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2014 Municipal Election: Toronto Transit Plans

denfromoakvillemilton said:
John Tory won't build Finch and Sheppard LRT's, at first



http://spacing.ca/toronto/2014/05/08/lorinc-john-tory-qa-pay-transit/

Well now we know the Sheppard East subway will be built if Tory is mayor.
Click to expand...

Sheppard East subway??? He said nothing about that in the article you linked to. He said his first priority is Yonge Street Relief Line AKA DRL. He mentions delaying the Finch & Sheppard LRTs, but there is no mention at all of a Sheppard East subway.
 
denfromoakvillemilton said:
John Tory won't build Finch and Sheppard LRT's, at first

http://spacing.ca/toronto/2014/05/08/lorinc-john-tory-qa-pay-transit/

Well now we know the Sheppard East subway will be built if Tory is mayor.
Click to expand...

I don't know if that's a valid assumption to make. He clearly wants to make the DRL priority #1, which is exactly where it should be. Here's what I suspect he may do:

1) Ask for funding from the Province and the Feds for the DRL.

2) If he doesn't get the full amount, ask to transfer the funding from the SELRT and/or FWLRT to make up the difference (potentially a ~$2B boost).

I suspect he's not committing to cancelling them and not committing to building them because he doesn't yet know if he's going need that money for the DRL or not. It's quite a smart political move, IMO.

Also, the Province + Feds may say "we'll fund Danforth to Downtown, but anything more you're on your own". By keeping that $2B from the LRTs on the table, he can redirect it to either the DRL West or an up-to-Eglinton extension, both of which would likely have a higher pphpd than Finch West and Sheppard East combined.
 
ehlow said:
Sheppard East subway??? He said nothing about that in the article you linked to. He said his first priority is Yonge Street Relief Line AKA DRL. He mentions delaying the Finch & Sheppard LRTs, but there is no mention at all of a Sheppard East subway.
Click to expand...

gweed123 said:
I don't know if that's a valid assumption to make. He clearly wants to make the DRL priority #1, which is exactly where it should be. Here's what I suspect he may do:

1) Ask for funding from the Province and the Feds for the DRL.

2) If he doesn't get the full amount, ask to transfer the funding from the SELRT and/or FWLRT to make up the difference (potentially a ~$2B boost).

I suspect he's not committing to cancelling them and not committing to building them because he doesn't yet know if he's going need that money for the DRL or not. It's quite a smart political move, IMO.

Also, the Province + Feds may say "we'll fund Danforth to Downtown, but anything more you're on your own". By keeping that $2B from the LRTs on the table, he can redirect it to either the DRL West or an up-to-Eglinton extension, both of which would likely have a higher pphpd than Finch West and Sheppard East combined.
Click to expand...

Is there any other reason to cancel them when the budget clearly outlined how the DRL was going to be paid for? SELRT should be built, obviously JT does not feel that way and is being diplomatic. The 2 billion should stay with the LRT's
 
denfromoakvillemilton said:
Is there any other reason to cancel them when the budget clearly outlined how the DRL was going to be paid for? SELRT should be built, obviously JT does not feel that way and is being diplomatic. The 2 billion should stay with the LRT's
Click to expand...

What I got from the article was that the DRL is obviously his #1 priority and he may ask the province to shift funding from Finch & Sheppard LRTs to it.

There was no mention at all of a Sheppard subway extension, what he's saying was that the Sheppard LRT would not be built, which means Sheppard would stay as is (a bus line) for the foresee-able future.

I personally think Tory's overall strategy is to get as many Ford supporters as possible and to have similar overall policies as him but offer it without the crack-smoking and late-night show mockery, so not supporting Finch & Sheppard LRTs aligns with that.
 
ehlow said:
What I got from the article was that the DRL is obviously his #1 priority and he may ask the province to shift funding from Finch & Sheppard LRTs to it.

There was no mention at all of a Sheppard subway extension, what he's saying was that the Sheppard LRT would not be built, which means Sheppard would stay as is (a bus line) for the foresee-able future.

I personally think Tory's overall strategy is to get as many Ford supporters as possible and to have similar overall policies as him but offer it without the crack-smoking and late-night show mockery, so not supporting Finch & Sheppard LRTs aligns with that.
Click to expand...

Ford's policy is to build subways on Finch and Sheppard. Obviously Finch will not get a subway. He should have came out and said the Finch and Sheppard LRT's are here to stay, that's what I wanted to hear.
 
denfromoakvillemilton said:
Is there any other reason to cancel them when the budget clearly outlined how the DRL was going to be paid for? SELRT should be built, obviously JT does not feel that way and is being diplomatic. The 2 billion should stay with the LRT's
Click to expand...

