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MoveOntario 2020: GO Transit Electrification

Filip said:
Dear God did you look at the timeframe at the end of the document? I'll be in my 50s by the time this is finished!
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I thought those were going to be quarters, but they're years! They're projecting almost a forty-year timeline to get it all done!
 
Filip said:
I truly don't think it should take more than 5 years to electrify the whole network.. This is pathetic.
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It's the cost of electrification. They need to spread out the cost over the years. Unless circumstances (such as fuel prices) force a speedup, but the cost will then have to be done in a shorter timeframe.
 
W. K. Lis said:
It's the cost of electrification. They need to spread out the cost over the years. Unless circumstances (such as fuel prices) force a speedup, but the cost will then have to be done in a shorter timeframe.
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The document points to ~$4 billion to electrify the entire network.. I see no reason this shouldn't be done by 2020, it's not like it will cost 20+ billion.
 
Filip said:
The document points to ~$4 billion to electrify the entire network.. I see no reason this shouldn't be done by 2020, it's not like it will cost 20+ billion.
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But will the provincial government be willing to swallow that cost up front? I really doubt so, more so with the PCs in Ontario.

Spreading the costs over the years will help make the project more palatable to the province, even though they'll be paying the same price anyways later. Anyways, I really doubt it will take that long to electrify the entire track, if the political climate is more favorable. Ten to 25 years at most.
 
Filip said:
The document points to ~$4 billion to electrify the entire network.. I see no reason this shouldn't be done by 2020, it's not like it will cost 20+ billion.
Click to expand...

Let's get all the electricians to abandon their work they are currently doing (housing, maintenance, and other projects) and tell them they can only work on electrifying the GO trains. They would be forbidden to work at anything else.

Not likely.
 
W. K. Lis said:
Let's get all the electricians to abandon their work they are currently doing (housing, maintenance, and other projects) and tell them they can only work on electrifying the GO trains. They would be forbidden to work at anything else.

Not likely.
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I don't see why they can't hire more from elsewhere for the interim period building the lines.

If Metrolinx manages to advertise this as a GTA project and gets the Ontario Conservatives completely on board, this project should likely take off pretty soon. I could see the study work being done before the Pan Am Games, with construction beginning soon afterwards.
 
Filip said:
I truly don't think it should take more than 5 years to electrify the whole network.. This is pathetic.
Click to expand...

Maybe you should actually read the thing...

Based on the analysis to date, the following phasing factors need to be considered:

1. A phased approach is required:
• To minimize disruption to existing operations and future service.
• To ensure integrated planning with the Reference Case infrastructure improvements.
• To build expertise in the conversion process on a portion of a corridor and then proceed incrementally in a logical sequence.

2. Constructability and approval processes need to be carefully mapped out:
• Design and approval would be a lengthy process (3 - 4 years) due to complexity, the need for community engagement on issues like the location of hydro sub-stations, visual impacts and significant field work to identify the infrastructure needs, including the grounding of all metal objects within and adjacent to the right-of-way.
• Design for electrification should be integrated into future projects
• Construction is quicker and cheaper while train volumes and service levels are lower.
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There are a thousand other tidbits sprinkled throughout the report explaining why this and that should be done, and when they should be done. They also explain that even if the entire system were electrified tomorrow, several lines would see virtually no benefit, so there's no rush anyway.

Remember, this was prepared by professionals from the real world that know what they're talking about. It's not a Rob Ford "Sheppard Subway by 2015" or whatever.
 
Interesting that Option 11 (Lakeshore, Georgetown and Milton) would be similarly beneficial to Option 3 I think it was (Lakeshore and Georgetown).
 
I was surprised that they wouldn't be able to electrify the ARL before the Pan-Am games. I would have thought they would have been a priority. Not having an air-rail link in place before then is going to be an embarrassment for Toronto.
 
The way I read the report seemed to imply that the ARL would be built as scheduled, but then converted to electric something like 2 or 3 years later.
 
The EA is the time delay for starting construction.

There is too many bridges that will have to be modify before trains can run under them for the Pan-Am games as well building the new tracks.

There is nothing stopping Metrolinx doing the ARL and Lakeshore west to Aldershot since is where it currently stop now as well it has the ridership in the first place. Funding is the only thing.

Lakeshore line will be broken into 2 lines since the eastern section will be built first. It will be the location of the new yard to handle the new equipment.

Metrolinx needs to budget $500m yearly to fast track this thing if they want to get people out of their car sooner than later.

You need to read all the reports in detail and they are long.

I cannot see taking the Electrification to KW as the ridership is not there to support it in the first place other than it a line. Milton out weights KW hands down.

Time to get this sucker up and running ASP.
 
Markster said:
The way I read the report seemed to imply that the ARL would be built as scheduled, but then converted to electric something like 2 or 3 years later.
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I can't believe it, but I found a quote: (Bottom of page 13 of the staff report)

The design for electrification of the ARL spur can be accommodated in the current construction schedule. The ARL
service would start with Diesel Multiple Units (DMU’s) in 2015 and Electric Multiple Units (EMU’s) would be
introduced at the time of electrification. These EMU’s could be conversions of the DMU’s, or new vehicles with the
DMU’s redeployed to other GO corridors.
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... but it's a far cry from the 8 new metro lines that Guangzhou, China built for the 2010 Asian Games. China certainly went way over the top in infrastructure expansion for a regional sporting event, but comparing that with Toronto's plans does make us look a bit embarrassing.

http://www.gz2010.cn/09/1123/14/5OQH28NN0078002U.html
 
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