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2018 Provincial Election Transit Promises

Yeah, that's as reasonable an argument as we'll get until something miraculous appears on paper.

What's beyond frustrating is @MisterF 's applying sensible clear logic for discussion, but with Dougie on the loose, logic doesn't pertain. He'd bite off his handler's head given the opportunity, just to spite him.

Dougie's little train set. Doesn't matter who bought it, I'm playing my way, even if Lionel doesn't fit on the Hornby Dublo gauge....or else. (As he proceeds to smash all the detailed models built by others) "Daddy said I own them!"

Doug Ford's business has a location in Chicago. Would like to find out if Doug EVER took Chicago's rapid transit "L" which goes (heaven forbid) on the SURFACE!!?

(BTW. Chicago's "L" train cars are the SAME width as the Bombardier Freedom light rail vehicles. ‎2.65 m (8 ft 8 in))
 
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Even Wynne's China shop wasn't the fine china Tory was looking for - it was simply reduced $3 GO fares - not full TTC integration. Taking the TTC to GO would have cost $4.50 - compared to a simple TTC trip for $3.


I believe the fare reduction was to be funded by Carbon Tax funds - so it's probably axed, given how all the other items funded by the tax are as well.
I'm taking more of a long view on this. If in the mid 2020s the RER corridors are indeed electrified and have trains running every 15 minutes or less, proper fare integration is sure to follow regardless of the decisions of current governments. If the infrastructure is built and the service is implemented, true integration is all but inevitable. And Metrolinx, as far as I know, is still quietly working towards it.
 
@nfitz Speaking of the downtown expresses buses - driving south on the DVP last Friday at 6:30 pm, I saw a 144 heading north - empty. Was an interesting sight!
Really!

I take the 143 occasionally, getting on at the last stop near Sherbourne. I'm lucky to get a seat most of the time. There's not many standees - but the last person on, is often standing.
 
(BTW. Chicago's "L" train cars are the SAME width as the Bombardier Freedom light rail vehicles. ‎2.65 m (8 ft 8 in))
The 'L's derivation is from interurbans and trams, and used converted streetcar stock up until quite recently:

Chicago "L" rolling stock - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_"L"_rolling_stock
The rolling stock of the Chicago "L" rapid transit system consists of railcars dating from 1981 to .... windows and other components salvaged from Chicago's recently retired fleet of PCC streetcars. ...

Memories Page 2 - Chicago-L.org
https://www.chicago-l.org/memories/index02.html
To me, CTA's 1-50 series equipped with trolley poles and assigned to Evanston 'L' ... using certain components salvaged from the scrapped streetcar bodies. [...] That prompted me to write a letter to the CTA headquarters in Merchandise Mart. They immediately responded in a letter saying that the 'L cars were remanufactured from CTA's old Green Hornet PCC streetcars, using certain components salvaged from the scrapped streetcar bodies. It explained why the 1-50 and some of the 6000-series cars had visible streetcar origins. Well, at the point, I could not believe that I had ridden on reincarnated PCC streetcars in Wilmette and Evanston.
[...]
 
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I can say with certainty that if GO fares don't come down, no substantial ridership can be achieved.

Completely agree and already the facts bear this out.

Last year GO ridership increased by a paltry 2% which is only the rate of population growth for the GTAH. When considering the huge increase in frequency over the last couple of years and the billions already spent, that is nothing short of horrid and bodes very poorly for the long-term success of RER All this increased service has meant so far for the travelling public is more people getting pissed off at all the more trains rolling by that they can`t afford to take.

RER could be a huge success and a true game changer for the GTA but only with vastly lower fares and ideally the same fare and total integration of the TTC. Then it will become part of the true transit system and not just a luxury cruiser that most Torontonians view it as.
 
Just to add to the above comments, I agree that GO should just ditch the name RER, get rid of the at-grade crossings and call the damn thing a subway. Say a subway is coming to your areas get`s people excited at the prospect while RER is a rather nebulous concept which means little which is why no one except the politicians get excited with new stations or a mild increase in frequency. I`m willing to bet 90% Torontonians have no idea what RER is {although admittedly you can`t blame them because neither does Queen`s Park or Metrolinx} and a good chunk probably don`t even know it`s even being built and don`t care because it won`t make a hoot of difference to them.
 
