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Mayor Olivia Chow's Toronto

Should be an interesting 3.5 years. Time will tell if it actually manifests into a different agenda, a different direction than the last 8 years.

Some are already speculating it's going to be rife with provincial interference. As cynical as I am, I'm not convinced; Chow and Ford are bound to agree that the City needs to move faster on building more housing, transit and infrastructure.

Ontario Place will likely be the first specific flash point though, a preview of the show to come.
 
What surprised me was how close the race was. A huge percentage of votes are now done thru advanced polling and if Tory would have thrown his support behind Bailou BEFORE advanced polling, Chow may be out of a job.

Now Chow is going to have to have a very hard talk with Torontonians that the days of wanting nice things without willingness to pay for them are over. Toronto must substantially increase it's revenue thru property taxes to at LEAST the provincial average and other streams like parking fees if it is to improve it's public services and crappy public realm. Crying poverty to Mommy {Queen's Park} is aging like milk. Chow, like her late husband, has always been an arrogant industrial sized mouthpiece but now she is going to have to put Toronto's money where her mouth is if the city is to progress and prosper.

Personally, I wouldn't hold my breath.
 
ssiguy2 said:
What surprised me was how close the race was. A huge percentage of votes are now done thru advanced polling and if Tory would have thrown his support behind Bailou BEFORE advanced polling, Chow may be out of a job.

Now Chow is going to have to have a very hard talk with Torontonians that the days of wanting nice things without willingness to pay for them are over. Toronto must substantially increase it's revenue thru property taxes to at LEAST the provincial average and other streams like parking fees if it is to improve it's public services and crappy public realm. Crying poverty to Mommy {Queen's Park} is aging like milk. Chow, like her late husband, has always been an arrogant industrial sized mouthpiece but now she is going to have to put Toronto's money where her mouth is if the city is to progress and prosper.

Personally, I wouldn't hold my breath.
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I predict Mayor Chow’s next 3.5 years to eventually be seen as just.. meh. We’ll see.
 
Metroscapes said:
Ontario Place will likely be the first specific flash point though, a preview of the show to come.
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I expect it will be on the budget. They have to raise taxes about 20% for 2024 just to cover the previous operating losses - which they aren't supposed to have in the first place. Not to mention the another 10% or so for the 2024 budget gap. And that's without improving services.

ssiguy2 said:
Toronto must substantially increase it's revenue thru property taxes to at LEAST the provincial average ...
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I think Toronto under average these days - but the average Toronto municipal property tax is still greater than some other communities; don't forget that many communities include water, sewage, and garbage as part of the property tax bill, while we pay (about $1,200 here) separately.

Also, Toronto SHOULD be less than some places. Look at somewhere that's mostly suburbia. There's more to plow per capita. More road to fix per capita. More driving garbage trucks per capita. More pipes to maintain per capita. Hamilton would be a good comparison - and we are a bit lower - but not substantially. You can see though we did have higher tax rates before John Tory was mayor.

Also don't forget that the average provincial education property tax that Torontonians pay is higher than most other municipalities. Much higher than some. So to do a fair comparison, you have to add the extra services (like water, sewage, and garbage) to various municipal bills, and also make sure you don't include the education portion of the property tax.

Here's a good site to compare the actual average numbers up to 2018. London Ontario you can see has lower property taxes - and also less service charges (mostly because we pay a lot more for transit fares than London). https://www.oncitybooks.ca/revenue/household/20002/39036
 
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nfitz said:
Also, Toronto SHOULD be less than some places. Look at somewhere that's mostly suburbia. There's more to plow per capita. More road to fix per capita. More driving garbage trucks per capita. More pipes to maintain per capita.
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I wouldn't go too far w/that line of thought. Toronto has a lot of RGI housing and vastly more shelter beds and social services than most if not all suburban municipalities.

It has the expense of rapid transit, maintaining 2 major highways, one elevated, and provides sewer and drinking water services to a large part of York Region.

It also has the only reference library, a number of City museums to maintain, a lot more planning applications to process etc etc.

While some costs (per capita) are lower with size, many go the other way.
https://www.oncitybooks.ca/revenue/household/drillto-0/20002/25005
nfitz said:
Also don't forget that the average provincial education property tax that Torontonians pay is higher than most other municipalities. Much higher than some. So to do a fair comparison, you have to add the extra services (like water, sewage, and garbage) to various municipal bills, and also make sure you don't include the education portion of the property tax.
Click to expand...

The education property tax rate is set by the province, the City ought not to be held accountable for how it sets its rates.
 
turini2 said:
Chow's first 100 days, according to CP24
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Chow will be sworn in July 12th, so that's when the action should begin to materialize.

I assume there will be a series of changes to committee chairs, budget chief, and speaker, given where we are in the current cycle, I imagine those changes will take effect in September.
 
Northern Light said:
Chow will be sworn in July 12th, so that's when the action should begin to materialize.

I assume there will be a series of changes to committee chairs, budget chief, and speaker, given where we are in the current cycle, I imagine those changes will take effect in September.
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There is a meeting if the Executive Committee on July 11 and then Council on July 19-21. I assume any Chair and committee membership changes might be dealt with at Council in July with them taking over on August 1. (There are no major committee meetings in August so that would give new Chairs time to find their feet. I think Council has no say over who the Chairs (and thus the Executive) are but does appoint the committee members so the committee membership changes cannot happen without Council approval. July might be too fast but, if not, I could see a special Council in August to deal with these but ....
 
nfitz said:
I expect it will be on the budget. They have to raise taxes about 20% for 2024 just to cover the previous operating losses - which they aren't supposed to have in the first place. Not to mention the another 10% or so for the 2024 budget gap. And that's without improving services.


I think Toronto under average these days - but the average Toronto municipal property tax is still greater than some other communities; don't forget that many communities include water, sewage, and garbage as part of the property tax bill, while we pay (about $1,200 here) separately.

Also, Toronto SHOULD be less than some places. Look at somewhere that's mostly suburbia. There's more to plow per capita. More road to fix per capita. More driving garbage trucks per capita. More pipes to maintain per capita. Hamilton would be a good comparison - and we are a bit lower - but not substantially. You can see though we did have higher tax rates before John Tory was mayor.
Click to expand...

I'd love to see a neighbourhood density-based property tax. You'd pay more out in a suburb full of single-family homes and would more accurately reflect the costs to service lower-density areas.

It might also put a halt on some of the NIMBYism that goes on, as new multi-unit developments nearby would probably lower your property tax.

A lot of the burden of city maintenance is paid for by those who cost the least to maintain. That has to change.
 
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