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Only Pricing Congestion Can Stop Congestion

If you increase capacity, people aren't going to magically appear and fill it up.

To believe this, you also have to believe that congestion of roadways does not factor into people's decisions about which trips to make. If, on the other hand, congestion does factor into people's decisions, there's really no way around the conclusion that (all else equal) decreasing congestion on a roadway will make people more likely to redirect trips to that road, and to make new trips by car that they otherwise would not have made (by car, or at all).

That's in the short term. In the medium term, if a road is less congested it will mean people will be more willing to make longer trips for commuting purposes, and some will move to take advantage of the situation.

I'm not aware of many cities that have been able to build "enough" roads, which ought to be possible if induced demand isn't a thing. Buffalo is the only one I know of, but they got there through a large scale of both road-building and center-city population decline.
 
If you increase capacity, people aren't going to magically appear and fill it up.

Yes they will appear. But not because of magic.


It gets filled up because either it wasn't expanded enough to meet demand, or the population increased causing it to fill up.

In a large city like Toronto, there will always be more potential car drivers than any capacity you could provide that would have little congestion. Those who choose not to drive because they find the congestion levels unsuitable, will simply start driving again until the congestion is the same as it was before.

This will happen even if the population remains static, and obviously more quickly if the population is increasing. But this equilibrium will happen.

But it's all a moot point, as the city can't expand its road network, which already covers more than 27% of the city's land mass.

All we can do is make better use of what we have, which means giving priority to those who make more efficient use of this limited resource....public transit, pedestrians & cyclists. At the moment, we still let the least efficient users of the roadways take up 99% of it. Car drivers don't have to get off the road, they just have to start paying more to use it. And one of the fastest ways to free up road space is to stop using 1/3 to 1/2 of it for storing cars.
 
Yes they will appear. But not because of magic.




In a large city like Toronto, there will always be more potential car drivers than any capacity you could provide that would have little congestion. Those who choose not to drive because they find the congestion levels unsuitable, will simply start driving again until the congestion is the same as it was before.

This will happen even if the population remains static, and obviously more quickly if the population is increasing. But this equilibrium will happen.

But it's all a moot point, as the city can't expand its road network, which already covers more than 27% of the city's land mass.

All we can do is make better use of what we have, which means giving priority to those who make more efficient use of this limited resource....public transit, pedestrians & cyclists. At the moment, we still let the least efficient users of the roadways take up 99% of it. Car drivers don't have to get off the road, they just have to start paying more to use it. And one of the fastest ways to free up road space is to stop using 1/3 to 1/2 of it for storing cars.

I'll assume you didn't read my last paragraph...
 
Thought I mentioned this in an earlier post, but I do not understand why urban scholars hold Lewis Mumford in such high regard. Yes, he had some excellent points about making cities livable and socially engaging. But he seems to champion small towns and villages to urban areas, and downplays the importance of how such design could function economically.
 
But it's all a moot point, as the city can't expand its road network, which already covers more than 27% of the city's land mass.

Can you provide a source for this number? Seems like about 10X my casual observations.


And one of the fastest ways to free up road space is to stop using 1/3 to 1/2 of it for storing cars.

Aside from inner city residential streets where this may be true and considered a good thing, these numbers are silly. Your prejudices are showing.
 
Can you provide a source for this number? Seems like about 10X my casual observations.

From the City of Toronto website.....

there are 10,033 different streets or, 5,365 km of road (streets, expressways, ramps and laneways) covering 27.4 per cent of the city's area


Aside from inner city residential streets where this may be true and considered a good thing, these numbers are silly.

Main arterial streets have parking on both sides, as do secondary arterial streets. Even when there is no parking allowed on one side during rush hours, most of these streets have congestion at other times and weekends. The 1/3 - 1/2 (4-6 lane wide streets) is accurate. When it comes to arterial streets, we have to make our minds up whether we want to use them for travelling or parking, but trying to do both lowers capacity significantly.

As for residential streets, I suppose it's a good thing if you want to own a car and park it for free or very cheap on public property. This encourages car ownership (and multiple car ownership) in the city by subsidizing it. Go ahead and do it...we just need to start charging more for it. There should be no such thing as "free" parking anywhere on public property.

Speaking of residential streets, now that our main and secondary arterial streets are congested, the residential streets that were never meant to be used as commuting arterial streets are now being used as such. These are "loopholes" some drivers use as shortcuts around congested arterial streets. A few of these streets have time restricted use for non local cars, but it needs to be widely implemented.


Your prejudices are showing.

I'm not trying to hide them.
 