But the question is how much of the DRL will actually be covered? It's going to be the most expensive transit project in the Province by a long shot if the entire Bloor-Downtown-Danforth-Eglinton stetch is built. I would not be surprised at all if the Province covers from Danforth to University or Spadina, and asks the City to pick up the rest of the tab if they want it extended west or north. The Province has clearly shifted tact towards GO REX, offering up a more ambitious plan than what the Big Move originally conceived, which may mean funding distributions are not the same as they were assumed to be even last year.
 
denfromoakvillemilton said:
Ford's policy is to build subways on Finch and Sheppard. Obviously Finch will not get a subway. He should have came out and said the Finch and Sheppard LRT's are here to stay, that's what I wanted to hear.
Click to expand...

Tory is skewing towards Ford's policies overall but there's no way he'd say that Finch and Sheppard will get subways. He has the much more reasonable stance that DRL should be the next subway.

Tory has given no indication as far as I can tell of wanting or supporting a subway on Finch or Sheppard East. It's clear that the message he's giving is that his main priority is DRL.
 
gweed123 said:
But the question is how much of the DRL will actually be covered? It's going to be the most expensive transit project in the Province by a long shot if the entire Bloor-Downtown-Danforth-Eglinton stetch is built. I would not be surprised at all if the Province covers from Danforth to University or Spadina, and asks the City to pick up the rest of the tab if they want it extended west or north. The Province has clearly shifted tact towards GO REX, offering up a more ambitious plan than what the Big Move originally conceived, which may mean funding distributions are not the same as they were assumed to be even last year.
Click to expand...

It looks like just that Pape-St Andrew portion will be built, which is not nearly enough. JT should be lobbying for the Dundas West - Don Mills South version to be built. Then the city can build Don Mills to Sheppard and Dundas West to Mount Dennis.
 
ehlow said:
Tory is skewing towards Ford's policies overall but there's no way he'd say that Finch and Sheppard will get subways. He has the much more reasonable stance that DRL should be the next subway.

Tory has given no indication as far as I can tell of wanting or supporting a subway on Finch or Sheppard East. It's clear that the message he's giving is that his main priority is DRL.
Click to expand...

Exactly, because both are stupid. So why say you can't have it both ways? Why are Finch and Sheppard fair game?
 
denfromoakvillemilton said:
It looks like just that Pape-St Andrew portion will be built, which is not nearly enough. JT should be lobbying for the Dundas West - Don Mills South version to be built. Then the city can build Don Mills to Sheppard and Dundas West to Mount Dennis.
Click to expand...

Up to Sheppard in the east and Eglinton in the west is very unlikely. The only way that would ever realistically happen is if it was built as part of the GO REX network instead of the TTC subway network, and the branches could be in the various rail corridors.

As long as we're assuming TTC subway though, the realistic limits are probably Eglinton in the east and Bloor in the west.

Like I said though, I wouldn't be surprised at all if the Province/Metrolinx asked Toronto to put some skin in the game, and actually fund a bit of the project themselves.
 
Wait a second, did Tory change his position again Tory softens position

Tory is so wishy washy on everything. No wonder he has a high approval rating. If you listen to him long enough you have to agree with him eventually at some time because he agrees with you on every point until somebody else makes another argument, then he will agree with him.

For example. Looking at the chart that was posted a few pages back saying he wants to keep the Gardiner. I specifically remember earlier this year when he was still on radio talking about how the city needs to look at more imaginative options, maybe look at burying it (which is an idea I like) now he flips to the most generic, unimaginative option.

Even though I think the DRL is very important and Tory talks a good game. But he talked a good game on a lot of issue before changing flipping his position for his own self-interest.
 
StatGeek said:
Wait a second, did Tory change his position again Tory softens position

Tory is so wishy washy on everything. No wonder he has a high approval rating. If you listen to him long enough you have to agree with him eventually at some time because he agrees with you on every point until somebody else makes another argument, then he will agree with him.

For example. Looking at the chart that was posted a few pages back saying he wants to keep the Gardiner. I specifically remember earlier this year when he was still on radio talking about how the city needs to look at more imaginative options, maybe look at burying it (which is an idea I like) now he flips to the most generic, unimaginative option.

Even though I think the DRL is very important and Tory talks a good game. But he talked a good game on a lot of issue before changing flipping his position for his own self-interest.
Click to expand...

You really don't watch much political channels do you? XD Politicians are wishy-washy in general; they will say anything that will rally their voter base to the ballot box and win an election.

Personally, I think they should just extend the Sheppard subway line east and westward, connecting to the Scarborough Center to the east and Downsview to the west, but that's just me. I just really fail to see how making a new LRT line on the same path as Sheppard if it were to expand eastward makes any logistical sense, as it would basically mean that the TTC would have to operate two different systems of transport, and be turning the Shepard line into a stump. It would make more sense to convert the Sheppard subway to an LRT line so that both it and the proposed Sheppard East line can become one entity.
 
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