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Ontario Line North of Eglinton (was Relief Line North) (Speculation)

Northern Light said:
The problem w/the idea is simply that on a surface route, with moderate transit priority and a roughly similar number of stops to the current/proposed 'Rapid TO' route shows next to no improvement in travel time.

To achieve an improvement would require fewer stops and more grade-separation, which in turn would drive the cost higher.
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The idea that the business case for an LRT system crumbles once you paint some lanes on that corridor red is pretty wild... especially since I don't think the RapidTO Eglinton lanes have actually made a significant difference in travel times. I'm not sure what to blame here... flawed business case methodology? The wrong transit mode in the wrong place? Politicians pushing the EELRT despite its limited benefits?
 
The main meaningful difference between LRT and BRT is the capacity of the vehicles*. We need that capacity on Finch West. Not so much on Eglinton East.


*other advantages include cheaper operation due to using electricity, lower noise, a smoother ride, and allowing cheaper future growth by simply coupling vehicles together, which doesn't need an extra driver vs adding a bus, which does
 
duffo said:
The idea that the business case for an LRT system crumbles once you paint some lanes on that corridor red is pretty wild... especially since I don't think the RapidTO Eglinton lanes have actually made a significant difference in travel times. I'm not sure what to blame here... flawed business case methodology? The wrong transit mode in the wrong place? Politicians pushing the EELRT despite its limited benefits?
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The Rapid TO comparison features a reduced number of stops vs the previous Eglinton/Morningside Bus. It nominally requires bus priority, but also likely saw some traffic reduction due to Covid which allowed for expedited travel times, making the comparison a bit more hazy.

Still, changing mode alone doesn't drive travel time, improved average speed between stops, and lower total dwell time, along with less time at Red Lights drive that.

These things always require assumptions which can be, and sometimes are, very flawed; you have to delve into the nuts and bolts of the BCA to see that with which you might agree or disagree.
 
chrisw said:
Jun 29. 2023
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Elections are coming up in 2 years.. I am sure Ford is prepping for his new transit expansion plan (i.e OL North Extension, SSE, Hamilton LRT, Crosstown West Extension to Pearson) I wonder which other make the cut, perhaps EELRT? or Waterfront East LRT? Any others?
 
toronto647 said:
Elections are coming up in 2 years.. I am sure Ford is prepping for his new transit expansion plan (i.e OL North Extension, SSE, Hamilton LRT, Crosstown West Extension to Pearson) I wonder which other make the cut, perhaps EELRT? or Waterfront East LRT? Any others?
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Ford won’t touch surface LRTs. In the case of the EELRT, I think this is for the best.. but the Waterfront East LRT languishing is a shame.
 
jcam said:
I've heard they're looking at Sheppard East and West.
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I've heard that LRT isn't out the window just yet too. Honestly, I can come around to the idea so long as it is a continuous line from Sheppard West to Sheppard East/McCowan. No Linear transfers and it can be what Eglinton is supposed to be in a more appropriate context. While I think we'd have growing pains with this if we do make it LRT, at least it's possible in a reasonable timeframe.

Worth noting the Ford Government's aversion to new LRTs, and also that they are willing to throw around the phrase quite loosely. Recall the "interregional LRT" in the MTO's GGH 2051 Plan is almost certainly going to be Ontario Line style Light Metro. The point being, LRT's definition is sometimes broadened to everything short of a TTC Rocket. I would cautiously assume they do mean at-grade LRT right now for fear of being let down, but a ploy to weave (and perhaps interline) Line 4 into the Ontario Line would certainly not be unwelcome.
 
Sunnyside said:
I've heard that LRT isn't out the window just yet too. Honestly, I can come around to the idea so long as it is a continuous line from Sheppard West to Sheppard East/McCowan. No Linear transfers and it can be what Eglinton is supposed to be in a more appropriate context. While I think we'd have growing pains with this if we do make it LRT, at least it's possible in a reasonable timeframe.

Worth noting the Ford Government's aversion to new LRTs, and also that they are willing to throw around the phrase quite loosely. Recall the "interregional LRT" in the MTO's GGH 2051 Plan is almost certainly going to be Ontario Line style Light Metro. The point being, LRT's definition is sometimes broadened to everything short of a TTC Rocket. I would cautiously assume they do mean at-grade LRT right now for fear of being let down, but a ploy to weave (and perhaps interline) Line 4 into the Ontario Line would certainly not be unwelcome.
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Sheppard will be subway from Sheppard West to McCowan - LRT is dead on that stretch
 
Cobra said:
Sheppard will be subway from Sheppard West to McCowan - LRT is dead on that stretch
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Where else would LRT supposedly go then? If it’s being looked at presumably they see some stretches of Sheppard where it’s appropriate. If not the planned E/W extensions, then where? Beyond these?
 
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