JGHali
Active Member
I don't know, I'm not sure many would shrink from tossing insults at Hamilton...
|
|
|
Seven ways to make Toronto a world-class city again
- Thread starter blacktrojan3921
- Start date
I don't know, I'm not sure many would shrink from tossing insults at Hamilton...
Tewder
Senior Member
Oh come on, that's a ridiculous comment. It's already been demonstrated that Atlanta ran a profitable games that left a legacy. Was it 100% perfect? Of course not, but Atlanta achieved its objectives and its vision (whether your agree with what those things were or not)... and Toronto can achieve its vision, which will be very different!
If anything, Atlanta can be accused of not capitalizing on/leveraging the olympic games enough.
TheTigerMaster
Superstar
Classic inferiority complex.
animatronic
Senior Member
"My girlfriend said 'kiss me somewhere dirty', so I drove her to Hamilton"
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Not to be sarcastic or anything, but just what are Atlanta's objectives, other than landing the games? Certainly on the marketing front - poor organization and crazed nutbar bombing the park - it left plenty to be desired. I take Barcelona, Sydney as London as examples to follow, not Athens, and definitely not Atlanta.
AoD
Tewder
Senior Member
Oh I agree with you, which is why I feel it is problematic to make a blanket statement like 'the olympics are bad' or even 'the olympics are good'. There are only degrees of badness and goodness and it really differs from host city to host city. I happen to believe there is much potential for good in Toronto.
... and I wouldn't want the Atlanta games scenario here either, but this doesn't mean their games were a failure and it doesn't somehow support the notion that Toronto shouldn't bid. Their games were a success when assessed through the lens of what they wanted to achieve, i.e. a largely privately funded event that breaks even. They may not have ended up with a Barcelona waterfront but that was never really ever going to happen realistically. They achieved some legacy infrastructure that is still in place, they promoted their city, they enjoyed the event, and they achieved improvements to the public realm. It was twenty years ago, it's fair to suggest they might approach the games very differently if doing it again today in a context like Toronto's.
WislaHD
Superstar
We have a very risk-averse culture in Toronto. I think it is a legacy of our city's protestant background, which surprisingly has managed to be retained in certain aspects with newer generations and with new waves of immigrants.
Agreed. I'll say it before, I'll say it again. The two cities that are the most comparable to Toronto are Sydney and Melbourne. As a result of rare historical circumstances, these two cities not only share a very similar historical, cultural, economic, social and political context to Toronto but are also of equivalent size and global influence. These are the cities I view as on par with what Toronto has to offer. Not Vancouver. (Or Singapore/Hong Kong as others were discussing on this page)
We should be seeking to emulate Sydney/Melbourne in their successes and learn from their failures. For instance, in the Shabby Public Realm thread, someone who visited Sydney recently commented about how over there the state of the public realm is pristine. We should ask, why is that the case over there and what can we do about it here.
Adjei
Senior Member
I think the leaders here need to recognize it's a problem. Right now it's not even on their radar and they have the most ability to change things.
GenerationW
Senior Member
What's so fascinating about it? Smaller cities and towns dumping on big cities isn't unique to Canada.
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Not surprising in some ways - as an immigrant I can tell you that the motivation for choosing Canada over other countries is often based on safety and security (which we have in abundance). That creates a very strong self-selecting factor.
I think it's a matter of setting and climate - an appreciation of beauty in the natural environment early on creates a culture of nurturing and maintaining a high quality public realm. Having a robust international tourism sector also drives the need to look good. In the Australian context, we are more like Sydney in terms of our economy but more like Melbourne in terms of urban structure. We do have the bonus of having a higher population overall density than both I believe.
AoD
allabootmatt
Senior Member
I confess to having never visited Australia. But aren't both Sydney and Melbourne very, very suburban, outside their CBDs? Based on my (admittedly imperfect) StreetView perusal, the cores do indeed look glorious...while the public realm in more outlying areas looks basically like Toronto's.
WislaHD
Superstar
I've unfortunately never been either, but my understanding is that they are both a bit more sprawled than we are (and we are quite sprawled). Although development patterns in Melbourne in particular are interesting as they've retained their streetcars (and extended their streetcar lines out into their suburbs) creating streetcar oriented suburbs far from the core. (Streetcar suburb legacy is another thing we share in common with Melbourne, though they've seem to have taken it to the extreme)
But, I believe the comparison being made is core for core. The suburbs of any American/Canadian/Australian city are going to look ' basically like Toronto's '.
TheTigerMaster
Superstar
7 ways to make Toronto a world class city? Here's an 8th way. You see all the non-sporting events that Toronto has been putting on for Pan Ams? Do that every summer and all summer. This city has never been as vibrant as its been during TO2015.
SunriseChampion
Senior Member
^ Seriously! Free shows at NPS every day. Blowing up the CN Tower on the weekly standard. And can we get rid of these noise bylaws? Last night, I sat outside the gates of Fort York for Die Antwoord and they got vexed as they were abruptly shut down at 11. We got vexed as well.
WislaHD
Superstar
Making OpenStreetsTO all day rather than just the morning, and every Sunday during the summer would be a nice thing too.