City Workers Strike 2009

[christiesplits]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/toronto-striker-charged-after-denting-car/article1204964/

Toronto striker charged after denting car
Resident's car kicked during dispute at temporary garbage drop-off

A striking city worker has been charged with mischief after a resident's car was kicked during a dispute at a temporary garbage drop-off at North Toronto Memorial Arena.

The incident happened at 10 a.m. Thursday after a vehicle jumped the line, said Toronto Constable Wendy Drummond. Louis Roach, 47, of Thornhill, is charged with mischief under $500.

Does anyone have any statistics on how many city employees live outside the city boundaries? The way they are portrayed in the media, you would think these CUPE employees live in some secret bunker underneath His Blondness' High Park home, only coming out for city-subsidized Swedish massages and sick day vacations.

I only ask because a few days before the strike, I talked to a few city gardeners who work on a plot adjacent to my office. Two of the three gardeners told me they reside in Thornhill. Is this typical of most city workers? And if so, should we be sending the cleanup bill to Richmond Hill?

 

[unimaginative2]

Maybe it's why I'm a Liberal, but I find this ideological politics extremely frustrating. It seems like such a lose/lose situation, on this issue as on many others. Right wing ideologues will at least push for greater efficiency in government, but they have no faith in government services and will try to eliminate them wherever possible. Left wing ideologues are true believers in government services and want to use government to improve the city and the lives of its citizens. Unfortunately, they're such true believers that they refuse to take any kind of action to mandate efficient operations and wind up producing budget problems that eventually require cuts in services.

 

[kEiThZ]

When it comes to the trash collectors, I think they should be given a choice between the exorbitant pay (25 bucks an hour) or the exorbitant benefits (18 bankable sick days). Not both. Personally, I think a fair settlement would be letting them keep the sick days but accepting a 20 dollar an hour wage for all new employees.

 

[fiendishlibrarian]

"Does anyone have any statistics on how many city employees live outside the city boundaries?"


My guess is that any stats that *are* kept (and I'm not saying there are) would be more tightly kept under wraps than the Manhattan Project was. They would be just as big a bombshell. I suspect that the *vast* majority of city workers (aside from top managers, political staff, etc.) do *not* live in the city. I read a number once that, for the police at least, perhaps upwards of 80% of officers don't live in the city (mind you Chief Blair lives in Guildwood). You can bet similar numbers exist for fire, ambulance, etc. I remember my father saying that he was one of a handful of guys at Wilson division (and this is the largest division in the TTC, hundreds of employees) who lived in the city. Commutes from Barrie, Ajax, Burlington, etc. were very common amongst his colleagues. And, according to him, there was an inverse relationship between the distance they travelled to their jobs, and their attachment to - and concern of - the city as a whole. Make of that what you will...

In short, I doubt most of these people currently on strike live here.

 

[cdr108]

"Does anyone have any statistics on how many city employees live outside the city boundaries?"


My guess is that any stats that *are* kept (and I'm not saying there are) would be more tightly kept under wraps than the Manhattan Project was. They would be just as big a bombshell. I suspect that the *vast* majority of city workers (aside from top managers, political staff, etc.) do *not* live in the city. I read a number once that, for the police at least, perhaps upwards of 80% of officers don't live in the city (mind you Chief Blair lives in Guildwood). You can bet similar numbers exist for fire, ambulance, etc. I remember my father saying that he was one of a handful of guys at Wilson division (and this is the largest division in the TTC, hundreds of employees) who lived in the city. Commutes from Barrie, Ajax, Burlington, etc. were very common amongst his colleagues. And, according to him, there was an inverse relationship between the distance they travelled to their jobs, and their attachment to - and concern of - the city as a whole. Make of that what you will...

In short, I doubt most of these people currently on strike live here.

so essentially a strike doesn't affect THEIR services since they don't live in the city limits.

 

[kEiThZ]

Maybe it's why I'm a Liberal, but I find this ideological politics extremely frustrating. It seems like such a lose/lose situation, on this issue as on many others. Right wing ideologues will at least push for greater efficiency in government, but they have no faith in government services and will try to eliminate them wherever possible. Left wing ideologues are true believers in government services and want to use government to improve the city and the lives of its citizens. Unfortunately, they're such true believers that they refuse to take any kind of action to mandate efficient operations and wind up producing budget problems that eventually require cuts in services.

Well said and Hudak is already on it:

http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/article/658132

The city unions might end up taking down the premier with them if they keep this up for any significant lenght of time or keep up this behaviour till the next election.

 

[kEiThZ]

so essentially a strike doesn't affect THEIR services since they don't live in the city limits.

This is exactly why Toronto needs to do what New York City does: have wage differentials for resident and non-resident municipal employees.

 

[afransen]

This is exactly why Toronto needs to do what New York City does: have wage differentials for resident and non-resident municipal employees.

I suspect that would be discriminatory.

What the city needs is to take the option to outsource into every labour agreement it has, except essential services. Essential services wages and benefits should not be based on CBAs, but determined by independent arbitrator based on comparable private sector jobs and market conditions.

 

[kEiThZ]

I duuno if it would be illegal to pay people a 'premium' if they live closer to work. The city should give the unions a five year wage freeze with an offer of a cost of living allowance equal to say a 2% raise every year. Throw in some other perks like a free metropass (and take away free parking at municipal buildings). The federal government pays people differently based on where they work, why can't the city? I agree with your privatization suggestions. However, I think it would take the mayoral equivalent of Mike Harris to pull that off. If we can't do that let's at least make them live here, pay taxes here and suffer the consequences of their own labour unrest.

 

[unimaginative2]

Well said and Hudak is already on it:

http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/article/658132

The city unions might end up taking down the premier with them if they keep this up for any significant lenght of time or keep up this behaviour till the next election.

Yeah, but that's the tragedy of it all. He's just another ideologue on the opposite end of the spectrum. He doesn't want to improve the efficiency of city services. He just wants to cut costs in order to shrink the size of government.

 

[kEiThZ]

One good way to promote city employees living in TO or close by is to get rid of municipal parking for all city workers. If the federal government can do it in Ottawa for every government office in the core it should not be that difficult in Toronto. That would end the practice of police officers making 80k per year living in Barrie or Gwillimbury.

 

[Eug]

Why should we care where a city worker lives? Isn't that what public transit is for? And if someone wants to live in Markham, downtown Toronto, or Mississauga, who are we to deny them this right?

 

[LAz]

I support the strikers 100%. My views are based off of this...
http://www.socialistproject.ca/bullet/bullet232.html

The City Isn’t Working Because Capitalism Is Working

 

[GraphicMatt]

Why should we care where a city worker lives? Isn't that what public transit is for? And if someone wants to live in Markham, downtown Toronto, or Mississauga, who are we to deny them this right?

You're right - it really shouldn't matter where city workers choose to live. I absolutely agree with Keith that city workers should not get any kind of free parking, though. Nobody who works in government should. Including council and the mayor. We shouldn't be facilitating long distance commuting to jobs paid for with taxpayer money.

I'm also wondering if there is any kind of link between municipal social assistance programs and the city's hiring practices. Sure seems like you could help out unemployed Toronto residents by giving them employment opportunities with the city.

 

[junctionist]

Why should we care where a city worker lives? Isn't that what public transit is for? And if someone wants to live in Markham, downtown Toronto, or Mississauga, who are we to deny them this right?

We are the people of the city who wish to get the highest quality services and the best city for the taxes we pay. That's why we want city employees to feel like they have a greater stake in the work they do beyond the salary.