adma
Superstar
I dunno, I still get a whiff of "there's a little Doors Open in all of us" re the urban-planning point.
Maybe a stronger issue at hand is the existence of "superior" means to get from St Lawrence to Distillery...
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Should the Toronto Islands be kept as-is?
- Thread starter Ervin
- Start date
I dunno, I still get a whiff of "there's a little Doors Open in all of us" re the urban-planning point.
Maybe a stronger issue at hand is the existence of "superior" means to get from St Lawrence to Distillery...
Exactly what I was thinking. The Portlands represent the single greatest development opportunity in the city. You could fit CityPlace x10 on those lands, with the possibility for some great TOD, new-urbanist, brownfield, basically every planning buzzword you can imagine. An LRT line stretching into the Portlands from Union station would be fantastic for development (specific people take note, I am actually supporting an LRT line). This would get much more use out of places like Cherry Beach and the islands, because the people would be right down the street (or the pedestrian walkway).
Side note, it would be pretty cool having a single waterfront pedestrian path stretching from the Humber River, through downtown, around the harbour into the Portlands, and then a pedestrian bridge between the Portlands and the Islands. Having that kind of network around the Waterfront could be a big thing for Toronto.
Thanos
Active Member
As someone who is planning on moving to TO, construction at the islands would be a terrible decision imo.
Access to the islands needs to be improved. I'm no engineer but what about building a bridge from the mainland to the islands that can be accessed only by bicycles and pedestrians. Would that be possible? It would make a perfect setting for a jog during a nice summer morning.
A couple more restaurants or cafes would be nice but other than that the area is fine the way it is.
Access to the islands needs to be improved. I'm no engineer but what about building a bridge from the mainland to the islands that can be accessed only by bicycles and pedestrians. Would that be possible? It would make a perfect setting for a jog during a nice summer morning.
A couple more restaurants or cafes would be nice but other than that the area is fine the way it is.
Second_in_pie
Senior Member
Just this weekend, I did some biking around Portlands and... I have to admit, I actually like some of the industrial feel. I totally agree about the side facing Toronto (though that view of the downtown skyline from Cherry St. needs to be preserved somehow.) But I think that some sort of clean industry in that area has potential. Otherwise, I wouldn't go too much for a cityplace type development. More like the Beaches, with slightly higher density and more high density avenues, and the occasional higher condo.
That would be a really cool detour of the Martin Goodman trail.
Why yes, it would be quite nice. I agree with most of this, though I still think an LRT (actually just a glorified streetcar this time,) would be great for a loop around the entire island, though that is probably a pipe dream as long as the city continues on it's current path with transit, and as long as the island airport is still open. Once Portlands starts getting developed (or even sooner,) I'll be quite disappointed if there isn't a bridge over to the islands.
SunriseChampion
Senior Member
What the hell could be more interesting than a nice beach? I don't understand people. It's boring because you're boring. Places don't become less boring if you remain as boring as ever. That's the universal law of boringness.
It's unique. That makes it interesting enough. The south side of Wards Island is like Toronto's own cottage country lakeside with only the CN Tower poking out from through the trees to remind one of where they really are.
We should probably do something about that pesky High Park while we're at it. Now that place pisses me off. It's soooo boooooring. Boring trees and boring water and boring grass....booooooring. We need a theme park and casino built there, is what we need. No?
It's unique. That makes it interesting enough. The south side of Wards Island is like Toronto's own cottage country lakeside with only the CN Tower poking out from through the trees to remind one of where they really are.
We should probably do something about that pesky High Park while we're at it. Now that place pisses me off. It's soooo boooooring. Boring trees and boring water and boring grass....booooooring. We need a theme park and casino built there, is what we need. No?
EnviroTO
Senior Member
Just the other day there were fist fights to get to the island and today someone things the island is a waste? Every summer the islands are PACKED. There is the rest of the non-park area of the city to develop on and some 40km of shore line... why on earth would any development proposal need to touch the island? You can build Venice in the port lands or any part of the waterfront or harbourfront... you don't need to Toronto Islands to do it. How is the island a good place for a public transit neighbourhood when there is a large body of water preventing direct north-south access thus necessitating the whole population of the island to exit the island from choke points in the east and west? There are many costal islands in Florida and I can tell you that having density on those islands creates huge traffic jams at the few bridges on and off. The grid network of the city works far better.
