GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[gweed123]

Consistency of arrival time is a pretty good selling point I think. You're much more likely to hit the bus-train meet in Mississauga, with the train much more likely to reach Union on time than the bus would be.

I haven't taken a look at the pre and post truncation schedules to verify, but has the frequency to the Milton Line GO stations been increased with this truncation? I'd hope that there was a least a marginal improvement in frequency now that the route total route length has effectively been cut in half.

 

[duffo]

I haven't taken a look at the pre and post truncation schedules to verify, but has the frequency to the Milton Line GO stations been increased with this truncation? I'd hope that there was a least a marginal improvement in frequency now that the route total route length has effectively been cut in half.

Nope, still about 30 mins in peak and 60 mins off-peak.

 

[Richard White]

You’re completely missing the context (and missed a lot of posts above too). The traffic got so bad last summer that GO had to detour the buses anyway. And if you’re going to the CNE, you’re probably better off with the transfer to the Lakeshore Line.

I used to take the 21 when I worked at Square One and I go from Scarborough to Downtown all the time. I know how bad the traffic is.

I was just saying that it is an inconvenient transfer.

 

[KevinT]

The length of single track east of Dupont is a barrier to frequent two-way service. There would have to be more track east of Dupont.

Could you clarify, as I'm hugely confused by this? Isn't CP at least double-track all the way from the junction in Campbellville to the far side of the Agincourt yard? Also, Dupont is an east-west (parallel) street running south of the CP line....

 

[crs1026]

Could you clarify, as I'm hugely confused by this? Isn't CP at least double-track all the way from the junction in Campbellville to the far side of the Agincourt yard? Also, Dupont is an east-west (parallel) street running south of the CP line....

I meant the Dupont which is the control point southeast of West Toronto - it sits right under the Wallace Ave footbridge. From there to Strachan Ave, Metrolinx owns the Galt Sub, and it is single track.
So once a GO train leaves Strachan Ave westbound, it has to go all the way to Royal York before it can meet an opposing GO train…. assuming, that is, that CP will want one main track available for freight all the time. That places a limit on how frequently one could plan a 2-way service….. and that’s making the assumption that CP would allow GO to use two tracks from Royal York to Dixie, a very big and unproven “if”.

- Paul

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

I could also argue that Milton really could work on its own transit connections to neighbouring communities. The 21 Steeles Avenue route is a good, if timid, first step, but maybe it should be the agency running along Derry Road to Meadowvale too. The new GO 21A finally restores a connection to Oakville, but it doesn’t run in the weekday peak direction! Why didn’t Milton Transit run a bus at least to Oakville Hospital?

I do agree that extending GO Route 27 off peak is a good idea.

Milton needs sunday service first. Otherwise hopedale mall, Oakville Place, are also good connections. They should be running the oakville go connection too.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Consistency of arrival time is a pretty good selling point I think. You're much more likely to hit the bus-train meet in Mississauga, with the train much more likely to reach Union on time than the bus would be.

I haven't taken a look at the pre and post truncation schedules to verify, but has the frequency to the Milton Line GO stations been increased with this truncation? I'd hope that there was a least a marginal improvement in frequency now that the route total route length has effectively been cut in half.

You’re completely missing the context (and missed a lot of posts above too). The traffic got so bad last summer that GO had to detour the buses anyway. And if you’re going to the CNE, you’re probably better off with the transfer to the Lakeshore Line.

Right, but the 21H Square One - Union bus should have stayed. Going to Kipling or Islington is another 30 minutes on a trip that is 25 off peak.

 

[Bordercollie]

Something I have been wondering about is the future of freight on Metrolinx corridors. Personally, with the level of service they expect GO to get up to, I don't see how freight can be accommodated in GO's long term plans.

Some might say that the trains can run at night, but the window where this will be possible will likely be too small to allow reliable and timely service. These periods are also critical for network maintenance which will make a complete elimination of freight desirable.

In my opinion, we will likely see the biggest issues on the Oakville and Guelph Subs where there is still reasonable volume of freight, but I think that there will be a general modal shift to trucks as a result of GO expansion. It's definitely worth it though since that will be balanced out by modal shift away from cars.

Perhaps Metrolinx might look to buy out rail served properties adjacent to their corridors for redevelopment which would allow industries to move in order to mitigate this. Though, unavoidably, this will likely lead to the abandonment of the Goderich Exeter Railway which will be cut off from the freight network.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

Why would they cut off GEXR? Transportation of that much salt by truck would be a nightmare.

 

[ShonTron]

Why would they cut off GEXR? Transportation of that much salt by truck would be a nightmare.

