2008 GO Ridership Figures

[kettal]

As is, the majority of routes have no incentive to terminate at RHC, but it does not take a subway station on-site to change that sentiment, only political will to electrify a preexisting mass transit corridor for well under a billion dollars compared to the $5-6 billion it'll take to extend the subway northwards. Your's is a straw man defense of subway expansion, if I ever heard one.

The RH tracks will have to be re-routed to a straighter corridor, too.

 

[Fresh Start]

Who suggested that the majority of routes terminate at RHC? Your argument is a straw man argument against subway expansion, if I ever heard one.

At least RHC is within an Urban Growth Centre, unlike Hurontario/Elia.

Good question because I sure didn't. Apart from the Yonge BRTs, Highway 7 BRTs and 2 minor bus routes, nothing has to route into RHC, although more certainly could as to give off the impression that it is a bustling downtown core. Mine is just an argument against avarice and wasteful spending. Cities such as Chicago and New York City among others have proven that the model of joint local/express limited stopping rail services can be successful. If that means that your transfer point's 5 minutes east of NYCC, well too bad.

Also Hurontario/Elia is apart of Greater Mississauga Centre Area roughly bound by Mavis/Eglinton/Kennedy/Central Pkwy, which last I checked was an Urban Growth Centre.

 

[CDL.TO]

GO has supplied parking figures for each station on its website, but I know I've noticed a few occasions where they either haven't been updated or are a straightforward error (e.g. Hamilton GO being said to have "no parking" when there are something like two dozen GO reserved spaces there.)

I think GO's figures are fairly accurate. They take parking statistics very seriously.

The "reserved parking" at Hamilton is for people who work at the GO Centre station. The building includes 4 floors of office space, a couple retail tenants, as well as GO and HSR staff, all of which most certainly need to have parking supplied due to municipal regulations. The parking is not available to the public, as far as I can tell.

 

[doady]

Good question because I sure didn't. Apart from the Yonge BRTs, Highway 7 BRTs and 2 minor bus routes, nothing has to route into RHC

Straw man again. Nobody said said that other bus routes HAVE to route through Richmond Hill Centre. After all, Richmond Hill Centre doesn't necessarily HAVE to be located in an Urban Growth Centre. It doesn't necessarily HAVE to have connections to a Yonge subway, a Yonge BRT, a Highway 7 BRT, a GO Train, or a 407/GO Transitway. Highway 7 and Yonge don't necessarily HAVE to be the busiest transit corridors in York Region by far. These elements of Richmond Hill Centre could be eliminated or scaled back.

But I don't see the point.

 

[Disparishun]

Finch Stn's numbers are being artificially propped up by the number of bus routes from York Region which terminate there. If the routes were rerouted elsewhere or intercepted by another high-capacity, high-speed RT line prior to reaching Yonge St, the numbers would go down.

Those routes that are in the region of Yonge St. will always have an incentive to terminate at a nearby Yonge St. subway station.

Those routes that are eastward -- in the region of Bayview, or Leslie -- could indeed be rerouted if there were another high-capacity, high-speed RT line prior to reaching Yonge St. That line is the RH line. The location is Old Cummer.

In addition to high frequencies, fare by distance and interconnections with intercepting routes (Finch LRT, Sheppard subway, Eglinton LRT, and something between Eglinton and Union) would be required.

Not only could Old Cummer intercept buses coming from the north. It could also intercept buses coming from the east, along Sheppard and Finch, packed with people wanting to head south.

Mine is just an argument against avarice and wasteful spending.

Avarice? Do tell, please. But do not leave out any other deadly Catholic sins, either! There are seven, as I understand it. Our transit planning must not fall prey to any a one.

 

[Fresh Start]

Those routes that are in the region of Yonge St. will always have an incentive to terminate at a nearby Yonge St. subway station.

Those routes that are eastward -- in the region of Bayview, or Leslie -- could indeed be rerouted if there were another high-capacity, high-speed RT line prior to reaching Yonge St. That line is the RH line. The location is Old Cummer.

In addition to high frequencies, fare by distance and interconnections with intercepting routes (Finch LRT, Sheppard subway, Eglinton LRT, and something between Eglinton and Union) would be required.

Not only could Old Cummer intercept buses coming from the north. It could also intercept buses coming from the east, along Sheppard and Finch, packed with people wanting to head south.

