GO Transit: Construction Projects (Metrolinx, various)

[Northern Light]

Metrolinx and the city spent nearly $100 million on SmartTrack stations that may never be built, documents reveal

Confidential documents seen by the Star show that roughly $97 million has been spent on stops at King-Liberty and Finch-Kennedy that were indefinitely deferred in 2024.

www.thestar.com

paywall bypass:

https://archive.is/C904k

From the above:

Ahem....590M? For a station entirely above ground, almost entirely on publicly owned land, what little land acquisition was required could be offset by subsequent development thereof?

A completely underground subway station 2 years ago was running 400M per station on a deep-bore site............this is ~50% higher.

Two Words: Forensic Audit.

 

[Jonny5]

From the above:

View attachment 716962

Ahem....590M? For a station entirely above ground, almost entirely on publicly owned land, what little land acquisition was required could be offset by subsequent development thereof?

A completely underground subway station 2 years ago was running 400M per station on a deep-bore site............this is ~50% higher.

Two Words: Forensic Audit.

There isn't anything to audit since they never did it, but I am imagining it's scope creep here in that that a King-Liberty station plan likely included massive changes to the underpass of the corridor on King Street, and also a huge change for utilities, sewage, and critical storm water upgrades (remember how often that area floods) and then the station on top of all that. They probably wanted to fix all of it in one go and it would be a transformative but extraordinarily disruptive project. Someone would have to pay for years of bus and streetcar diversions like they are now for the Ontario line at Queen.

 

[Northern Light]

There isn't anything to audit since they never did it

There are tens of millions out the door on design (90-100%) and early works) so there is some audit trail for money-as spent, but the estimates and designs are the cost predictors and they're available (if Metrolinx chooses)

, but I am imagining it's scope creep here

Certainly I think there is money being directed to things other than the immediate station project. But a fair question is are those other things the responsibility of the City, or this project?

in that that a King-Liberty station plan likely included massive changes to the underpass of the corridor on King Street,

Possible, but I was unaware of any significant changes to the Underpass contemplated by this project, possible that slipped past me.

and also a huge change for utilities, sewage, and critical storm water upgrades (remember how often that area floods) and then the station on top of all that.

Metrolinx would not be authorized under this agreement to carry out works that far from site so far as I am aware. I may try to do some digging.

 

[Amare]

How in God's living green planet does it cost nearly $600 million (for King-Liberty), and $400 million (for Finch-Kennedy) for 2 straight forward above ground and bare boned train stations.

There is something seriously deficiently wrong in the way we build major infrastructure projects in this province. Period, full stop.

The fact that most politicians dont see problem with it, means that they dont have any problem with pissing away tens of millions of dollars unnecessarily. It's no wonder the general public gets frustrated when there are cost overruns, but then when the public complains politicians take people for fools and say that there is a "gravy train" that needs to be cut at any and all costs.

Well yes, there is a gravy train: pissing away tens of millions of dollars unnecessarily for no reason whatsoever on project soft costs on lining the coffers of consultants.

But apparently it's ok, let's cheap out on costs like adequate weather protection at stations (because that's apparently gravy), but we're perfectly content at shelling out hundreds of millions for consultant fees and screwed up contracts.

 

[robmausser]

How in God's living green planet does it cost nearly $600 million (for King-Liberty), and $400 million (for Finch-Kennedy) for 2 straight forward above ground and bare boned train stations.

There is something seriously deficiently wrong in the way we build major infrastructure projects in this province. Period, full stop.

The fact that most politicians dont see problem with it, means that they dont have any problem with pissing away tens of millions of dollars unnecessarily. It's no wonder the general public gets frustrated when there are cost overruns, but then when the public complains politicians take people for fools and say that there is a "gravy train" that needs to be cut at any and all costs.

Well yes, there is a gravy train: pissing away tens of millions of dollars unnecessarily for no reason whatsoever on project soft costs on lining the coffers of consultants.

But apparently it's ok, let's cheap out on costs like adequate weather protection at stations (because that's apparently gravy), but we're perfectly content at shelling out hundreds of millions for consultant fees and screwed up contracts.

View attachment 717008

View attachment 717009

I believe this is basically the same thing as the elevated Eglinton West extension study where they designed massive stations to make the cost so crazy expensive it justified tunneling instead. Which is what they wanted in the first place.

I am tempted to believe that the costs of these stations are nothing more than an attempt to cancel a project tied to a disgraced former mayor.

 

[reinventingthewheel]

No excuses for ML’s lack of transparency and wasted time/money here, but there’s a consolation to cancelling King-Liberty. The station would have reduced the ROW capacity.

Without platforms at King-Liberty, you can fit 8 tracks from Lansdowne to USRC. That’s 2 for the Barrie line and 6 through Bloor GO (hypothetically 2 for UP/Kitchener local, 2 for Alto/Via/Kitchener express, 2 for Milton).

I think there’s more value in reserving that space than delivering something useful now that will limit us in the future (much like what’s being done to the Lakeshore East corridor now).

 

[Mihairokov]

Metrolinx and the city spent nearly $100 million on SmartTrack stations that may never be built, documents reveal

Confidential documents seen by the Star show that roughly $97 million has been spent on stops at King-Liberty and Finch-Kennedy that were indefinitely deferred in 2024.

www.thestar.com

paywall bypass:

https://archive.is/C904k

 

[cplchanb]

its either corruption or incompetence. take your pick.

 

[Amare]

its either corruption or incompetence. take your pick.

Well i mean we have both here in Ontario, so it's been a wonderful combination.

And the best part about it is, that's nobody faces any consequences for either one.