They wouldn’t have to. Even with major construction and service improvements, you’ll still only get one train an hour to Kitchener off-peak, just that they will run express in the inner portion. There’s enough room to keep GEXR and CN doing what they do, especially as they will only need to occupy the mainline for through travel between Kitchener and Silver (Georgetown). I’m pretty sure CN’s remaining customers are all on spur lines (Fergus Spur, Waterloo Spur, Huron Park Spur.)

The conflicts I see are mostly in the Uxbridge Sub in Scarborough and the Newmarket Sub in North York and Vaughan.

 

[anb]

I tend to agree. It does make sense to route the buses to Port Credit however it does miss the mark.

Those buses were great for people attending Leafs or Jays games, or even going to the CNE in the fall. That extra transfer is nothing more than a pain in the ass and adds a stop to what was previously a seamless transfer.

It would make more sense to have Milton GO trains on the weekend than it would to curtail service at Port Credit.

Not all of the branches are heading to Port Credit though, just one of the 3 (21C) that will service Erindale, Sq One and Cooksville only before heading there, so that will be the one thing that'll head to Port Credit this summer and that's it. The other 2 branches will be heading to Oakville from Milton (21A), and Clarkson from Lisgar/Meadowvale/Streetsville stations (21B).

So now the traffic to the Lakeshore line is more organized and not clustered into one point which was never intended to handle intense bus traffic. While on top being surrounded by construction, and forcibly also getting the buses from the Kitchener line to detour there as well (thank god weekend train service is finally here for it this year). The methods they are doing out of the way to avoid all that summer traffic on the Gardiner and doing that god awful detour to Port Credit this year are miles upon miles better.

 

[Dan416]

Pretty major change for Milton buses no longer servicing Union directly. I understand the reasoning. We’ll see how this works out.

 

[Metroscapes]

Since GEXR (who's lease was not renewed by CN, btw) came up in conversation, and sorry if this was posted already:

Freight train speed limits to go up through Guelph

The speed limit of freight trains will increase from 16 km/h to 48 km/h next Monday through the area, after the latest bridge and structure work was completed

www.guelphtoday.com

Metrolinx has announced the speed limit of freight trains through the city will increase from 16 km/h to 48 km/h on Monday, Apr. 3.

This should help open up more passenger train windows during day runs.

Metrolinx said with this latest work complete, it can turn its attention to the replacement of a second track between Wellington Street and Silvercreek Parkway.

They've had the track laid around the station for a while now, my kiddo and I saw track maintenance vehicles working at the end of October. I'm guessing they mean between Wyndham Street and Silvercreek Parkway (west of the station). But I've noted before that it may mean a bit of work to relocate signals.

 

[SaugeenJunction]

Since GEXR (who's lease was not renewed by CN, btw) came up in conversation, and sorry if this was posted already:

Freight train speed limits to go up through Guelph

The speed limit of freight trains will increase from 16 km/h to 48 km/h next Monday through the area, after the latest bridge and structure work was completed

www.guelphtoday.com

This should help open up more passenger train windows during day runs.



They've had the track laid around the station for a while now, my kiddo and I saw track maintenance vehicles working at the end of October. I'm guessing they mean between Wyndham Street and Silvercreek Parkway (west of the station). But I've noted before that it may mean a bit of work to relocate signals.

Great flag - we knew passenger speeds increased in the fall, but I didn’t know freights were still limited. Will be quite a sight seeing them fly along Kent Street!

 

[Reecemartin]

Not without the West Highland Creek bridge and the stations, it couldn't.

The work was oddly sequenced, since the track contract was placed first and is largely complete - but without the platforms being ready at Milliken and Agincourt, and the bridgework at West Highland Creek, all that new track and sound walls and grading have not led to any new capacity.....yet.

....

Don't agree at all, a section of short single track at the middle of the n-s line more or less can absolutely be worked around - if we have the desire to make it work. Platforms have been pretty close to done at Milliken and Agincourt and Kennedy for quite some time. We need to get used to operating higher frequency on less track. The line on the East shore of Lake Zurich is still single tracked in places and handles a ton of tph, even local AND express!

 

[crs1026]

Don't agree at all, a section of short single track at the middle of the n-s line more or less can absolutely be worked around - if we have the desire to make it work. Platforms have been pretty close to done at Milliken and Agincourt and Kennedy for quite some time. We need to get used to operating higher frequency on less track. The line on the East shore of Lake Zurich is still single tracked in places and handles a ton of tph, even local AND express!

So, you would redesign the CTC to leave Kennedy-Sheppard as single track? Despite the control points at Kennedy and Progress Road already being put in place? And intermediate signals already erected? And track already laid from Kennedy to the creek ? And a resulting constraint on headways due to longer time to clear the single track ?

That would be enormously wasteful, and the redesign and rework would probably take as long as what is required to finih the original plan.

This project has been executed poorly, but going back to square one is foolish. Just apply proper project management and get the contractor moving. That’s likely what the work windows are all about.

- Paul