GraphicMatt
Looking forward to a FRESH START for Toronto
Yes, but if they didn't build stations and instead just had people leap off the train onto gym mat padding, you could totally get that price down by a few million dollars.
Honestly, I don't like this plan. In the short term, it will result in less efficient transit along Eglinton than the existing LRT plan: too many transfers. The bus transit to airport from a subway terminus at Keele or Jane, likely in mixed traffic, will not be appealing at all (I'd rather take 192 Rocket from Kipling, or 401 GO bus from Yorkdale).
In the long term, if we keep investing in Eglinton subway, it will eventually create better transit in this particular corridor. However, the extra cost (over LRT) would be at least 3 or 4 billions, which can build a lot of other projects.
And I fail to see how digging an HRT tunnel from Jane to Don Mills would be significantly more than digging an LRT tunnel from Keele to Laird. The lowered cost of using BRT instead of LRT for the extremities would balance out the extra tunnelling costs, while leaving much more opportunity for expansion further down the road. How many people are actually going to be using Eglinton as a "crosstown" anyways? You can't tell me that Kennedy to Martin Grove is a significant trip generator. People will use the line to access YUS.
Also, using BRT along the Western section of Eglinton opens up the possibility for the Mississauga BRT (currently ending at the 427) to use the same lanes, creating a more seamless connection between MT and the TTC.
Arbitrary transfers are never ideal. But the sheppard transfer will involve nothing more than walking to another train on the same platform. Is this even possible in the subway-bus scenario?If modal transfers are going to work so well on Sheppard (as the TTC is claiming), why not on Eglinton too? At least doing it on Eglinton still leaves the chance for expansion in the future. The Sheppard subway's eastern terminus will forever be Don Mills.
EDIT: As I think about it, this really is urban planning at it's absolute worst. There is no way that a LRT will bring high density, mixed use development to Eglinton west.
Why does it have to be shared lane? Widening the outer portions of Eglinton would not be a truly significant venture, and installing outside lane BRT would negate all of this left turn nonsense.
By the calculations listed above, BRT is quite able to handle the passenger load on the extremities of the corridor as a temporary measure. Like I've said before, BRT is easier and cheaper to implement, and easier and cheaper to upgrade later on.
And I fail to see how digging an HRT tunnel from Jane to Don Mills would be significantly more than digging an LRT tunnel from Keele to Laird. The lowered cost of using BRT instead of LRT for the extremities would balance out the extra tunnelling costs, while leaving much more opportunity for expansion further down the road.
How many people are actually going to be using Eglinton as a "crosstown" anyways? You can't tell me that Kennedy to Martin Grove is a significant trip generator. People will use the line to access YUS.
If modal transfers are going to work so well on Sheppard (as the TTC is claiming), why not on Eglinton too? At least doing it on Eglinton still leaves the chance for expansion in the future. The Sheppard subway's eastern terminus will forever be Don Mills.
This. So much this.Why does it have to be shared lane? Widening the outer portions of Eglinton would not be a truly significant venture, and installing outside lane BRT would negate all of this left turn nonsense.
By the calculations listed above, BRT is quite able to handle the passenger load on the extremities of the corridor as a temporary measure. Like I've said before, BRT is easier and cheaper to implement, and easier and cheaper to upgrade later on.
And I fail to see how digging an HRT tunnel from Jane to Don Mills would be significantly more than digging an LRT tunnel from Keele to Laird. The lowered cost of using BRT instead of LRT for the extremities would balance out the extra tunnelling costs, while leaving much more opportunity for expansion further down the road. How many people are actually going to be using Eglinton as a "crosstown" anyways? You can't tell me that Kennedy to Martin Grove is a significant trip generator. People will use the line to access YUS.
Also, using BRT along the Western section of Eglinton opens up the possibility for the Mississauga BRT (currently ending at the 427) to use the same lanes, creating a more seamless connection between MT and the TTC.
If modal transfers are going to work so well on Sheppard (as the TTC is claiming), why not on Eglinton too? At least doing it on Eglinton still leaves the chance for expansion in the future. The Sheppard subway's eastern terminus will forever be Don Mills.
This. So much this.
The reason that the modal transfer at Sheppard is so bad is because that's expected to be a permanent fix. Putting BRT at the extremities of Eglinton is in no way permanent. Putting bus lanes at the edge of the road would probably cost less than $5k! The point is that the subway would get extended later after the first portion is built. With Sheppard, there's no way that the subway will still get built if the SELRT is built.
But I think that's what should be done on Eglinton. Subway+BRT might be worse than LRT initially, but it leaves for expansion. LRT won't create a better trip than a longer subway and BRT at the extremities, yet Subway+BRT means the subway can easily be extended to go to Pearson or Kingston Road, and I believe that it would if it were built.
Arbitrary transfers are never ideal. But the sheppard transfer will involve nothing more than walking to another train on the same platform. Is this even possible in the subway-bus scenario?
There's literally no advantage to making a subway from Keele to Don Mills, or whatever. What's the advantage?? There's no legitimate capacity concerns, and it's underground and at equal speed regardless of technology. Your subway idea is a solution in search of a problem.
The design is supposed to stop bunching and spacing issues. It seems to be a bit early to be complaining that the design isn't working, when operations have yet to begin.By that I mean it has the high cost of subway (tunnelled especially) but it has the on-street problems of a streetcar (traffic, bunching).