SunriseChampion
Senior Member
^I was there when the cops showed up. That story was extremely overblown! THERE WERE NO FISTFIGHTS. THERE WAS NO RIOTING. There were too many people for the Ongiara and the winter timetable, yes, but that's it.
syn
Senior Member
The Islands are great the way they are. Nice getaway in the city, but not in the city.
M II A II R II K
Senior Member
Maybe a new Transportation Hub on the island to relieve Union Station with a tube in the water to send LRTs and shuttle busses through to downtown.
FinchConnection
Active Member
Should Toronto keep Centre Island as it is?
Is it worth it for Toronto to keep the island as is? A vast park with a small number of heritage sites, two marina's, Shopsys which hasn't been financially viable in years and perhaps its worst attraction, Centreville Amusement park (which is outdated and appeals to only a slice of Toronto's tourism industry)?
Having worked there for two years I admired the green space and often after work enjoyed a drink at the marina or a bbq on the beach. However, I feel its potential as both a source of revenue and a destination for tourism could be dramatically increased (all without jeopardizing a large portion of the green space that's present).
I've always envisioned Centre Island as being a no-brain extension to the waterfront Toronto vision with note worthy economic potential. The views facing Toronto are breath taking, the beaches on the south side are equally impressive, the space that centreville amusement currently occupies could be dramatically transformed to accommodate a re-envisioned tourist destination complete with restaurants, entertainment, hotels, vacational homes, nightlife and a small "beach-esque" commercial presence.
Obviously this sort of upgrade would undoubtedly require a land link meaning traffic and some of the empty fields to be developed. I can see the residents of the island absolutely hating this, but I feel our willingness to let Toronto Island slip through the cracks of development should end.
It can be a lucrative destination, at the moment the park is over staffed with city of Toronto employees, it attracts an impressive number of visitors who typically find that there's not much to do once there other than to stroll through the park space. Families with young children going to the amusement park is the main draw at the moment, however, the quality of the park is poor if measured against other destinations in North America or Europe with respect to entertainment value.
It's essentially a bad tourist trap. The owners of the amusement park do not make upgrades because there is little incentive to (profits are good so what's the point?)
Thoughts?
Is it worth it for Toronto to keep the island as is? A vast park with a small number of heritage sites, two marina's, Shopsys which hasn't been financially viable in years and perhaps its worst attraction, Centreville Amusement park (which is outdated and appeals to only a slice of Toronto's tourism industry)?
Having worked there for two years I admired the green space and often after work enjoyed a drink at the marina or a bbq on the beach. However, I feel its potential as both a source of revenue and a destination for tourism could be dramatically increased (all without jeopardizing a large portion of the green space that's present).
I've always envisioned Centre Island as being a no-brain extension to the waterfront Toronto vision with note worthy economic potential. The views facing Toronto are breath taking, the beaches on the south side are equally impressive, the space that centreville amusement currently occupies could be dramatically transformed to accommodate a re-envisioned tourist destination complete with restaurants, entertainment, hotels, vacational homes, nightlife and a small "beach-esque" commercial presence.
Obviously this sort of upgrade would undoubtedly require a land link meaning traffic and some of the empty fields to be developed. I can see the residents of the island absolutely hating this, but I feel our willingness to let Toronto Island slip through the cracks of development should end.
It can be a lucrative destination, at the moment the park is over staffed with city of Toronto employees, it attracts an impressive number of visitors who typically find that there's not much to do once there other than to stroll through the park space. Families with young children going to the amusement park is the main draw at the moment, however, the quality of the park is poor if measured against other destinations in North America or Europe with respect to entertainment value.
It's essentially a bad tourist trap. The owners of the amusement park do not make upgrades because there is little incentive to (profits are good so what's the point?)
