Metrolinx: Presto Fare Card

[DSC]

I am quite puzzled by the 'fuss' that Metrolinx-TTC are making over the single trip cards. I have been in many cities where they have cards equivalent to Presto and also offer 'limited use' cards and they seem to work just fine. Why does this need months of testing here?

 

[raptor]

I am quite puzzled by the 'fuss' that Metrolinx-TTC are making over the single trip cards. I have been in many cities where they have cards equivalent to Presto and also offer 'limited use' cards and they seem to work just fine. Why does this need months of testing here?

Because it's Metrolinx, and it loves paying consultants for production of large reports.

 

[JasonParis]

When we were in London recently, the first thing our host warned us about was to keep our Oyster cards separate from our other cards, and I noticed "card clash" signage in the tube stations.

Best way around that in London is to simply use ApplePay from your phone.

 

[nfitz]

I am quite puzzled by the 'fuss' that Metrolinx-TTC are making over the single trip cards. I have been in many cities where they have cards equivalent to Presto and also offer 'limited use' cards and they seem to work just fine. Why does this need months of testing here?

Because when they rolled out Presto in Ottawa, and a lot of unexpected bugs popped out that delayed the implementation causing a lot of financial damage to OC Transpo, Metrolinx fired the head of Presto.

I'm sure his successor has learned the lesson of testing everything a lot more than probably necessary!

 

[JamesKoole]

You can't mess around with payments technology. People are paying real money for these cards and they have to be very close to 100% reliable or you've got a big problem. I'm happy to see them doing the real world testing with staff before making them generally available.

 

[Neutrino]

I'm just waiting for the day we can tap our debit cards to pay a cash fare in the subway. Forget this Presto nonsense. By the way, is Presto ever expected to save the TTC money originally claimed?

 

[nfitz]

I'm just waiting for the day we can tap our debit cards to pay a cash fare in the subway. Forget this Presto nonsense.

Useful for tourists, or very occasional users. But I'd assume regular users would prefer to pay the $3 Presto fare rather than the regular $3.25 fare.

 

[Kyle Campbell]

Useful for tourists, or very occasional users. But I'd assume regular users would prefer to pay the $3 Presto fare rather than the regular $3.25 fare.

Yes, but how much would a simple Interac Flash system cost taxpayers versus the Presto monolith, without including the 25 cent extra incentive subsidy

 

[nfitz]

Yes, but how much would a simple Interac Flash system cost taxpayers versus the Presto monolith, without including the 25 cent extra incentive subsidy

At some 10,000 different devices? Probably more than you'd think.

Probably the biggest item for Toronto taxpayers would be paying for the Line 5 and Line 6 construction, which the province said they'd pay 100% of, if TTC adopts Presto.

 

[W. K. Lis]

I am quite puzzled by the 'fuss' that Metrolinx-TTC are making over the single trip cards. I have been in many cities where they have cards equivalent to Presto and also offer 'limited use' cards and they seem to work just fine. Why does this need months of testing here?

Also for big individual handouts of "TTC fares" (currently tokens) at "Get Out of the Cold" or overnight shelters. See link.

 

[robmausser]

I'm just waiting for the day we can tap our debit cards to pay a cash fare in the subway. Forget this Presto nonsense. By the way, is Presto ever expected to save the TTC money originally claimed?

Credit/Debit tap is planned, along with mobile pay.

However there are a ton of people who like to have monthly passes, and to transfer those passes around their family. Cant do that, or wouldnt want to with a credit card.

"Here you go 13 year old kid, heres a credit card for using the subway!"

Yeah no...

 

[rbt]

Credit/Debit tap is planned, along with mobile pay.

However there are a ton of people who like to have monthly passes, and to transfer those passes around their family. Cant do that, or wouldnt want to with a credit card.

Can't is too strong of a word. Enabling it would be confusing though simply because we're used to credit cards creating a charge rather than acting as identification.

Step 1: Allow registration of multiple credit cards, debit cards, etc. to an account. This is strictly for identification purposes; the number simply says "I am this person" and is not for charging purposes.

Step 2: An web/app interface which allows moving the pass between registered cards.

So, a pass can only be registered to a single card at any given time but it can float. So you carry your creditcard and your 13 year old carries their bank debit card for example, with the pass shifted from one card to the other depending on direction given to the backend.

The obvious downside of making it that easy is pass sharing would become very common. You could get several rush-hour trips out of a single virtual Presto card. I expect phone-based Presto implementation will be device specific, including independent of any physical Presto cards for a similar reason.

Metrolinx Wouldn't rather than Can't is a better term.

 

[Leo_Chan]

Can't is too strong of a word. Enabling it would be confusing though simply because we're used to credit cards creating a charge rather than acting as identification.

Step 1: Allow registration of multiple credit cards, debit cards, etc. to an account. This is strictly for identification purposes; the number simply says "I am this person" and is not for charging purposes.

Step 2: An web/app interface which allows moving the pass between registered cards.

So, a pass can only be registered to a single card at any given time but it can float. So you carry your creditcard and your 13 year old carries their bank debit card for example, with the pass shifted from one card to the other depending on direction given to the backend.

The obvious downside of making it that easy is pass sharing would become very common. You could get several rush-hour trips out of a single virtual Presto card. I expect phone-based Presto implementation will be device specific, including independent of any physical Presto cards for a similar reason.

Metrolinx Wouldn't rather than Can't is a better term.

At that point, you might as well give Metrolinx your SIN number and use your driver’s licence/health card/Ontario photo ID card as a transit pass.

 

[rbt]

At that point, you might as well give Metrolinx your SIN number and use your driver’s licence/health card/Ontario photo ID card as a transit pass.

SIN doesn't have an NFC in it. Modern passports have a chip (probably NFC based; I'm not sure) so that might work if you taught Presto machines that protocol (they're definitely not Open Payment based).

You might use an electronic Starbucks card, Vancouver or Montreal transit cards which are all Open Payment NFC cards. Nearly anything that provides a fixed account number though that mechanism could work with existing equipment (in theory; after bugs are squashed).

Of course, teaching both staff and riders that their Montreal OPUS card can (but doesn't by default) point to a virtual TTC pass is likely going to cause more than a little confusion.

 

[hw621]

What about face recognition?