

You can branch off Yonge at Summerhill using Bay St as your 2nd line with new express spacing stations.
 
ShonTron said:
Sections of Chicago's system (North Side Main Line), the majority of the Broad Street Line in Philadelphia and the London Underground (mostly in inner suburbs, such as the common track shared by the District and Piccadilly Lines or a section of the Metropolitan) also have four tracks, but yes, New York is the only place where they make lots of use of it.

It's funny that Philly has a four-track subway (at least on the north side), yet it's overbuilt for what they need today. They have express trains still during the peak, yet long waits between them. It's the classic case of having (mostly) all the transit infrastructure they will ever need (between on-paper amazing regional rail network with airport rail link, streetcars, interurbans, commuter subway, four track main line), but not enough demand/service to get full benefit from it. Opposite problem to Toronto.

Here's what it looks like at Girard and Broad, the junction of a streetcar route (the 15) and a four-track local-express subway:

http://goo.gl/maps/U7rl0

A KFC with drive through and parking on one corner, a gas station and full-service McDonald's with drive through on another, a one-story CVS Pharmacy on another, and a two-story 1930s-vintage building on the fourth.
Click to expand...

ST: Interesting comparison mentioning Philadelphia here - I am currently there visiting friends and I will further clarify some of what
you have posted: Yes-Philadelphia's Broad Street Subway Line is underutilized to some degree and has never met the potential that
having four tracks from Walnut-Locust in Center City to Broad/Olney in the north could have brought...Imagine what the TTC could
have done if the 1950s era planners designed the Yonge Street Subway with 4 tracks - I believe that those planners had no idea of
the growth of the City and how much ridership would increase over the course of time...

Today Express service operates between Fern Rock Transportation Center at the north end of the line (connection available there
with Lansdale/Doylestown,West Trenton and Warminster Regional Rail Lines) and Walnut-Locust from 5:49am To 6:32pm southbound
and 6:15am to 7:02pm northbound with service every 7 minutes during peak hours and every 12 minutes off-peak. These Express
trains make intermediate stops at Olney,Erie,Girard,Spring Garden,Race-Vine and City Hall on weekdays...

The Broad-Ridge Spur operates as an Express service primarily between Olney and 8th/Market six days a week supplementing the
regular BSL Express service every 7 minutes at peak weekdays and every 20 minutes off peak and all day on Saturdays.
Some trains originate/terminate at Fern Rock TC and trains begins operation during the 5am hour on weekdays - 6am hour
on Saturdays until around 9pm six days...B/R trains also add North Philadelphia (Broad/Lehigh) as an Express stop...

Noteing four track rail lines SEPTA's Paoli RRD Line W has use of four tracks between E of Overbrook and Paoli which is a distance
of about 15 miles and it too has excess capacity and I will add that the Long Island Rail Road gets more use and operates
more trains over the double track Main Line between Queens Village (E of Jamaica) and Hicksville then what SEPTA RRD
schedules over the Paoli/Thorndale Line (its W of Paoli terminal)...

I will also say that SEPTA ridership despite fare increases - which have actually been very moderate or even minimal - has
steadily been increasing since the mid-late 80s and continues to grow despite its funding problems but has a long way to
go to approach NYC,Chicago and Toronto in terms of ridership numbers...This should add insight to this topic...

SEE: www.septa.org and www.shop.septa.org to purchase tokens,passes and other SEPTA items for sale...

LI MIKE
 
Last edited:
Long Island Mike said:
.Imagine what the TTC could have done if the 1950s era planners designed the Yonge Street Subway with 4 tracks - I believe that those planners had no idea of the growth of the City and how much ridership would increase over the course of time...
Click to expand...

Even if they could imagine, they might very well not be able to get their way - the project predicated on funding approved through a referendum, and the built scheme was in itself a pared down version of the original plan.

AoD
 
Perhaps add a short line from Avenue Road Station on Eglinton to Bay Station and head south on Bay. It would at least discourage interchanging at Bloor/Yonge.
 
Long Island Mike said:
ST: Interesting comparison mentioning Philadelphia here - I am currently there visiting friends and I will further clarify some of what
you have posted: Yes-Philadelphia's Broad Street Subway Line is underutilized to some degree and has never met the potential that
having four tracks from Walnut-Locust in Center City to Broad/Olney in the north could have brought...Imagine what the TTC could
have done if the 1950s era planners designed the Yonge Street Subway with 4 tracks - I believe that those planners had no idea of
the growth of the City and how much ridership would increase over the course of time...

Today Express service operates between Fern Rock Transportation Center at the north end of the line (connection available there
with Lansdale/Doylestown,West Trenton and Warminster Regional Rail Lines) and Walnut-Locust from 5:49am To 6:32pm southbound
and 6:15am to 7:02pm northbound with service every 7 minutes during peak hours and every 12 minutes off-peak. These Express
trains make intermediate stops at Olney,Erie,Girard,Spring Garden,Race-Vine and City Hall on weekdays...

The Broad-Ridge Spur operates as an Express service primarily between Olney and 8th/Market six days a week supplementing the
regular BSL Express service every 7 minutes at peak weekdays and every 20 minutes off peak and all day on Saturdays.
Some trains originate/terminate at Fern Rock TC and trains begins operation during the 5am hour on weekdays - 6am hour
on Saturdays until around 9pm six days...B/R trains also add North Philadelphia (Broad/Lehigh) as an Express stop...

Noteing four track rail lines SEPTA's Paoli RRD Line W has use of four tracks between E of Overbrook and Paoli which is a distance
of about 15 miles and it too has excess capacity and I will add that the Long Island Rail Road gets more use and operates
more trains over the double track Main Line between Queens Village (E of Jamaica) and Hicksville then what SEPTA RRD
schedules over the Paoli/Thorndale Line (its W of Paoli terminal)...

I will also say that SEPTA ridership despite fare increases - which have actually been very moderate or even minimal - has
steadily been increasing since the mid-late 80s and continues to grow despite its funding problems but has a long way to
go to approach NYC,Chicago and Toronto in terms of ridership numbers...This should add insight to this topic...

SEE: www.septa.org and www.shop.septa.org to purchase tokens,passes and other SEPTA items for sale...

LI MIKE
Click to expand...
Awesome! Thanks Mike! I know the Bayblon branch of your LIRR is the same?
 
denfromoakvillemilton said:
Awesome! Thanks Mike! I know the Bayblon branch of your LIRR is the same?
Click to expand...

Den: Thanks for the reply...The LIRR Babylon Branch serves the South Shore of Long Island while the Main Line serves the Ronkonkoma/
Greenport,Port Jefferson and Oyster Bay Branches through the center of Long Island...

See: www.mta.info/lirr for starters...

LI MIKE
 
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