Calgary has a lesson for Toronto Transit: try pragmatism

[M II A II R II K]

Another alternative would be to have all Transit City stations far apart but run local bus service on the same streets.

 

[sixrings]

then the drivers would still be fighting with the busses for road space during rush hour... PLus it would be cost prohibitive... ... I do think TC has TOO many stops tho... If It was my design there would ONLY be stops at STOP LIGHTS.

 

[M II A II R II K]

Well the local busses can share the road with the cars and the LRT would be separated.

As for the Calgary setup maybe it would be best to recreate it in Hamilton/Wentorth County and the York Region.

 

[Monarch Butterfly]

Another alternative would be to have all Transit City stations far apart but run local bus service on the same streets.

Like the 12 minute bus service on Yonge Street between York Mills and Eglinton? Most would avoid the buses.

 

[Dan416]

I think if you take out so many stops you need to run a parallel local bus service, then you've taken out too many stops. I think both Yonge and Sheppard could benefit from a couple added stops.

 

[Rainforest]

^ Exactly. Bloor line has stops every 600 - 800 m, and a similar spacing is planned for the underground portion of Eglinton LRT.

But even with the existing stations on Yonge, they could optimize the bus service and make it more attractive. Bus 97 is really needed between Finch and St Clair, where the subway stop spacing is wide. They could run it on 10 min frequency during most of the day.

From St Clair to Front, the subway stops are closely spaced, and parallel bus service is not really needed when the subway is running. The rush-hour 97B buses could be better used on other routes (for example Finch - St Clair).

The short section between Front and Queens Quay could be served by a branch of bus 6 (Bay). The northern extremity (Moore Park and Hilda) could be served by a branch of bus 60 (Steeles West), or they could loop bus 98 through that area.

 

[GregWTravels]

Can you transfer from the 97 to the subway? I remember back a few years that transfers from the 97 weren't accepted at subway stations. Have they removed that rule? It always seemed nonsensical to me.

 

[Jonny5]

Can you transfer from the 97 to the subway? I remember back a few years that transfers from the 97 weren't accepted at subway stations. Have they removed that rule? It always seemed nonsensical to me.

I don't see how that could be true. The 97 enters the fare paid area at St. Clair and Davisville. If a transfer is explicitly allowed there, why not anywherre else?

 

[SunriseChampion]

Yeah, but....Calgary is Calgary. I dare say the best things to learn from Calgary is how NOT to do things.

 

[GenerationW]

Can you transfer from the 97 to the subway? I remember back a few years that transfers from the 97 weren't accepted at subway stations. Have they removed that rule? It always seemed nonsensical to me.

Not sure what rule you're referring to. If you get a paper transfer from the driver when you get on the bus, you can and always could enter the subway.

 

[Mapleson]

The problems Calgary transit has faced are minor compared to Toronto. The GTA will grow by the size of Calgary over the next 10 years (1.5 million people). Building a well planned transportation network is much easier prior to urbanization (any Toronto transport improvement now either is subway or competes against other transportation types). Look at the layout of Calgary streets compared to Toronto.

Calgary's LRT system works very well for Calgary. The idea is to see how they've done it well and how that can translate to here. Toronto needs to look at all aspects of transportation in the GTA. Signal prioritization (for transit, bikes, pedestrians, and private vehicles) need to be rationalized and standardized (policy on priority and wait-time weighting factors). That will have the biggest impact on traffic for the lowest cost (infrastructure is all in place except for any new bike/transit signals needed).

LRT are useful for the suburbs, where ridership levels tail off. That's why they are useful for Calgary, which had 400-500k population in the 1970s.

 

[unimaginative2]

The C-Train is definitely a model the GTA should be examining closely. It's much more appropriate for suburban routes like Transit City or the 905 lines than the St. Clair/Spadina model that we're now following.

 

[Kitsune]

He should of added, its 10 stations by 2012, with 7 coming on an entirely new line that has both a underground and elevated station. Also, the city is planning on burying a portion of the downtown LRT system, and some underground parts do exist near city hall.

 

[ssiguy2]

Calgary's CTrain has been a stellar system for a city of just 1.05 million. With that relatively small population it carries 280,000 passengers a day. I wouldn't recommend it for the current TC which, god willing, will be cancelled but it would be a real benefit for something along the current rail ROW thru to downtown from the burbs within the city of Toronto. It runs every 6 minutes all day so this analogy with commuter rail is absurd and unlike GO it's part of the transit system itself so you don't pay extra fares. Despite all the talk of Calgary being car-crazy I think the stats speak for themselves and ridership will only increase as 2 major extention and one entirely new line being completed by 2012 things will only get better. 2 huge new lines are hoping to be completed by 2030 adding another 40km onto the system putting the system at a minimum of 100km.
Calgary can learn a lot but at the same time few cities can teach Calgary about how to create a successful and efficient transit system.

 

[nfitz]

I wouldn't recommend it for the current TC which, god willing, will be cancelled

I hadn't realized that the anti-Transit city campaign was driven by religion.