Avarice? Do tell, please. But do not leave out any other deadly Catholic sins, either! There are seven, as I understand it. Our transit planning must not fall prey to any a one.

Avarice is just a synonym for greed, you don't have to read anything further into my word choice, lol. There is nothing wrong with the Clark, Miliken, Bathurst and Bayview buses continuing to route into Finch Stn. In fact I encourage it. The subway is redundant and wasteful if you consider the spacing gaps through Thornhill. Most local residents will use a bus to get to the subway rather than walk it there. The TTC/Metrolinx are forecasting an average daily usage for the Clark, Royal Orchard and Longbridge station stops that is lower than Bessarion which ranks dead last in patronage among true subway stops. A busway would make stops every 400m (Steeles-Doncaster-Clark-John-Royal Orchard-Bay Thron-Longbridge-RHC-High Tech-Bantry-16th). All it takes is dedicated bus lanes down the median of Yonge Street with an advanced green/red for transit vehicles at intersections to make the route more efficient. Surely widening the at-grade roadway to accomodate a permanent ROW costs less than a full-blown subway, right? And buses can route down it in queue, passing laid over vehicles when the other lane's available. And it wouldn't take a decade to build either. Even with the lethargy commonplace in transitworks these days, such a line could be built within 24 months. This is why revamping the Bala Subdivision is critical as an alternate for many York residents until Yonge construction is complete. It also places emphasis on entertaining the notion of utilizing more of the Finch Hydro Corridor as an alternate guideway inwards to Finch Stn.

You guys may think that I don't care about the suburbs, but the truth is that I want better for York and Mississauga than a near hour-long odyssey aboard an endless multi-stopping subway line, especially when preexisting transit rail corridors permeate all around their nodal areas. I like your suggestion about Old Cummer. I think you've emphasized the point that I'm trying to get across, that commuters are not readily seeking Finch/Yonge or Sheppard/Don Mills, et al as their primary destination; they're just seeking the fastest method possible with which to get them to where they are really going. Statistics prove that is this the area from Eglinton southwards. People destined for NYCC by all means should rely on those RT routes which feed directly into the Finch/Yonge head.

 

[Fresh Start]

Straw man again. Nobody said said that other bus routes HAVE to route through Richmond Hill Centre. After all, Richmond Hill Centre doesn't necessarily HAVE to be located in an Urban Growth Centre. It doesn't necessarily HAVE to have connections to a Yonge subway, a Yonge BRT, a Highway 7 BRT, a GO Train, or a 407/GO Transitway. Highway 7 and Yonge don't necessarily HAVE to be the busiest transit corridors in York Region by far. These elements of Richmond Hill Centre could be eliminated or scaled back.

But I don't see the point.

Don't make me laugh. Ever heard of VIVA Pink? Why do buses necessarily have to go right across the Hwy 7 corridor when there is obviously a pretty dominant tapering off of density and ergo demand east of Bathrust and west of Leslie. Apart from the Transitway, which will only run infrequent trips anyhow, there is absolutely no strong conviction to make everything terminate at the Yonge/7 intersection. Having a subway and GO Train Line destined for the same end-point downtown is redundant. It'd be either/or. Extending the subway in fact kills Richmond Hill GO's usefulness although the latter would offer a faster, smoothier, less expensive option for commuters in a post-electirfication, post-fare integration world. And fact alone you readily admit that there'd have to be a parallel Yonge BRT overlapping with the subway through Thornhill only proves what a joke this whole entitlement pork-barrel browbeating truly amounts to.

If you're going to support subway expansion, at least do so for the areas which actually have the population density to support them. And no, hypothetical growth at a highway turnabout 30 years from now doesn't count.

 

[GTS]

Doady mentioned earlier that he said Richmond Hill Center makes better sense then Erindale as a regional hub. Erindale is so close to Square One and a lot of different bus routes use this hub, one of the busier hubs in the GTA I read. It would make sense for GO or Mississauga Transit to have a rapid transit link at Square One that would link up to the Erindale GO station. I imagine that such a link would convince some more GO users to use transit to get to Erindale instead of their cars. Mississuga city center is already quite developed and is naturally becoming a hub on its own without any rapid transit link- yet.

I also read plans that either Durham Transit or Go or Metrolinx was going to build a pedestrian walkway from Pickering Town Center bus station with GO Pickering Station on the other side of the 401. I just hope that GO starts having better links with each regional transit system it enters. Sometimes it is a pain to get from certain GO stations to the local bus station.