^Bit of a problem with that:
TTC unveils strategy to grow transit ridership
By BEN SPURRTransportation Reporter
Sun., Jan. 21, 2018

After three years of stalled ridership growth, the TTC has unveiled a plan to attract more passengers to public transit.

The document, released last week ahead of a special meeting of the transit agency’s board on Thursday, proposes a mix of measures big and small that could be implemented over the next five years to both increase the number of trips existing customers take, and to draw new users to the TTC.
[...]
https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/tr...veils-strategy-to-grow-transit-ridership.html

Mass transit is collapsing everywhere | TheHill
thehill.com/opinion/campaign/387498-mass-transit-is-collapsing-everywhere
May 13, 2018 - Nationwide transit ridership is down, but government subsidies are up. ... cities can reverse the decline by building expensive rail transit systems. ... that heavy-rail ridership was declining), and the March data show all major ...
What's Driving Transit Ridership Declines? - CityLab
https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2017/02/whats...transit-ridership.../517701/
Feb 24, 2017 - What's Behind Declining Transit Ridership Nationwide? ... New York City's subwaysystem has posted its first dip in ridership since 2009, ... And, for years, nearly every city in the U.S. (with a few notable exceptions) has posted negative percent changes, too. .... But as history shows, it's harder than it looks.

The Stark (and Hopeful) Facts About Bus Ridership - CityLab
https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2018/05/the-stark-and...ridership/559400/
May 7, 2018 - This nationwide decline in transit ridership has been in progress since ... the ChicagoTransit Authority alone lost more bus riders than all U.S. ... Research in New York, San Francisco, Boston, and nationally show that ... is due to new “Rapid” lines opening, rather than ridership growth on existing routes).
Stagnating transit ridership has officials across Canada stumped - The ...
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/...transit-ridership.../article30178600/
May 26, 2016 - Canada's major transit authorities are reporting stagnating ridership ... Where have allthe transit riders gone? ... like many other transit systems, had been on a steady ridership climb for years – recently reported that 2015 numbers fell short of expectations and 2016 may show a year-over-year decline.

[PDF]Trends in Public Transportation Ridership - Federation of American ...
https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R45144.pdf
Mar 26, 2018 - projects such as rail and bus rapid transit systems through the Capital .... the New York area, which accounts for about 40% of all U.S. transit riders. ... show a further decline in 2017.2 However, the longer-term trend shows a ...

etc, etc, etc.

Let's call them all "subways" and the problem is instantly cured! That GO's seen no ridership increase if that claim is believed means that they've bucked the developed world downturn in transit ridership.

Maybe all the other systems should call themselves GO?
 
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Just in case some posters have lost the plot on what Doug Ford has promised, here's a few reminders:
Doug Ford promises more subways for Toronto
By ROB FERGUSONQueen's Park Bureau
Wed., May 9, 2018

Doug Ford is promising to be the subway premier to ease traffic congestion and transit overcrowding but isn’t saying how quickly he could get new lines built or where a Progressive Conservative government would find the cash if elected June 7.

Repeating his pledge for an extra $5 billion toward Toronto subway construction, Ford said Wednesday his priorities are a downtown relief line from Pape station to Queen — now slated to open in 2031 — extending the Yonge subway line north to Richmond Hill and looping the Sheppard subway to the Scarborough Town Centre.

“Getting new subways built, that will be my job,” vowed Ford, a businessman and former city councillor who has pledged to cut government spending by $6 billion and reduce taxes.

“It’s time to think big and build the transit that we need,” added Ford, criticizing what he characterized as delays in building the $3.35 billion Scarborough subway extension to replace the aging rapid transit line between Kennedy station and the Scarborough Town Centre.

Ford wants to also restore the Scarborough subway to three stops instead of one, saying the needs of local residents have been “ignored” for too long.

“We’re going back to the original plan.”

Construction on the Scarborough subway is not expected to begin for at least two years, with completion in 2026. The two extra stops would add $1 billion to the project and raise the cost to at least $4.6 billion. Planning on the Yonge subway extension to Highway 7 in Richmond Hill is already in the early stages and looping the Sheppard subway to the Scarborough Town Centre is not on the city’s priority list.


Ford, who marks his second month in the job Thursday, maintained a PC government could get subway projects completed faster through a provincial takeover of the building and maintenance of TTC subway lines, leaving the city of Toronto responsible for day-to-day operations.

He hinted money to pay for the subways would be borrowed but had difficulty explaining in detail when asked twice how the financing would work.