 

[Neil]

its either corruption or incompetence. take your pick.

Um, could be both.

 

[Dan416]

But apparently it's ok, let's cheap out on costs like adequate weather protection at stations (because that's apparently gravy), but we're perfectly content at shelling out hundreds of millions for consultant fees and screwed up contracts.

I feel like we don't talk about this enough. One of the reasons people are so pro-subway is because there is protection from the elements. The lack of weather protection on parts of Eglinton and most of Finch and Hurontario and most of GO is a huge problem. IDC how often the train is supposed to come that you aren't supposed to be waiting long--the subways come more than any other rail we have, and they get adequate weather protection.

Our climate demands adequate weather protection. Whether it's from rain, snow or sun.

 

[cplchanb]

I feel like we don't talk about this enough. One of the reasons people are so pro-subway is because there is protection from the elements. The lack of weather protection on parts of Eglinton and most of Finch and Hurontario and most of GO is a huge problem. IDC how often the train is supposed to come that you aren't supposed to be waiting long--the subways come more than any other rail we have, and they get adequate weather protection.

Our climate demands adequate weather protection. Whether it's from rain, snow or sun.

Just look at the Bloomington mausoleum.
Heavy protection for the vehicular deities yet they allowed jack all for the platforms where people need it most

 

[StreetcarRider]

The City of Toronto is currently running a survey on street furniture, including transit shelters. Please consider filling it out to express the importance of weather protection. One of my comments in the survey was how appalling it is to have no weather protection at places like King and Yonge where hundreds of people wait for streetcars regularly in both directions.

Street Furniture

Share your ideas and help reimagine Toronto’s street furniture by completing the survey before March 26, 2026. Take the Survey The Coordinated Street Furniture Program is designed to strengthen, celebrate and ultimately elevate the quality of our public spaces. The Program helps create...

www.toronto.ca

 

[crs1026]

I rode the Kitchener line yesterday and observed that there was work (of one sort or another ) in progress pretty much all the way from King St all the way up to Rogers Road, and again at Resources Road. As usual, nothing happening at Randolph. Precious little at Woodbine.

From what I could tell, the work in progress was mostly utility and telco and.or railway telecom related, plus there is a tender out to renew the couple of bridge spans needed for the additional tracks south of Dundas.

Lots of work on the Barrie line just south of Dundas street, as I understand it this is a major sewer project. Sound walls appear to have been completed on the east side of the tracks.

There appeared to be earthmoving going on around Dundas, and a stockpile of concrete ties has begun south of Dundas also.

Roadbed is pretty much ready for track laying from Dundas to Bloor.

St Clair station work has started. Of note, the interchange track between CPKC and ML, which is used by CN nightly to reach CPKC Lambton Yard, appears to be getting a relocation, with a new control point on the CPKC further north from today's location. This will add a little width through the St Clair station. One wonders if anything is getting roughed in towards eventually connecting a Bolton GO line to the Weston Sub.

Bottom line - most of this is prerequisite work that has to happen before the additional tracks (needed for 2-tracking the Barrie line, and 4-tracking the Kitchener line) can be put down. Why none of it has been started before now is a good question, given all ML's decade long promises of "bringing you 2WAD to Kitchener and Barrie" - but it's forward motion at last. But given all the remaining steps needed, nothing likely to be ready this year.

On a more celebratory note, yesterday was my first trip on the LSE east of Union in a while, and I noted that the new fourth track has started to be laid west of Smalls Creek. This was a "wow" moment for me - it will be years before we have a working four track main line through that stretch, but after years and years of talking and waiting, and then years of watching preliminary work such as grading and retaining wall construction, the line is finally four tracks wide in one spot. That's a huge milestone even if not ready for use.

- Paul

 

[Allandale25]

I rode the Kitchener line yesterday and observed that there was work (of one sort or another ) in progress pretty much all the way from King St all the way up to Rogers Road, and again at Resources Road. As usual, nothing happening at Randolph. Precious little at Woodbine.

From what I could tell, the work in progress was mostly utility and telco and.or railway telecom related, plus there is a tender out to renew the couple of bridge spans needed for the additional tracks south of Dundas.

Lots of work on the Barrie line just south of Dundas street, as I understand it this is a major sewer project. Sound walls appear to have been completed on the east side of the tracks.

There appeared to be earthmoving going on around Dundas, and a stockpile of concrete ties has begun south of Dundas also.

Roadbed is pretty much ready for track laying from Dundas to Bloor.

St Clair station work has started. Of note, the interchange track between CPKC and ML, which is used by CN nightly to reach CPKC Lambton Yard, appears to be getting a relocation, with a new control point on the CPKC further north from today's location. This will add a little width through the St Clair station. One wonders if anything is getting roughed in towards eventually connecting a Bolton GO line to the Weston Sub.

Bottom line - most of this is prerequisite work that has to happen before the additional tracks (needed for 2-tracking the Barrie line, and 4-tracking the Kitchener line) can be put down. Why none of it has been started before now is a good question, given all ML's decade long promises of "bringing you 2WAD to Kitchener and Barrie" - but it's forward motion at last. But given all the remaining steps needed, nothing likely to be ready this year.

On a more celebratory note, yesterday was my first trip on the LSE east of Union in a while, and I noted that the new fourth track has started to be laid west of Smalls Creek. This was a "wow" moment for me - it will be years before we have a working four track main line through that stretch, but after years and years of talking and waiting, and then years of watching preliminary work such as grading and retaining wall construction, the line is finally four tracks wide in one spot. That's a huge milestone even if not ready for use.

- Paul

re 4th track on LSE. I saw it too recently. Couldn't get a good pic. Maybe @kotsy can