GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[nfitz]

Unfair comparison. There really is nothing between Barrie and Toronto other than a nearly 2 hr train ride.

Isn't that saying there's nothing much between Kitchener and Toronto than a two-hour train ride? Most of the trains never made it to Barrie. What about Bradford, Newmarket, Aurora, King City, and Vaughan?

The Barrie line is not suited (at least for service from Barrie) for anything more than hourly all day service.

Based on the test, it's not suited to hourly service on weekends.

 

[Jonny5]

I find it amusing that someone above commented on "half empty" weekend Lakeshore trains. Half empty, so only 500 or so? And this with Hamilton passengers diverted to buses now running every 20 minutes all weekend and still packed full. The growth off-peak on this line has been astonishing. I now see trains leave Union at 2:45 with 500 people on board. Lakeshore West is outperforming other lines on a massive scale. If you want highly subsidised train runs to be setup elsewhere on the network, you will need to offer more service on Lakeshore to generate more revenue to subsidise the other routes that have very low short to mid term potential. Sure in the long run, they can grow their ridership base and maybe even exceed LW, but it will take a lot of time. The Barrie weekend trial run is good evidence of this.

 

[canarob]

I find it amusing that someone above commented on "half empty" weekend Lakeshore trains. Half empty, so only 500 or so? And this with Hamilton passengers diverted to buses now running every 20 minutes all weekend and still packed full. The growth off-peak on this line has been astonishing. I now see trains leave Union at 2:45 with 500 people on board. Lakeshore West is outperforming other lines on a massive scale. If you want highly subsidised train runs to be setup elsewhere on the network, you will need to offer more service on Lakeshore to generate more revenue to subsidise the other routes that have very low short to mid term potential. Sure in the long run, they can grow their ridership base and maybe even exceed LW, but it will take a lot of time. The Barrie weekend trial run is good evidence of this.

500 is only a quarter full, but in general I agree with respect to Lakeshore West; however, the Lakeshore East doesn't have a greater population than any of the other lines. Residents of Durham Region, the second smallest region in the GTA, have no birth-right to half-hour GO service, and I doubt these trains would even be a quarter full at mid-day or on the weekend. Lines like Stouffville and Milton, that have nothing but jam packed rush hour trains and mostly full off-peak buses, would be the ones subsidizing that service.

I think the weekend Barrie train service just needed more time to catch on. It takes a while for people to figure out that the service exists and that it's a good alternative to driving. The Lakeshore lines have had decades to build service!

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

500 is only a quarter full, but in general I agree with respect to Lakeshore West; however, the Lakeshore East doesn't have a greater population than any of the other lines. Residents of Durham Region, the second smallest region in the GTA, have no birth-right to half-hour GO service, and I doubt these trains would even be a quarter full at mid-day or on the weekend. Lines like Stouffville and Milton, that have nothing but jam packed rush hour trains and mostly full off-peak buses, would be the ones subsidizing that service.

I think the weekend Barrie train service just needed more time to catch on. It takes a while for people to figure out that the service exists and that it's a good alternative to driving. The Lakeshore lines have had decades to build service!

All the train lines have had decades.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Isn't that saying there's nothing much between Kitchener and Toronto than a two-hour train ride? Most of the trains never made it to Barrie. What about Bradford, Newmarket, Aurora, King City, and Vaughan?

Based on the test, it's not suited to hourly service on weekends.

They wanted the Subway instead. Drive from Newmarket to Richmond Hill and get on the the rocket, etc.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

Isn't that saying there's nothing much between Kitchener and Toronto than a two-hour train ride? Most of the trains never made it to Barrie. What about Bradford, Newmarket, Aurora, King City, and Vaughan?

Still the trip times on the Barrie line are longer relatively than they are on Lakeshore W. Per GO's website a trip from Allendale to Union takes nearly 2 hrs by train. While a trip from Hamilton to Union takes just over one hr, extrapolate that the remaining inner stations have similar differences in travel times. I simply can't see many people taking a 2 hr trip each way from Barrie (or any station in between for that matter) to spend time in Toronto (and when they do I'd bet they choose to drive) vs those along the Lakeshore W line who are more likely, in my opinion, to do just that. And will more likely choose transit over driving.

Based on the test, it's not suited to hourly service on weekends.

You may be right.

