The Retail Apocalypse

[afransen]

The final Mississauga retail strategy has not yet been released, I believe. I take your point about the MCC area, but I'm actually hoping to see greater focus on retail along big streets. Streets like Hurontario or Dundas, I think have a number of apartment buildings that are zoned residential, rather than mixed use.

You see a lot of buildings like these:

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I'd like to see some incentives for retail strips in the yards of such apartment buildings.

They should more resemble this:

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Hurontario and Dundas are never going to be streets where you will want to sit on a patio and enjoy a coffee or meal. They are highways. I think better for buildings to turn their backs on the arterials (let them be roads) and have a separate network of streets that are actually pleasant places to be. A 6 lane arterial cannot be a pleasant place.

 

[Sauga89]

Hurontario and Dundas are never going to be streets where you will want to sit on a patio and enjoy a coffee or meal. They are highways.

I was more focusing on the buildings than the patios (though the patios work pretty well on Lakeshore). Once you're inside the door, I'm not sure it matters whether the building is on a busy street or not.

I think better for buildings to turn their backs on the arterials (let them be roads) and have a separate network of streets that are actually pleasant places to be. A 6 lane arterial cannot be a pleasant place.

Technically, once the LRT and BRTs are built, it will be four lanes plus two transit lanes. There are plenty of retail heavy streets in Toronto that are two car lanes each way.

Also, who says it has to be an either or proposition. The city's report says it needs to add 5 million square feet in net terms across the city in the next 25 years. If you curtail retail development along streets with heavy foot traffic, good transit, and good visibility, you may not get all the retail space you need.

The market you need to serve is people who just got off work, hopped off at their local LRT or BRT stop, and want to pick up dinner or do their errands on the walk between their apartment and the LRT/BRT stop. They are not going to give up their cars if they have to go to Square One or Dixie/Dundas for their groceries.

Plus, how does retail make a busy street less pleasant than it already is?

 

[Towered]

How many stores will they even have left now?

It's sad to hear but the writing was on the wall. Once they introduced the HMV section I knew it was not going to end well.

Yeah, that was truly a bizarre move to dedicate significant floor space to...vinyl, CD's, and DVD's...like, did they really think hipsters would shop there??? Completely out of touch. Corporate, suburban style big box retail is anathema to them.

On a related note, TRU was also notorious for shamelessly gouging adult collectors. **** 'em.

 

[gabe]

Yeah, that was truly a bizarre move to dedicate significant floor space to...vinyl, CD's, and DVD's...like, did they really think hipsters would shop there??? Completely out of touch. Corporate, suburban style big box retail is anathema to them.

On a related note, TRU was also notorious for shamelessly gouging adult collectors. **** 'em.

The HMV section was so half assed. The records were just thrown into bins completely unorganized. The store i was in some of the records were stacked on top of each other, the kid who stocked the bins didn't know or care that the records will get damaged that way. Not a smart way to store a product that costs $40 to $60+

 

[afransen]

I was more focusing on the buildings than the patios (though the patios work pretty well on Lakeshore). Once you're inside the door, I'm not sure it matters whether the building is on a busy street or not.

High volume/high speed roads are not pleasant walking environments. They are very loud. You can't easily cross the street. Hurontario you will have to walk long distances to cross and you can't safely jaywalk.

 

[Sauga89]

High volume/high speed roads are not pleasant walking environments. They are very loud. You can't easily cross the street. Hurontario you will have to walk long distances to cross and you can't safely jaywalk.

All true, but you seem to be implying that walking along a busy street is somehow optional. If someone is getting off the LRT or BRT after work, and they have to walk along a busy street to get home, why should the zoning laws forbid building a convenience store or fast food restaurant to serve them? It's not as though a retail outlet would make the walk less pleasant.

 

[afransen]

All true, but you seem to be implying that walking along a busy street is somehow optional. If someone is getting off the LRT or BRT after work, and they have to walk along a busy street to get home, why should the zoning laws forbid building a convenience store or fast food restaurant to serve them? It's not as though a retail outlet would make the walk less pleasant.

It shouldn't be forbidden--but quite often these are the only places where retail can be built, outside of malls.

Do you think Queen West would be as popular if it was 6 lanes and had speeds of 70 kph?