 

[SunriseChampion]

I also read plans that either Durham Transit or Go or Metrolinx was going to build a pedestrian walkway from Pickering Town Center bus station with GO Pickering Station on the other side of the 401. I just hope that GO starts having better links with each regional transit system it enters. Sometimes it is a pain to get from certain GO stations to the local bus station.

This is currently under construction! (Thank the Maker!!!)

Though, the bus terminal is currently at the train station, it will be moved north of the highway when the new office tower, parking garage, bus terminal, station building and pedestrian highway overpass are complete in 2011.
They've started work on the new station building and the office building but none of the rest as of yet.

Sorry, quite off topic but I had to clear this up. Any mention of it over-excites me as I've been waiting for this to start for a few years now.

 

[Disparishun]

Avarice is just a synonym for greed, you don't have to read anything further into my word choice, lol.

I mean, if you start calling me names, then I'm probably not going to like it, fatso.

The subway is redundant and wasteful if you consider the spacing gaps through Thornhill.

What you really mean is that the subway is redundant and wasteful between the Clark and Longbridge stops, because Old Thornhill will never have much density.

That's why the subway won't stop along those 2.5 km except for Royal Orchard, which I agree is a questionable stop.

The logical northern terminal, though, is at a major Places to Grow spot and transit hub. That's at Langstaff at 7.

Most local residents will use a bus to get to the subway rather than walk it there.

I don't understand. Is this somehow different than anywhere else in the city? Are you saying that walk-in traffic exceeds traffic delivered by bus and car everywhere else?

A busway would make stops every 400m (Steeles-Doncaster-Clark-John-Royal Orchard-Bay Thron-Longbridge-RHC-High Tech-Bantry-16th). All it takes is dedicated bus lanes down the median of Yonge Street with an advanced green/red for transit vehicles at intersections to make the route more efficient.

You're advocating that the reserved single lane become reserved double-lane busway, and that stop frequency be increased. You're suggesting that this will create the correct public transit solution for the stretch of Yonge between Finch and the Langstaff/RHC terminal. Yes?

You guys may think that I don't care about the suburbs, but the truth is that I want better for York and Mississauga than a near hour-long odyssey aboard an endless multi-stopping subway line, especially when preexisting transit rail corridors permeate all around their nodal areas.

The subway works great for the Finch-to-Langstaff corridor (part of which is located within York Region), actually. I'm not sure what any of this has to do with Mississauga, mind you.

I like your suggestion about Old Cummer. I think you've emphasized the point that I'm trying to get across, that commuters are not readily seeking Finch/Yonge or Sheppard/Don Mills, et al as their primary destination; they're just seeking the fastest method possible with which to get them to where they are really going. Statistics prove that is this the area from Eglinton southwards. People destined for NYCC by all means should rely on those RT routes which feed directly into the Finch/Yonge head.

People between Finch and Langstaff, along the Yonge axis, are going principally to hubs, right: Finch-NYCC-Sheppard; Eglinton; Bloor, College, Dundas, King, etc. That's the definition of hubs. What RT routes have to do with this I am not sure.

The geography of the RHC GO line serves a different group of people -- those in York Region, well north of Langstaff, to a small degree; those in the City of Toronto well east of the Yonge axis, to a much greater degree. Its revamping into an actually-existing transit option has nothing to do with the Yonge Extension. But it is needed, too.

 

[Fresh Start]

I mean, if you start calling me names, then I'm probably not going to like it, fatso.

I never called anyone names. You however just called me fatso, unprovoked, implying that I am obese. Very telling of the type of mindsets that I'm dealing with here.

What you really mean is that the subway is redundant and wasteful between the Clark and Longbridge stops, because Old Thornhill will never have much density.

Okay. What if I told you that high-speed ALRT could run north from Finch Stn in a underground ROW to as far as the York Sub with a station at Yonge to serve the Clark intersection, proceeded by a piggyback across and up the York and Bala Subdivisions straight into downtown Richmond Hill, with a station stop along the way at the already developed, high-density, with condos no less, Thornhill Square area? I'd propose this right alongside a complimentary Yonge North Busway that Routes 2, 5, 77 could all share with VIVA Blue/Pink. A cost-effective, time-effective, multifaceted solution that truly will transform RHC into a downtown is a better aim than pork-barrel largesse.