“We’re amortizing it over a long period of time,” said Ford, who took just five questions from reporters before walking away from his news conference. “The city of Toronto can’t,” he added in an apparent reference to the municipal debt ceiling.

He also could not answer a reporter’s query on how legislation is passed at Queen’s Park, something that is often taught in high school civics classes.

“You know something, my friend? We can run through that,” he replied curtly. “I know this is a ‘gotcha’ question and everything because that’s your game.”

A transit advocacy group welcomed Ford’s $5 billion transit pledge but said his subway fixation would leave many riders in the lurch on other routes, such as busy Finch Ave. West where planning on a $1.2 billion light rapid transit line is well underway.

“Ford’s plan won’t help TTC riders in Etobicoke and Scarborough who are stuck on the bus for hours,” according to Shelagh Pizey-Allen, executive director of TTCriders. “Instead of a handful of subway stops, we need new, cost-effective transit lines...where they will serve the most riders.”

The governing Liberals said Ford would cut $18 billion on transit across the province when compared to money earmarked in the spring budget while NDP Leader Andrea Horwath noted a previous Conservative government cancelled and filled in the Eglinton West subway line that was under construction in 1995.

It is now being replaced by the Eglinton Crosstown rail line, with Ford pledging “we’re going to make sure that the future Crosstown expansions are only built underground,” referring to extensions to Pearson airport and the University of Toronto’s Scarborough campus.

In contrast, his press release said those portions would be built underground “where feasible.” Burying the lines could add billions to their costs.
https://www.thestar.com/news/queenspark/2018/05/09/doug-ford-promises-more-subways-for-toronto.html

It's absolutely clear what he means by "subways". Crosstown is also mentioned, and in all fairness, so has GO:
Ford’s extra $5 billion for subways is on top of $9 billion the Liberal government has already pledged to transit expansion in Toronto, for additional GO Trains, improved service to Niagara and local projects in other cities.

Ford’s predecessor as PC leader, Patrick Brown, had also promised an extra $5 billion for transit.

The new PC leader also committed to two-way, all-day GO train service to Bowmanville, Niagara and Kitchener and to current transit projects in Ottawa, Hamilton, Mississauga, Kitchener-Waterloo and London.
We're still absent any kind of details, because Ford's motor mouth accelerator is stuck, but the wheels aren't turning.

And some think "subways" apply to omnibuses, dromedaries and weasels and anything with a head stuck in the ground. Is it any wonder Ford won when most don't understand what's meant by "subways"?
 
While Ford hasn`t said anything since elected, I can`t say I blame him. He has had bigger and far more serious concerns right from the get-go than nearly any Premier in recent Ontario history. The guy is walking into an economy that could be slammed by 20% auto tariffs which would crush a major sector of the economy, send the provinces unemployment rating rising, and lower government revenues and it`s all at the whim of a man in Washington who changes his mind like the weather.

Transit, like other major issues requires money and in such a tenuous time that is very hard to budget for.
 
While Ford hasn`t said anything since elected, I can`t say I blame him. He has had bigger and far more serious concerns right from the get-go than nearly any Premier in recent Ontario history. The guy is walking into an economy that could be slammed by 20% auto tariffs which would crush a major sector of the economy, send the provinces unemployment rating rising, and lower government revenues and it`s all at the whim of a man in Washington who changes his mind like the weather.

Transit, like other major issues requires money and in such a tenuous time that is very hard to budget for.

Good thing Ford doesn't even have a high school diploma. As Premier Wynne said: "Good fucking luck, Ontario!" https://www.thebeaverton.com/2018/06/good-fucking-luck-ontario/
 
I think one of the things that RER has going for it is that it was broken up into many smaller contracts, so it can better stay under the radar. Many of these contracts are line-specific, or even neighbourhood-specific, improvements.

Nobody who takes the Stouffville Line is going to be up in arms about a project to double-track the corridor. Nobody who drives along Burloak is going to be up in arms about an underpass (in fact, they're pretty much begging for it). Even if the electrification component of RER gets delayed, these other projects will still result in noticeable improvements.

And I agree with the post a few pages back about "re-branding" RER. "RER" is a pretty technical term that very few people outside of transit circles have any idea what it means. I think to Ford, "subway" simply means "frequent rail transit that is out of the way of my SUV". If we can convince him that RER fits that definition, I think it'll be safe.
 

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