ssiguy2
Senior Member
Although logically that makes sense it makes you realize what a stupid service London GO is when it has no GO buses and then decides to run one huge train a day that it FAR slower than a bus would be.
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GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)
- Thread starter drum118
- Start date
lrt's friend
Active Member
This is Ontario politics. Doug Ford promised train service to Niagara Falls. We got one very slow round trip per day. Doug Ford promised train service to London. We got one very slow round trip per day. Doug Ford gets to check off that he fulfilled both promises. It doesn't matter whether the service is useful.
crs1026
Superstar
(We seem to have wandered into discussing how VIA and GO might share London service (via Brantford and via Kitchener) in other threads, Pretty hard to figure out which thread is most appropriate. So I'm dropping this here.)
To take my comment about dovetailing service while giving priority to VIA service to Windsor/Chatham, here is a fantasy schedule that would meet those needs. I don't pretend to be an expert at building schedules - the whole point is to have a target to poke holes in. I have left the timings approximate (but close enough to be achievable).
The objective was to establish a proper improved service plan for VIA in Southwestern Ontario, and then weave in GO service to fill the gaps.... as opposed to trying to compete, or plan GO first and leave VIA with table scraps. I gave priority to optimising the number of Windsor trains through Kitchener (keeping the number of Brantford trains within CN's recent precedent) , and used GO turnbacks where needed to ensure good across the platform transfers in London where through service wasn't available. On the Kitchener line, I assumed that there would be additional trains and that (magically) the new track capacity being added would enable whatever GO needs without conflict with this VIA pattern.
There is no reason why VIA can't operate the turnback Toronto-London runs that I showed (in green) as GO trains... but it implies more trainsets than VIA may have available, whereas I'm assuming that GO can handle the equipment allocations within their fleet, especially if Oncorr were to add new equipment (those longed-for EMU's, perhaps).
Again, just a straw man, but the point being to demonstrate that a combined service can be operated as win-win, and to make the point that VIA should not be thought of as a Cinderella who isnt allowed to come to the party.
- Paul
To take my comment about dovetailing service while giving priority to VIA service to Windsor/Chatham, here is a fantasy schedule that would meet those needs. I don't pretend to be an expert at building schedules - the whole point is to have a target to poke holes in. I have left the timings approximate (but close enough to be achievable).
The objective was to establish a proper improved service plan for VIA in Southwestern Ontario, and then weave in GO service to fill the gaps.... as opposed to trying to compete, or plan GO first and leave VIA with table scraps. I gave priority to optimising the number of Windsor trains through Kitchener (keeping the number of Brantford trains within CN's recent precedent) , and used GO turnbacks where needed to ensure good across the platform transfers in London where through service wasn't available. On the Kitchener line, I assumed that there would be additional trains and that (magically) the new track capacity being added would enable whatever GO needs without conflict with this VIA pattern.
There is no reason why VIA can't operate the turnback Toronto-London runs that I showed (in green) as GO trains... but it implies more trainsets than VIA may have available, whereas I'm assuming that GO can handle the equipment allocations within their fleet, especially if Oncorr were to add new equipment (those longed-for EMU's, perhaps).
Again, just a straw man, but the point being to demonstrate that a combined service can be operated as win-win, and to make the point that VIA should not be thought of as a Cinderella who isnt allowed to come to the party.
- Paul
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anb
Active Member
Found out thanks to a transit app notification of all things....
Also decided to check GO's website, and there is indeed an update but for now I can see only 50% of it (the Bus updates for now), but it does give a clue what to expect for the train service that's about to come. You'll see what I mean when you click the link if its not updated yet
Edit: Nvm, we can see the train service updates now..
www.gotransit.com
COVID-19 (Coronavirus) Safety Updates | UP Express
Learn about our enhanced COVID-19 safety measures and UP Express schedule changes. It’s our top priority to keep you healthy and safe every time you travel with us.
www.upexpress.com
Also decided to check GO's website, and there is indeed an update but for now I can see only 50% of it (the Bus updates for now), but it does give a clue what to expect for the train service that's about to come. You'll see what I mean when you click the link if its not updated yet
Edit: Nvm, we can see the train service updates now..
Train Schedule Changes | Service Updates | GO Transit
We’re making time changes to some weekday Lakeshore East and Lakeshore West train trips, some weekday and weekend Barrie line trips, and to some GO bus trips.
www.gotransit.com
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reaperexpress
Senior Member
Lakeshore West: the Niagara train is now described as a seasonal service until Thanksgiving. Sure, let's just pretend it wasn't previously year-round. There are now only 3 daily round trips, compared to 4 in previous years.