It's the Parking, Stupid: One Transportation Consultant's Tough Love Approach


Read More: http://www.theatlanticcities.com/commute/2011/10/its_parking_stupid/323/


.....

The Atlantic Cities had 20 minutes to spare this week at the Rail~Volution conference in Washington, where Tumlin was preaching some of his painful parking innovation. And so we asked for the full story. Tumlin starts with another great metaphor: What would happen if we gave all children free ice cream? They would, undoubtedly, be thrilled. But in the process we’d also be creating obesity, driving up the price of milk, and probably causing a cheese shortage. “And just as it would be very bad economic and social policy to provide free ice cream for all children,” Tumlin says, “it is also bad to provide free parking for all motorists.”

- In his search for parking policy that truly reflects the market demand and value of a 9-by-20-foot strip of asphalt, Tumlin sounds a lot like an economist. In fact, he thinks we’d be better off thinking of transportation as a branch of economics rather than engineering. For years, cities have told people that they have to pay for parking meters to create more money for general funds, as if those quarters were a kind of tax. That logic obscures the fact that people should pay for parking because parking in and of itself has a cost – and because by charging for parking, cities create parking availability, which is the real commodity.

- And because people tend to highly value their time, they’re generally happier to pay more for a parking spot right in front of a store than to pay less for a spot that requires 10 minutes of circling. This makes customers happier, and it also facilitates a larger number of people – some of whom now come on bike or transit – getting in and out of a popular shopping district. When cities raise parking prices in partnership with local businesses, they can explain that such policies exist to create more successful commercial districts. And the city as a whole, Tumlin says, is going to make a lot more money off having successful commercial districts than it ever will off of its parking meters.

- Technology, meanwhile, can take advantage of changes in supply and demand by the hour, or the season, or even according to swells in the national economy, adjusting parking rates according to real-time availability. San Francisco is rolling out such a strategy this month. All of this technology is making it easier to address parking pricing. But the technology has also been around for a few years, even as old assumptions about parking have continued to persist. “Technology,” Tumlin says, “has made it even more embarrassing for the cities that are badly managing their parking.”

- As these systems move parking toward a more market-responsive approach, Tumlin also has his eye on distortions such as the free parking given at disabled spaces. “Disabled people,” he says, “don’t need to have their parking subsidized unless they are low-income and disabled.” It makes no sense, he adds, to give free parking to a disabled doctor or lawyer. But we’re not very good, Tumlin says, at having grown-up conversations about how to accommodate people with disabilities. Washington, D.C., will test this idea later this year with an everyone-pays policy (which will require, among other things, some newly designed parking meters).

- Tumlin commonly hears one other objection to his ideas: Where will the poor people park? The poorest people, he’s found, aren’t looking for parking because they don’t own cars. But among the rest of this demographic, he says surveys show that poor people also place an extremely high value on their time. They too often say they’re willing to pay a little more for parking if it means they don’t have to waste time looking for it. “It’s very interesting to do the detailed demographic surveys and ask people what they want,” he says. “And what we find again and again is that the people who are complaining about ‘oh my goodness, where will the poor people park?’ are not the poor people.”

.....




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Yes they will appear. But not because of magic.




In a large city like Toronto, there will always be more potential car drivers than any capacity you could provide that would have little congestion. Those who choose not to drive because they find the congestion levels unsuitable, will simply start driving again until the congestion is the same as it was before.

This will happen even if the population remains static, and obviously more quickly if the population is increasing. But this equilibrium will happen.

But it's all a moot point, as the city can't expand its road network, which already covers more than 27% of the city's land mass.

All we can do is make better use of what we have, which means giving priority to those who make more efficient use of this limited resource....public transit, pedestrians & cyclists. At the moment, we still let the least efficient users of the roadways take up 99% of it. Car drivers don't have to get off the road, they just have to start paying more to use it. And one of the fastest ways to free up road space is to stop using 1/3 to 1/2 of it for storing cars.

I think that there are a fair number of US cities, particularly mid-sized ones, that have "enough roads" in the sense that although they may have a moderate degree of traffic congestion, rush hour traffic is fairly mild certainly compared to Toronto, despite lack of road tolling. While there are certainly a number of US cities (LA, Washington, NYC are especially notorious) with traffic as bad or worse than Toronto, many others like Las Vegas, Oklohoma City, Tulsa, etc. seem to have managed to build enough roads to mostly satisfy demand. Even certain European cities like Madrid (except for the M30 in the downtown core) suffer from fairly mild rush hour traffic congestion. Look at the "predicted traffic" feature on Google Maps. The key seems to be (a) building lots of roads relative to a city's population (b) low density OR very good transit as in the case in Madrid. On the other hand cities with few roads per capita and/or high density often suffer from severe congestion despite good transit - e.g. London, Paris, Shanghai. In the case of Toronto traffic congestion results not only from the lousy transit system but the relative lack of roads in the core - notice that the worst congested roads (Gardiner, DVP, 401) are in areas where other expressways were planned but not built (Richview, Crosstown, Spadina, Scarborough). Obviously building these expressways is infeasible because land costs are too high now, so very costly tunneling would be needed, thus transit is the only viable option for reducing congestion.
 