Thoughts?
yin_yang
Active Member
i'm in favour of the grass fields and nature. toronto (like pretty much all cities) already has a nature deficit disorder in the downtown core - no big park whatsoever. high park is so far! so, the islands should stay the way they are, more or less, but the amusement park should be redeveloped into something that goes beyond the the waterfront vision - something to do with biomimicry. i live downtown and find myself going insane from the noise and traffic. the islands in the summer is what keeps me around. honestly. if it wasn't for them, i'd move to vancouver.
ibhattac
New Member
i don't see anything wrong with the island. sure, the amusement park could use a little upkeep and i'd much rather a mengrai thai on the island than a shopsy's, but that's me. new york governor's island trust is using our centre island to redevelop governor's island, and the very things you've identified are starting points for them. they're not considering commercial redevelopment in any way, shape, or form (partly for legal reasons) and instead embracing the island precisely as a retreat from urban space. not everything needs to be urban.
adma
Superstar
I agree that there's a flimsiness to Centre Island--then again, in recent years it's become enough of Cold War Commonwealth time capsule that it's almost worth historically cherishing in and of itself...
kkgg7
Banned
I think improvement should be in order.
Sure many will claim it is beautiful as it is and things should remain intact. That's just backward thinking - these people will prefer everything to remain unchanged. They would prefer Toronto to be all Victorian houses outside the CDB. Toronto islands have such great potential to be a more accessible urban park. Its current status is by no means satisfactory.
The islands first needs to be more accessible. Even living downtown, south of Queen st, I find it too troublesome to get to the islands. Central Park in New York, Hyde Park in London, or Luxemburg park in Paris are all extremely accesible. The islands being islands is partly the issue, but not quite. Just to get to Bay/Queen's Quay is enough trouble, and you need to pass a lot of unpleasant things. Most would need to take a subway to union, and transfer to a streetcar underground...
Second, the island needs to offer more value. Right now, it doesn't live up to its potential, not even 50% of it. Leaving it as natural as it is is not the way to go. A lot of upkeep and beautification work needs to be done. Much of the land remains unused (I don't mean building KFC's or condos of course) and needs skillful design. We are blessed with such a big and beautiful island right to the edge of downtown, yet it only functions as a getway from the city and its cars, noise and buildings. Simply not enough. We should expect more.
As to the islands residents, they would always selfishly prefer noboy ever steps into the island, or no development is ever done so that they can have it all to themselves. Forget what they want. If they want pure quietness, why not move out of the GTA, there is plenty out there.
Sure many will claim it is beautiful as it is and things should remain intact. That's just backward thinking - these people will prefer everything to remain unchanged. They would prefer Toronto to be all Victorian houses outside the CDB. Toronto islands have such great potential to be a more accessible urban park. Its current status is by no means satisfactory.
The islands first needs to be more accessible. Even living downtown, south of Queen st, I find it too troublesome to get to the islands. Central Park in New York, Hyde Park in London, or Luxemburg park in Paris are all extremely accesible. The islands being islands is partly the issue, but not quite. Just to get to Bay/Queen's Quay is enough trouble, and you need to pass a lot of unpleasant things. Most would need to take a subway to union, and transfer to a streetcar underground...
Second, the island needs to offer more value. Right now, it doesn't live up to its potential, not even 50% of it. Leaving it as natural as it is is not the way to go. A lot of upkeep and beautification work needs to be done. Much of the land remains unused (I don't mean building KFC's or condos of course) and needs skillful design. We are blessed with such a big and beautiful island right to the edge of downtown, yet it only functions as a getway from the city and its cars, noise and buildings. Simply not enough. We should expect more.
As to the islands residents, they would always selfishly prefer noboy ever steps into the island, or no development is ever done so that they can have it all to themselves. Forget what they want. If they want pure quietness, why not move out of the GTA, there is plenty out there.
SMC
New Member
I took my kid to Toronto centre Island last week. It has been years since we went, and thought that it would be nice to go down memory lane. What we got is old, tired and lame. Poorly maintained - old decrepit rides - poor staffing - poor maintenance- poor food - BIG price. Yet another Canadian icon that has been forgotton and left to rot, because of poor management and money. I think they should change it ASAP.