There is still no weekday express service. The weekday Niagara Train takes 2h33, making all station stops. By comparison, weekend express trips take 2h05.
Kitchener: Limited midday service and evening service from Kitchener is back. There are now 8 daily round trips from Kitchener station, which is the same as pre-pandemic, but short of the 10 which were scheduled in September 2021.
Still no weekday express service. The London train takes 3h55, making all station stops. Still no counter-peak service to Bramalea either.
Stouffville: Hourly evening and weekend service is back.
Barrie: Hourly evening and weekend service is back as far as Aurora, as well as limited midday service to/from Barrie on weekdays as well as weekends.
UP Express: 15-minute service is back, but only during peak and shoulder-peak periods. Off-peak service remains only every 30 minutes.
No significant changes for Lakeshore East, Milton, or Richmond Hill.
No signifcant changes to bus service, just cancelling/shifting trips to connect to the adjusted/added train trips.
There is still no weekday express service. The weekday Niagara Train takes 2h33, making all station stops. By comparison, weekend express trips take 2h05.
Kitchener: Limited midday service and evening service from Kitchener is back. There are now 8 daily round trips from Kitchener station, which is the same as pre-pandemic, but short of the 10 which were scheduled in September 2021.
Still no weekday express service. The London train takes 3h55, making all station stops. Still no counter-peak service to Bramalea either.
Stouffville: Hourly evening and weekend service is back.
Barrie: Hourly evening and weekend service is back as far as Aurora, as well as limited midday service to/from Barrie on weekdays as well as weekends.
UP Express: 15-minute service is back, but only during peak and shoulder-peak periods. Off-peak service remains only every 30 minutes.
No significant changes for Lakeshore East, Milton, or Richmond Hill.
No signifcant changes to bus service, just cancelling/shifting trips to connect to the adjusted/added train trips.
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WB62
Senior Member
Finally, they’re really adding 12 cars to the Niagara train again? I’m surprised the demand is that high.
reaperexpress
Senior Member
It is. Last year the 8:51 departure from Union was easily filling up a 12-car train, though the added weight made it difficult to keep up with the schedule which was designed for faster-accelerating 8-car trains. Personally I would have preferred them to keep the trains as 8 cars and add a 10:51 departure, filling the gap until the 12:51 departure.
The current Willowbrook-based train which operates the 12:51 service could be moved up to 10:51, while one of the trains from Lewis Yard could run a morning trip from Niagara Falls (a notable gap in the current schedule), and then pick up the 12:51 back to Niagara.
WB62
Senior Member
It seems like GO wants to generally avoid 8 car trains right now, I haven’t seen one in over half a year. It’s just 6-10-12 car trains.It is. Last year the 8:51 departure from Union was easily filling up a 12-car train, though the added weight made it difficult to keep up with the schedule which was designed for faster-accelerating 8-car trains. Personally I would have preferred them to keep the trains as 8 cars and add a 10:51 departure, filling the gap until the 12:51 departure.
The current Willowbrook-based train which operates the 12:51 service could be moved up to 10:51, while one of the trains from Lewis Yard could run a morning trip from Niagara Falls (a notable gap in the current schedule), and then pick up the 12:51 back to Niagara.
reaperexpress
Senior Member
That's not new. Niagara service was the only service which operated with 8-car trains. It is also the only service which uses bike coaches, so it doesn't really matter how standard the length is.
anb
Active Member
The only shame about this is that we don't get the express trips on the Kitchener runs, or the local trains serving all stops to Bramalea. That seemed the most effective way to deal with capacity issues and it also goes beyond just giving UP Express 15 mins to only serve Weston and Bloor in the process which all the current peak trains do anyways. At least we have the midday trips back to and from Kitchener which will definitely drive up ridership and efficiency going there.
crs1026
Superstar
Given that work is now clearly under way to get the fourth track and platforms finished, I can live with the absence of the express runs. It will be much more feasible to run Bramalea trains once that work is done. There is still the station at Woodbine to get done, however. I wonder if that is also an obstacle, because Etobicoke North can't close until Woodbine is ready to open.
- Paul
innsertnamehere
Superstar
bleh, still no Lakeshore West express service as far as I can tell. We had it last year, why not now when ridership is presumably much higher?
LNahid2000
Senior Member
I was hoping there would be more Niagara trains this year, but instead they cut the last trip of the day in both directions. Also, seasonal for 5 months instead of year round sucks. Metrolinx disappoints as usual.
generalcanada
Senior Member
cries in lakeshore east oshawa all stop service
innsertnamehere
Superstar
I mean at least Lakeshore East is for a known reason (Ontario Line construction).. Lakeshore West as far as I know is completely capable of running express service still and they are simply opting not to..