nfitz
Superstar
This remains unfunded. I don't see them building this for a decade. The paint was cheap, probably need to repaint it by then anyhow.
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Eglinton East LRT | Metrolinx
- Thread starter W. K. Lis
- Start date
Amare
Senior Member
Only a decade?
Lol this thing wont be built until at least 2040 at the earliest. Until the day the Waterfront East LRT is built, this project wont be smelling the light of day. It's going to need a brand new MSF and brand new vehicles, both of which will end up costing close to $1 billion alone. Then add the actual construction costs and you get the idea.
nfitz
Superstar
Hey, they could begin in 2035, and open in 2040, and we'd both be right!
But yeah - that's the earliest. Certainly not the latest. Just think - the city and province were looking at doing this LRT first, with a 2015 opening.
Nor I. But it does give a 6-stop solution from Malvern Town Centre to Line 2. And connectivity to UTSC. They've certainly botched the Centennial connection - but that's another story.
Rainforest
Senior Member
I would consider removing the mid-block stops on Sheppard (Shorting, Washburn, Brenyon). Would only keep Markham North, Neilson, Morningside/Sheppard.
The reason is that Sheppard east of Morningside will need bus service anyway, and it cannot be as bad as #97 Yonge because there is no parallel rapid transit east of Morningside. If the #85 bus (from McCowan/Sheppard to Rouge Hill GO) runs every 10 min or so, then it can provide sufficient local service between McCowan and Morningside.
Thus, the northern section of LRT can be repurposed as an express. Just 4 stops from McCowan/Sheppard to Malvern Centre, or 5 stops to UTSC.
For the southern section of EELRT between UTSC and Kennedy, speed is less critical. If someone wants to go all the way, then the fastest option will be the Ellesmere express bus to STC, and then Line 2 to Kennedy; a surface LRT cannot beat that. If someone takes the LRT from somewhere in the middle to Kennedy, or wants to reach one of the GO stations, then the total travel distance is small, and the improvement in travel time will be minimal.
Therefore, all the southern stops can be retained IMO, and they can work to support a higher local density.
The reason is that Sheppard east of Morningside will need bus service anyway, and it cannot be as bad as #97 Yonge because there is no parallel rapid transit east of Morningside. If the #85 bus (from McCowan/Sheppard to Rouge Hill GO) runs every 10 min or so, then it can provide sufficient local service between McCowan and Morningside.
Thus, the northern section of LRT can be repurposed as an express. Just 4 stops from McCowan/Sheppard to Malvern Centre, or 5 stops to UTSC.
For the southern section of EELRT between UTSC and Kennedy, speed is less critical. If someone wants to go all the way, then the fastest option will be the Ellesmere express bus to STC, and then Line 2 to Kennedy; a surface LRT cannot beat that. If someone takes the LRT from somewhere in the middle to Kennedy, or wants to reach one of the GO stations, then the total travel distance is small, and the improvement in travel time will be minimal.
Therefore, all the southern stops can be retained IMO, and they can work to support a higher local density.
sixrings
Senior Member
How is this only at the 10% design stage?!!!!
NIV
New Member
project not funded, 10% design phases is to see if this is feasible and to create discussion. This project competes with the Sheppard East extension. Scarborough needs to decide what is priority, movement within Scarborough or subway connecting it to the rest of city.
ARG1
Senior Member
That map showing the service patterns raises questions. Sure looking at present day bus ridership seems to justify doubling frequencies south of UTSC, but as I've brought up in this thread before, the new projects were building right now are almost certainly going to drastically modify travel patterns within the area. Getting to Line 2 from UTSC for instance will involve people taking the DSBRT west to Scarborough Center and not the Morningside Bus for instance.
Eglinton East LRT: Public Consultation
For Phase Two Public Consultations, Public Drop-In Events were held on May 29, May 30 and June 1, 2024 that included an opportunity to speak with project staff and view display boards. Members of the public can complete a survey before June 30 to provide feedback as part of the Transit and Rail...www.toronto.ca
Now part of me hopes that the TTC is factoring 2030s travel patterns, but maps like that one certainly don't bolster my confidence in how the TTC are planning this.
CapitalSeven
Senior Member
If it's built correctly it should be flexible enough to respond to changes over time as well as different demands during the day and week.
mossynukes
Active Member
ARG1
Senior Member
I'm less worried about how it's built, but rather how the assumptions they make impact the outcome of the studies, and the findings they'll present to the City. If they're using present day ridership statistics ignoring the impact of other lines being built, that will artificially boost the CBR and stated importance of this project, while siphoning funds from other potentially more important projects (WELRT anyone?).
ARG1
Senior Member
Sheppard Subway is being pursued by the province, not the city. Part of this project is operating on the assumption that the Sheppard Subway will be built for the northern leg of the line to connect to (although it's not the end of the world if it doesn't)
Rainforest
Senior Member
Yeah. It looks like the city expects the Sheppard Subway to be built (or at least funded and under construction) first, and prepares EELRT as the next project for Scarborough.
It might work if all stars align right. The Ford's government initiates the Sheppard Subway extension, then the Libs come to power either in 2026 or in 2030, and they fund EELRT.
It might work if all stars align right. The Ford's government initiates the Sheppard Subway extension, then the Libs come to power either in 2026 or in 2030, and they fund EELRT.
Rainforest
Senior Member
They might be thinking about new condos along Eglinton East, and the LRT section of Kingston Road. Those could boost the demand for short-distance LRT trips, replacing the subway-to-UTSC trips.
Although I don't know if they are making any complex assumption, or simply taking today's ridership and multiplying them by some universal growth factor.
TossYourJacket
Senior Member
Council has no input really on the Sheppard subway extension because it's a Metrolinx project and under the agreement made between the City and the Province in 2019, the City has basically no input on Metrolinx's projects. What the City is allowed to work on is projects that are outside of Metrolinx's plans. The Eglinton East LRT is one such project (as are the waterfront LRTs). So this is not a case of council deciding anything, it's the City working on the one of the two projects that they are actually allowed to work on.
Essentially since council cannot have City staff work on anything to do with the Sheppard Extension without MX's permission (which is to say the least, highly unlikely to occur), I don't think it's fair to say they made a choice here when they never really had one. Really these are parallel projects, one from the Province, one from the City. Sheppard is far more likely to go ahead faster due to the Province's greater ability to spend money, but if Council could find the funds for the EELRT, they could theoretically move it ahead, regardless of what is happening with the Sheppard Extension. Unlikely, but theoretically possible.
Aplus23
Active Member
So did they decide to make Morningside & Kingston an underground station or above ground?