PM Mark Carney's Canada

[zang]

Silence speaks volumes as they say. Especially when the same lot are far more noisy for lesser transgressions elsewhere.

That's a garbage argument and you know it.

 

[picard102]

Silence speaks volumes as they say. Especially when the same lot are far more noisy for lesser transgressions elsewhere.

So you have no examples and just made it up. Thanks for clearing that up.

But I'm also not one who thinks "River to the sea" is acceptable.

Only when palestinians do it, or does this extend to the Lukid party as well?

 

[Full Metal Junkie]

But that kind of nuance gets me labeled as "centrist".

Centrist?? Any level of nuance that goes against the "I support the current thing" echo chamber, and you're labeled a full-blown conservative. Case in point, addressed at you:

Nice to see conservatives already panicking to come up with fibs to tell.

Expecting nuanced thinking from this crowd is too much to ask. You either buy into the narrative, or you're the enemy.

 

[picard102]

Centrist?? Any level of nuance that goes against the "I support the current thing" echo chamber, and you're labeled a full-blown conservative. Case in point, addressed at you:


Expecting nuanced thinking from this crowd is too much to ask. You either buy into the narrative, or you're the enemy.

Telling that you think the "current thing" is being opposed to genocide.

 

[Full Metal Junkie]

Telling that you think the "current thing" is being opposed to genocide.

No one has a problem with you opposing the genocide of Palestinians in Gaza.

The problem with "I support the current thing" crowd is how selective they are in what they oppose. There is a single genocide that matters to them at the moment. All the other genocides don't exist to them (at best) or they actively turn a blind eye to them (at worst). Case in point: January 8 massacre of Iranians - complete silence from the "current thing" crowd. The massacre of 100K+ people in El Fasher in October also don't tickle the "current thing" fancy.

And don't get me started on the October 7 massacre of Israelis by Hamas. That inconvenient event has been completely repressed from the collective memories of the "I support the current thing" folks.

Once you start to selectively care for lives of some people, while ignoring the suffering of others, there is no space for nuance left in your worldview. It becomes a black-and-white us-vs-them reality.

 

[CMQSD402F9011]

No one has a problem with you opposing the genocide of Palestinians in Gaza.

The problem with "I support the current thing" crowd is how selective they are in what they oppose. There is a single genocide that matters to them at the moment. All the other genocides don't exist to them (at best) or they actively turn a blind eye to them (at worst). Case in point: January 8 massacre of Iranians - complete silence from the "current thing" crowd. The massacre of 100K+ people in El Fasher in October also don't tickle the "current thing" fancy.

And don't get me started on the October 7 massacre of Israelis by Hamas. That inconvenient event has been completely repressed from the collective memories of the "I support the current thing" folks.

Once you start to selectively care for lives of some people, while ignoring the suffering of others, there is no space for nuance left in your worldview. It becomes a black-and-white us-vs-them reality.

Wouldn’t the same people “I support the current thing” forget about 9/11(?) for October 7th it could’ve been prevented if Netanyahu was warned of empowering Hamas by allowing Qatari money into Gaza.

 

[81-717]

Seriously, what the hell are you talking about?

What part of being for principles such as socialized healthcare and housing and being against war and letting corporations run amock and destroy the lives of the working class means that you're fine with atrocities committed by religious fanatics? Have you ever bothered to actually inquire about what leftists believe, or are you just listening to fearmongering from Fox News and Infowars?

The wave of atrocities in Europe within the past decade (and, if you recall, almost happened here too, more recently) perpetrated by religious fanatics that were allowed to infiltrate in large numbers thanks to the open borders policy (as well as crap like this, this and this) speaks louder than words about what those in power (be it the left or the far left) "believe".

The inability of western countries to look after their citizens is not something you can reasonable ascribe to leftists, since, as I noted before, most of those countries are already run by conservatives pretending to be progressive. It's institutional incompetence. And I still want to see those left wingers who are okay with the kind of violence to which you are referring.