Las Vegas, Oklohoma City, Tulsa, etc. seem to have managed to build enough roads to mostly satisfy demand.

Yes....if we depopulated the GTA by about 5 million people, we would probably lick the congestion issue quite nicely. I just don't know if that is a very practical solution.


In the case of Toronto traffic congestion results not only from the lousy transit system but the relative lack of roads in the core

A: Toronto does not have a "lousy" transit system. Toronto has good ridership per capita as well as a high rate of "choice" riders. Especially in the core. We also have high density TOD development....and not just in the core.
B: Toronto certainly does not have a relative lack of roads....anywhere.

And those unbuilt expressways would not have solved any problems...they would have made the current problem worse. The 407 was a smart move....build another cross-town expressway far enough from the core....and toll it. That expressway works quite nicely and doesn't cause city streets to be clogged.
 
But it's all a moot point, as the city can't expand its road network, which already covers more than 27% of the city's land mass.

I looked that up and noticed that that figure includes lanes, expressways, ramps etc. Considering that the portion of the road allowances in Toronto paved and available for autos is probably about 35% OF THE 27% OR 10% of the City and much of that is designated as a no parking zone.

It appears that if the City road allowances constitute 27% of the land area but only 35% of those allowances are currently paved there is lots of room for expansion. I know that this is a goofy numbers game but I didn't start it.
 
It appears that if the City road allowances constitute 27% of the land area but only 35% of those allowances are currently paved there is lots of room for expansion.

Perhaps you could provide the link to where it states that 65% of the 27% are unused "allowances". At any rate, we could take up more of the Don Valley for expressways. But would we want to? We could do to residential streets like Palmerston what we did to Jarvis...remove all frontages & trees so we can increase the amount of congested streets. But would we want to?

But where does this 65% unused allowance exist on streets like King? It doesn't.

And if you really want to increase driving capacity on city streets, their is no need to use these "unpaved allowances" you seem to think is there, or the huge cost of building it.....just use the already 30%-50% paved part we use to store cars.

Increasing expressway capacity is possible, but to what end? They would infringe on the urban environment in a negative way, and make the congestion problems on our city streets worse...not better. We would be encouraging our 905 neighbours to continue their bad habits and paying for it, rather than force them to change their bad habits. Let them use their own tax dollars to build transit infrastructure and their municipal governments to design sustainable urban environments that can support it. At the moment, they rely on the provincial government to solve their transit commuting problems, and do little themselves.

The 905 is like the Cluster B of urban personalities.....they continually screw everything up, and rely on everyone else to bail them out. And like a Cluster B person, they never seem to learn from their mistakes and the only real solution is to...amputate them.
 
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If the problems are caused by people coming from 905, then perhaps the solution is to pay downtown businesses to move to Mississauga, taking their related congestion problems with them. If people no longer commuted to work in Toronto, there would be a lot less congestion.
 
If the problems are caused by people coming from 905, then perhaps the solution is to pay downtown businesses to move to Mississauga, taking their related congestion problems with them. If people no longer commuted to work in Toronto, there would be a lot less congestion.

Or maybe the solution is not to subsidize their resource-intensive drive into downtown through free use of highways?
 
perhaps the solution is to pay downtown businesses to move to Mississauga, taking their related congestion problems with them.

Oh...we already did that. We decided to charge downtown businesses higher taxes so we could pay for things like transit infrastructure to serve their employees and customers.

But then suburbs like Mississauga decided they could lure away businesses with cheaper taxes, because they would invest nothing in transit infrastructure. Now that these badly built suburbs are now cities in themselves with upwards of 3/4 million population and traffic congestion as bad as downtown, with basically no transit infrastructure and a built environment that would never make it sustainable anyway, are faced with charging higher taxes to make up for decades of neglect.

Now those businesses are thinking Toronto isn't so bad, and the lure of "downtown" and all its little advantages are becoming attractive again to their customers and perspective employees, who are choosing to live and play where they work.
 

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