Danforth Line 2 Scarborough Subway Extension

[kEiThZ]

I like the idea of replacing Scarborough RT with LRT because it'll most certainly get overcrowded and show what a disaster it was. Then they can build the subway underneath.

I don't think that'll happen. Especially if they short-turn at STC or McCowan as planned in the Metrolinx BCA. LRT in a segregated corridor till STC can handle the load. You don't need a subway for that.

However, the subway still makes sense because it's idiotic to make the bulk of passengers travelling between STC and Kennedy transfer just so you can have stations like Ellemere which generates less than 2000 riders per day. Ridership from Ellesmere, Midland and McCowan should be consolidated at STC. And it could be done easily since the bus routes passing those stations terminate at STC and in no case takes more than 5 mins from the station to the STC bus terminal. The speed gain from one less transfer at Kennedy and a faster ride from STC would more than overcome the time penalty of travelling to STC.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

An LRT would not be overcrowded because ridership won't grow with it.

 

[M II A II R II K]

Extending the SRT downtown with far apart stops would also eliminate the need for a transfer at Kennedy and provide an option to bypass the B/D altogether. Maybe the SRT could go underground on Queen downtown as well.

Far fetched I know but probably not more far fetched than a B/D extension.

 

[Darwinkgo]

ART allows for smaller tunnel diameter, since the floor of the passenger cab is so much closer to the track level compared to traditional high floor subway or LRT.

If you put long enough trains, with a wider width (like was originally planed for Vancouver, the stations and tracks remain convertible to wider cars even today) you can get subway capacity for low increases in operating costs (or maybe even a decrease if you are able to scale back new hires due to less bus drivers).

 

[Ryan]

Here's my plan... demolish disgusting Kennedy station, and rebuild it to the west of its current location; redevelop the spot its currently on. That will allow the subway platform to be realigned pointing north, so it can follow the SRT route to STC.

 

[kEiThZ]

Here's my plan... demolish disgusting Kennedy station, and rebuild it to the west of its current location; redevelop the spot its currently on. That will allow the subway platform to be realigned pointing north, so it can follow the SRT route to STC.

That's a rather useless alignment for a subway and a big problem with the SRT today. The alignment is part of the reason the SRT doesn't pick up many riders at stations like Ellesmere and Midland and McCowan. Instead of that, the subway should go down Danforth and up McCowan. The current station layout supports that alignment and it makes a lot more sense.

 

[CodeMonkey]

Extending the SRT downtown with far apart stops would also eliminate the need for a transfer at Kennedy and provide an option to bypass the B/D altogether. Maybe the SRT could go underground on Queen downtown as well.

Far fetched I know but probably not more far fetched than a B/D extension.

I dunno if it could work going downtown, the idea of smaller tunnels and guide rails are a plus. But i think it would be met with alot of opposition.

 

[nfitz]

I always figured that (unless extended along Eglinton), at Kennedy the SRT (or LRT now that they seem to have confirmed that's the plan) should simply be extended down Kennedy or the railway alignment to Scarborough GO, to provide more network connectivity, and then to Kingston Road.

With the planned conversion to LRT though, an interesting scenario is extending to Kingston Road, and building the proposed Kingston Road BRT as LRT instead, which would then allow for SRT operation into Victoria Park (or even onto the 506 Carlton route, a bit of connecting track down Danforth to Main).

 

[DSC]

See useful updates on Steve Munro's site: http://stevemunro.ca/?p=2688

 

[Dan416]

Getting rid of the SRT is a great idea, but starting the LRT at Kennedy is a mistake. The LRTs should radiate out of STC, and the subways (Danforth and Sheppard) should terminate there.

 

[CodeMonkey]

I still think Metrolinx wants a ICTS/ART line built, and they would probably fix some numbers to favour their choice.

 

[kEiThZ]

I like the fact that using LRT opens up options for inter-lining: Sheppard East to the zoo or Eglinton from the west to Scarborough Town Centre, or even a loop using Sheppard, Morningside, Kingston/Eglinton and the RT corridor.

 

[DavidH]

I still think Metrolinx wants a ICTS/ART line built, and they would probably fix some numbers to favour their choice.

The comment Steve Munro reports from Gary Webster is interesting: TTC now feels that LRT is the appropriate technology for the route and is working with Metrolinx to define the technology and scope for the Transit City projects generally.

This implies that some things that we thought were settled may now be open again. Reading *way* between the lines, I wonder if Metrolinx is starting to have the same concerns that we've seen here, and that some of what was in the TTC EAs may be changing.

 

[CodeMonkey]

The comment Steve Munro reports from Gary Webster is interesting: TTC now feels that LRT is the appropriate technology for the route and is working with Metrolinx to define the technology and scope for the Transit City projects generally.

That really more PR talk to essentially say its up to Metrolinx to say yes or no to the idea and its not the TTC not a fault if Metrolinx turns down the LRT conversion.

But i want to know one thing; is the cost of installing the LRT include riping out the ICTS system before the they can install? Or is that a separate cost altogether?

 

[Dan416]

It'd be nice if Metrolinx did a BCA for extending Sheppard to Downsview and STC, and extending Danforth to STC and saw what that did for transit in Scarborough and economic activity.