Institutional incompetence of those in power, who you're defending (maybe some of the affected countries are run by conservatives now, after the overly liberal policies mentioned above caused a massive shift in approval ratings).

Wouldn’t the same people “I support the current thing” forget about 9/11(?)

I'm sure they forgot, or think it was an "inside job", or that it was justified, or all of the above.

You know, it's funny how just a short while ago you were on here complaining about people using "right wing" as an insult, but you have no problems with doing the same thing to left wingers

You're quite spot-on to notice that, and there's a reason I do that now: using their own tactic against them (since I have no expectation they'll stop doing it themselves).

 

[Full Metal Junkie]

Wouldn’t the same people “I support the current thing” forget about 9/11(?) for October 7th it could’ve been prevented if Netanyahu was warned of empowering Hamas by allowing Qatari money into Gaza.

To be fair, Israeli policy towards Palestine in general and Netanyahu politics in particular are very much complicit in October 7th attacks. The way they treated Palestinians for decades lead to Hamas becoming what it is and for their ideology becoming as radicalized as it is. However, that does not excuse what Hamas did on October 7th in any way. Nor does it make it okay to pretend it never happened.

 

[picard102]

All the other genocides don't exist to them (at best) or they actively turn a blind eye to them (at worst). Case in point: January 8 massacre of Iranians - complete silence from the "current thing" crowd. The massacre of 100K+ people in El Fasher in October also don't tickle the "current thing" fancy.

Sounds like another thing you've made up in your own head about people you disagree with.

 

[Full Metal Junkie]

Sounds like another thing you've made up in your own head about people you disagree with.

Sounds like me summarizing actual opinions of actual UT forum members that made their views on the subject very clear.

 

[CMQSD402F9011]

To be fair, Israeli policy towards Palestine in general and Netanyahu politics in particular are very much complicit in October 7th attacks. The way they treated Palestinians for decades lead to Hamas becoming what it is and for their ideology becoming as radicalized as it is. However, that does not excuse what Hamas did on October 7th in any way. Nor does it make it okay to pretend it never happened.

Many people don’t see Hamas as freedom fighters in this time. Lastly this isn’t the 80s when the mujahideen of Afghanistan was considered freedom fighters back then.

 

[T3G]

The wave of atrocities in Europe within the past decade (and, if you recall, almost happened here too, more recently) perpetrated by religious fanatics that were allowed to infiltrate in large numbers thanks to the open borders policy (as well as crap like this, this and this) speaks louder than words about what those in power (be it the left or the far left) "believe".

Institutional incompetence of those in power, who you're defending (maybe some of the affected countries are run by conservatives now, after the overly liberal policies mentioned above caused a massive shift in approval ratings).

I'm sure they forgot, or think it was an "inside job", or that it was justified, or all of the above.

You know, it's funny how just a short while ago you were on here complaining about people using "right wing" as an insult, but you have no problems with doing the same thing to left wingers, completely misrepresenting what they actually believe and blaming them for everything wrong in current society. Methinks that if you engage in tribalistic shit flinging, there is a risk you may get some of it on yourself.

 

[Northern Light]

To all above posters; you're going to get this thread locked and wipe out important and informative discussion of actual public policy in Canada with this nonsensical back and forth that has little or nothing to do with actual public policy.

Please note Israel is not a province of Canada, Gaza is not a province of Canada, Immigration policies in Europe are widely varied by country, but none of those countries are provinces of Canada.

Lets please exercise some restraint here.

This thread is to discuss actual public policy, laws, and budgets of the Federal Government of Canada. Incidental mention of other other countries in discussion of foreign policy or in informing discussion of effective public policy at home with comparisons is fair game; the odd tangent is to be expected; but tangents need to end.

 

[narduch]

Carney was bragging to Ford that he is more Conservative

 

[thettctransitfanatic]

Carney was bragging to Ford that he is more Conservative

Was it really bragging though? Like, be for real, here. Or more, as I see, belitting and joking with Ford since the right thinks he's a Liberal.