Activity occurs at the street-level. Ergo mass-transit must interface directly with that density to enhance the urban quality of the streets. It would lessen auto traffic down Yonge, freeing up space for wider sidewalks, reduce the noise and air pollution, and actually bring a lot more business to the street-level which is where the retail businesses are. In contrast to basement level retail, ground level retail can be readily linked to mass transit stops as is the case with several shopping districts throughout downtown Toronto (Queen West, Roncesvalles, etc.). This would encourage building-owners to lease out their ground areas and lead to them becoming thriving places to recreate and socialize at, not just for daytime office workers, the majority of whom could easy well drive to work via the 407, but by casual evening visitors as well. Even Old Thornhill immediately bordering Yonge could become a happening place, then a block inwards sleepy suburbia. A subway however would bypass all that, never triggering the intensification needed because business potential clientele will never see reason to visit local shoppes and eateries within a tunnel. Yonge North is already a pre-approved BRT corridor, hence upgrading the ROW service level to full busway status would be a shovel-ready project. The expenditure would be manageable such that municipalities can largely finance the project themselves without awaiting federal handouts. With 3-car bi-articulates, a tunnel is not necessary to meet the capacity demands by 2031 for north-south travel. So if you really wanted your city to develop, thrive and be integrated with many parts of the greater region, you'd realize this.

That's why the subway won't stop along those 2.5 km except for Royal Orchard, which I agree is a questionable stop.

At $350 million/km with inflation plus a complex river crossing, can you not see why I think that this is excessive and wasteful? The most expensive part of the ROW doesn't even have stops. What the taxpayer is basically paying for then is an express underground GO train line with station gaps wider than the GO line through Markham.

The logical northern terminal, though, is at a major Places to Grow spot and transit hub. That's at Langstaff at 7.

Serious talk of extending it to Carville/16th is already floating around. There is no satisfying York's subway-lust. Next YUS will be proposed to Bloomington. This is why if a parallel, overlapping BRT line is needed between Finch and RHC anyway and has the throughness of routing to go all the way up into Newmarket, it'd be wiser to invest in making that service operate much faster and more efficiently ahead of planning pie-in-the-sky subway extensions.

In that vain, the logical northern terminus already exists, it is called Finch. Smack on a hydro corridor that potentially could be transformed into a highway for buses, no less. The modal switch must occur somewhere and people from all over the GTA are mighty accustomed to using this hub. We just now need to make getting there faster, more simplified.

I don't understand. Is this somehow different than anywhere else in the city? Are you saying that walk-in traffic exceeds traffic delivered by bus and car everywhere else?

Downtown it does, across the Bloor-Danforth from Jane to Main the vast majority of local residents walk it in. If I happened to live at Centre/Yonge, what precisely would my options be?

You're advocating that the reserved single lane become reserved double-lane busway, and that stop frequency be increased. You're suggesting that this will create the correct public transit solution for the stretch of Yonge between Finch and the Langstaff/RHC terminal. Yes?

It'd be 2.5 to 3 dedicated lanes most of the ROW: 1 southbound, 1 northbound, 1/2 to 1 passing lane. There doesn't have to be a partition between the bus lanes thereby freeing up a lane whenever the bus ahead of another stops to offload/on-load passengers.

Ideally a simplified version of this with not so wide partitions would work for Yonge St and it wouldn't cost endless billions of dollars to complete either.

The subway works great for the Finch-to-Langstaff corridor (part of which is located within York Region), actually. I'm not sure what any of this has to do with Mississauga, mind you.

It has to do with Mississauga by comparison because some people are of the belief that the Bloor-Danforth should be extended to its city centre.

People between Finch and Langstaff, along the Yonge axis, are going principally to hubs, right: Finch-NYCC-Sheppard; Eglinton; Bloor, College, Dundas, King, etc. That's the definition of hubs. What RT routes have to do with this I am not sure.

LRT/BRT as substitutes for HRT subways. Cost less, yields more total kms of rapid transit. Time to build less, customer niches catered to more. Many people do not want to ride on the subway all the way into the downtown. The only difference between a modal switch at Finch Stn and continuing the subway northwards is an additional transfer for those only going in-between RHC and NYCC. Everyone from points further away (Richmond Hill's Yonge corridor; VIVA Pink) will enjoy the one-seat direct ride into the subway. You for instance, could walk it into the Glen Cameron ALRT Stn, ride it down two stops in under 5 minutes and just walk across or down the platform area to board a TTC subway car. If that's what's considered inconvenient, then I don't know what to say.