 

[jamincan]

You are certainly rounding rather generously. The trip from Allandale Waterfront to Union is schedule ~1:45. From Newmarket, it is pretty much exactly 1:00. All trains serve all stops.

From Hamilton GO, the train is scheduled to take 1:15, skipping all stations after Oakville. From Aldershot, stopping at all stations, the train is scheduled to take appr. 1:05.

Considering the bulk of riders get on after Newmarket, I would say the trip times are pretty comparable.

 

[canarob]

All the train lines have had decades.

As a rush-hour only service, yes, but the idea of taking a train downtown on the weekend is something new for anyone outside of the Lakeshore. Many do use the buses, but the buses get stuck in the same 404/DVP traffic as cars, (with the exception of that short stretch with a bus lane in the shoulder), which can still be brutal on the weekend -- last Saturday our bus had to detour twice -- so it's generally faster to drive. Train service is a completely different beast in terms of reliability, comfort, etc. Friends I know in places like Whitby are much more likely to take the train on the weekend than someone in Markham would be to take the bus.

 

[TOareaFan]

Does this article provide any hope for GO in their search for engineers?

http://www.thestar.com/business/article/1297946--cp-rail-job-cuts-to-come-quicly

The job cuts announcement comes as Harrison is changing CP’s operations, from closing yards and terminals to putting up the For Sale on surplus real estate and small rail line in the U.S. Midwest. He also getting rid of capital equipment, cutting the number of locomotives, which means fewer crews will be needed.

 

[Dan416]

Is there any chance they'll implement half-hourly service exclusively on Lakeshore West and not East?


As for the other lines, if and when they get all-day service it will take time for people to realize it's there. Yes, there are the buses every 30 to 60 minutes, but as others have said, they get caught up in traffic (on certain occasions the Milton bus to Union can be dreadful due to the traffic).

I think there's already a good base, but trains would be great. It's just a shame we don't have smaller equipment we could use off-peak. Maybe GO could buy some old TTC subways and run them on their lines? lol

 

[drum118]

Is there any chance they'll implement half-hourly service exclusively on Lakeshore West and not East?


As for the other lines, if and when they get all-day service it will take time for people to realize it's there. Yes, there are the buses every 30 to 60 minutes, but as others have said, they get caught up in traffic (on certain occasions the Milton bus to Union can be dreadful due to the traffic).

I think there's already a good base, but trains would be great. It's just a shame we don't have smaller equipment we could use off-peak. Maybe GO could buy some old TTC subways and run them on their lines? lol

30 minutes will be for both sections at this time. Come 2016 once the headhouse is finish, you can break the line in two with different headway. Keep in mind, people are bypass Union in the first place and will be tic having to transfer.

The goal is to get service down to 10 minutes or less to the point there is no schedule when the next train will show up.

 

[gweed123]

Does this article provide any hope for GO in their search for engineers?

http://www.thestar.com/business/article/1297946--cp-rail-job-cuts-to-come-quicly

Good question. Although I do wonder 2 things:

1) How many of those job cuts will be in the GTHA?

2) Will those that will be cut (routes and staff) just get snapped up by CN? It's not like the demand for those freight trips is just going to disappear. I could potentially see CN getting a pretty big hiring boost. VIA is also boosting service on the Quebec City-Windsor corridor too.

So overall, I have my doubts that GO will see any significant boost in engineers as a result of these layoffs, but I could be wrong.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Still the trip times on the Barrie line are longer relatively than they are on Lakeshore W. Per GO's website a trip from Allendale to Union takes nearly 2 hrs by train. While a trip from Hamilton to Union takes just over one hr, extrapolate that the remaining inner stations have similar differences in travel times. I simply can't see many people taking a 2 hr trip each way from Barrie (or any station in between for that matter) to spend time in Toronto (and when they do I'd bet they choose to drive) vs those along the Lakeshore W line who are more likely, in my opinion, to do just that. And will more likely choose transit over driving.



You may be right.

This is simple. 5 rush hour trains to barrie and off peak all day service to Union from Bradford.

 

[nfitz]

So overall, I have my doubts that GO will see any significant boost in engineers as a result of these layoffs, but I could be wrong.

I agree, though it might reduce the number of defections from GO. Though I thought that was more to CN and VIA than CP.

 

[DavidH]

GO Transit's train tracking web application is now available for public use.

http://www.gotracker.ca/gotracker/web/

(Okay, well, it's been available for public use for months if you knew the URL but now it's being publicized....)