The geography of the RHC GO line serves a different group of people -- those in York Region, well north of Langstaff, to a small degree; those in the City of Toronto well east of the Yonge axis, to a much greater degree. Its revamping into an actually-existing transit option has nothing to do with the Yonge Extension. But it is needed, too.

No it doesn't. It targets the densest part of Thornhill where three bus routes happen to layover. It runs through the heart of the planned downtown, it runs 2 clicks away from the bustling Yonge/16th intersection and Hillcrest Mall, it runs through German Mills. Mass transit along this corridor would be a godsend for all those seeking an alternative to the Yonge subway to get downtown. And if that isn't enough, there's always the option of a Yonge-York-Bala aligned electric railway with headways similar to the subway. And a busway line that serves all of York's Yonge St, not just 4 measly kms of it. The Bala Sub happens to run through major employment centres (Leslie/Sheppard, Lesmill, Don Mills, Wynford Hts) and the West Don Lands. You may think that a significant number of commuters aren't destined for places outside of the Yonge corridor but seeing as higher passenger yields are originating from east-of-Yonge 905/416, that would tell me otherwise. It would also interface with the Eglinton premetro and potentially the DRL. Giving people direct access to many parts of Toronto rather than forcing the majority of people to transfer off the Yonge Line at some point to backtrack elsewhere is the entire point of creating alternate options.

 

[Disparishun]

I never called anyone names. You however just called me fatso, unprovoked, implying that I am obese. Very telling of the type of mindsets that I'm dealing with here.

Sigh. Off your high horse, please. Although I am liking the switch from Catholic dogma to playground antics, I will drop the sarcasm and state it even more clearly to help us get there. You keep telling me I'm greedy. You don't see that as calling anyone names, which is a mindset you're free to carry around with you. But if you'd like to persist in attaching unflattering adjectives to others, I'd think that at some point you ought to say why. Do you understand?

Okay. What if I told you that high-speed ALRT could run north from Finch Stn in a underground ROW to as far as the York Sub with a station at Yonge to serve the Clark intersection, proceeded by a piggyback across and up the York and Bala Subdivisions straight into downtown Richmond Hill, with a station stop along the way at the already developed, high-density, with condos no less, Thornhill Square area?

You have done more than tell us all. You have drawn a picture. You have argued that the best idea is to go the expense of tunnelling from Finch, up to Clark, and then play twisty turny, and that this should certainly involve a transfer at Finch to a whole other mode of transport, notwithstanding the tunnel. All of which would avoid the Places to Grow hub at Langstaff, which in turn would be served by between 1.5 and 2 reserved bus lanes in either direction, which would replace the one reserved bus lane in either direction that is there now.

To be frank, I'm not sure I have the energy to debate it. I see no merit in that idea on those routes. Leave it at that. (True BRT as opposed to VIVA's current configuration, of course, is an excellent idea in lots of places. Is it needed on Yonge north of RHC? In the future, it may be.)

Activity occurs at the street-level. Ergo mass-transit must interface directly with that density to enhance the urban quality of the streets. It would lessen auto traffic down Yonge, freeing up space for wider sidewalks, reduce the noise and air pollution, and actually bring a lot more business to the street-level (...)
Even Old Thornhill immediately bordering Yonge could become a happening place, then a block inwards sleepy suburbia. A subway however would bypass all that, never triggering the intensification needed because business potential clientele will never see reason to visit local shoppes and eateries within a tunnel.

Shorter version: "Transit City". Yes, we are all familiar with these arguments. I look forward to Paris-on-Scarborough. With shoppes!

So if you really wanted your city to develop, thrive and be integrated with many parts of the greater region, you'd realize this.

"You'd realize this"? Do you allow for a world in which others come to different conclusions than you? Is this where your whole greed/avarice thing comes from? It's mildly unsettling, and does not strengthen your arguments. I'd suggest you drop this line. Assuming, of course, that you, too, wish our city to develop.

Serious talk of extending it to Carville/16th is already floating around. There is no satisfying York's subway-lust. Next YUS will be proposed to Bloomington.

Reread the above. Did you really intend to write that? I will only say this: policy ought to be driven by reasonable discussion, not animal spirits. RHC is a logical terminus. Not Finch, or Carrville, or Bloomington Sideroad.

If they ever build a giant honking highway across Bloomington Sideroad, extend the Spadina line up to the same giant honking highway, stick a bunch of GO and VIVA BRT lines across said honker, designate Yonge-Bloomington a Places to Grow regional hub and, well, do a bunch of other things, then that might change the discussion.

In that vain, the logical northern terminus already exists, it is called Finch. Smack on a hydro corridor that potentially could be transformed into a highway for buses, no less. The modal switch must occur somewhere and people from all over the GTA are mighty accustomed to using this hub. We just now need to make getting there faster, more simplified.

I see. In fairness, I guess we could do with more honkers. There are certainly ways to turn Finch into a useful terminus by spending very large amounts of money on new east-west infrastructure that intersects with it, if that it what you mean. The thing is... oh, never mind.

It has to do with Mississauga by comparison because some people are of the belief that the Bloor-Danforth should be extended to its city centre.

Some people are also of the belief that there was no moon landing. However, stating "I want better for York and Mississauga than a near hour-long odyssey aboard an endless multi-stopping subway line" has everything to do with Mississauga, and nothing to do with the Finch-to-Langstaff Yonge corridor or the moon landing. A near-hour-long odyssey is not what happens on Yonge. Actually, it works quite well.

No it doesn't. It targets the densest part of Thornhill where three bus routes happen to layover. It runs through the heart of the planned downtown, it runs 2 clicks away from the bustling Yonge/16th intersection and Hillcrest Mall, it runs through German Mills.

It sounds like you are saying that Yonge-16th and Hillcrest Mall and German Mills are denser, and in the future are to remain denser, than the Finch-to-Langstaff Yonge corridor for which the Yonge Extension has been proposed. With the obvious and important exception of the 2 km stretch of Old Thornhill, those seem like strange things to say.

I agree that the use case for going from Clark to RHC is almost entirely about getting to RHC, if that is where you are headed.

Downtown it does, across the Bloor-Danforth from Jane to Main the vast majority of local residents walk it in. If I happened to live at Centre/Yonge, what precisely would my options be?

It sounds like you are saying two things.

First, that a subway stop ought not to be built unless we can expect the majority of its traffic to arrive there, not by bus or private vehicle, but by people who walk there from their origin or destination points.

Second, that that is exactly how most traffic at existing TTC subway stops is generated. (Or maybe you are saying that that is how most traffic is generated on the B-D line from Jane to Main and, furthermore, that the rest of the subway ought therefore not to have been built. Or maybe you are only talking about downtown, and stuck in "Jane to Main" for rhyming effect. I can't really tell.)

Those ring a little bit strangely to me.

You may think that a significant number of commuters aren't destined for places outside of the Yonge corridor but seeing as higher passenger yields are originating from east-of-Yonge 905/416, that would tell me otherwise. It would also interface with the Eglinton premetro and potentially the DRL. Giving people direct access to many parts of Toronto rather than forcing the majority of people to transfer off the Yonge Line at some point to backtrack elsewhere is the entire point of creating alternate options.

Hey, lots of people go lots of places. For sure. Lots get there by coming from the east on packed buses with extremely high frequency. As I keep saying, we really need to revamp the RHC line to serve those people better. That's why the RHC line is so important. The east end. Not York Region.

However, if you are saying that the Yonge Extension in conjunction with an improved/fare-integrated/interconnected (yet again: at Finch LRT, Sheppard subway, Eglinton LRT, and somewhere between there and Union) RHC line will not result in significant alternate options, then I would certainly disagree.

 

[Fresh Start]

Seeing as I said "avarice" in response to Doady's post, I fail to see how I intentionally called you personally greedy. The comment wasn't directed at any one person, just the mindset of misplaced entitlement in general. That you read double-meaning and even brought religion into the discussion over something so miniscule, again is telling of the type of mindset that I have to be contending with here. I did not say other parts of York are denser (although obviously there are), I did say however for less expense REX regional rail can transport York residents from their downtown core to our's in less time with less stall-and-stop en route and at the same time improve the rapid transit connections into NYCC and the subway. All these projects should supercede metros up Yonge St; make the corridor more efficient , viable and user-friendly not just for transit users, but for pedestrians and motorists as well. Even after RHC extension, Yonge would still be a nightmare to use in absence of a surface transit ROW. You can debate subways to a highway turnabout til you're blue in the face for all I care.

Of what relevance that is in a GO Transit-related thread, I have absolutely no idea.