generalcanada
Senior Member
when we talk about vaughn extensions we should be thinking above ground not below. theres no reason for the density up there. elevated above jane st sounds like a good idea, maybe a turn over to barrie lines' rutherford?
Richmond Hill Yonge Line 1 North Subway Extension | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx
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whydidimakethis
Active Member
And also there's no way boring a tunnel is worth it. Expropriate some low density industrial instead, even elevated could be an option. An LRT along Jane has been something talked about for ages, and something like this could actually work really well for the area if it reached up to Major Mack, as it can provide great local access for the industrial lands without the cost of a full station. I do think though the money for a full subway is better used elsewhere and there are certainly projects with much higher priority. I can see this happening maybe in the late 2030s- 2040s.
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ARG1
Senior Member
For langstaff, just rough in some room for a potential infill station later - similar to what we did with NYC.
Sky High Arch
New Member
its actually faster to drive over to maple station and use the Barrie line
Sky High Arch
New Member
At Major Mackenzie and Yonge around the library there is plans for high density.
The Richmond heights plaza and around it will be high rise ( reason for the no frills moved north). Across the street from the old No frills there is already plans submitted to the city for 6 tower on 1/3 of the empty land on the south .
Yonge and Bernard is another high density that is planed around the bus terminal.
It would be nice to have the subway go to Richmond hill heights 'eventually', this way we have designated bus lanes / LRT right to the subway without going through the narrow down town streets. But today the subway should have had a stop at 16th and Yonge, seeing it was part of the study and it was once explored to have a subway stop.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
A station that serves both the Cortellucci Vaughan Hospital AND Canada's Wonderland, could make use of the vast parking lot at Canada's Wonderland. Since more people could use public transit, they can turn over the parking lot over to the station AND expand the rides at Canada's Wonderland. Maybe something other than another roller coaster.
From link.
Maybe a ride based on the board game "Operation"?
From link.
Sorry, couldn't resist.
From link.
Maybe a ride based on the board game "Operation"?
Sorry, couldn't resist.
toronto647
Active Member
Additional open houses have been added to discuss the EPRA...
Feb 17
Feb 23
Mar 2
Mar 10
No idea why 4 are required but I guess no harm having more time for feedback and dialogue.
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smallspy
Senior Member
And yet pre-COVID, GO managed to fill five 10-car trains down each morning, sending those same trains back north full each afternoon.
Dan
TJ O'Pootertoot
Senior Member
If you had only 3 meetings, you'd only hear the same complaints from the RO residents 3 times. This way, you get to hear them 33% more?
(I mean, really, I'm sure the optics of saying they did a lot of consultation is part of the reason, even though it won't matter to the people who insist that either a) they haven't done enough consultation or b) they did consult, but since they didn't do what residents want, it doesn't count.)
No one is saying the GO line isn't viable. What we're saying is that it serves a limited market, and a different market, relative to the subway. They run relatively few trains on that line, so it's not surprising they're full. And I think we all think there should be more trains on that line. But what irks is when people insist that increasing service there will actually negate the need for the subway, which proceeds from a bunch of false assumptions, including that Union is the only place people want to go, that the physical constraints of the RH line can be easily overcome and just generally that if you live in the 905 you're supposed to use GO and not TTC.
ARG1
Senior Member
Prior to the construction at Davenport, the Barrie Line went from Maple to Union in 30 mins (nowadays its 33-35 mins). The Richmond Hill Line went from Richmond Hill to Union in 45 mins.
It takes 6 mins to drive from Richmond Hill GO to Maple GO by car, and its a 15 minute bus ride. Technically, even if you live east of Richmond Hill GO, if your destination is downtown Toronto, its still faster to just drive all the way to Maple and take the train there. Of course, the biggest asterisk here is that's assuming you can find a parking spot, and don't miss your train trying to park.
Of course, a lot of people still take the Richmond Hill Line and board at Richmond Hill GO, but that really comes down to a few factors, the biggest one being that most people aren't even aware that going to Maple is that much faster because that's not a very obvious conclusion to make. Richmond Hill GO is the closest station so it has to be the fastest right? Furthermore, you could be using the station because you live near it, or the train arrives on time for work anyway so saving time by going to Maple isn't worth the hassle, or YRT provides a direct ride to go bus service to Richmond Hill in your neighbourhood.
The point though is that Maple is by all metrics just a better Richmond Hill GO in every way that's relevant to most passengers.
TJ O'Pootertoot
Senior Member
Indeed, given how central the RH line is - with stops basically all along Yonge Street and Leslie Street - it should be somewhat counter-intuitive that it's slower and has less ridership than the Stouffville or Barrie lines.
Just think of all the density (I mean, relative suburban density) crowded along Yonge, from Steeles to Highway 7. If you live anywhere in that stretch, especially south of Royal Orchard, and you worked downtown, under what circumstances would you actually drive north to Langstaff, park your car and then take the GO train south?
You never would, No one would. No matter how many times David Miller or some other Toronto resident thinks they should.
Not unless you a) happen to have a work schedule that always coincides with the limited train schedule b) work close to Union and don't have to "backtrack" up to, say, near Bloor and c) have the extra time and money to enjoy a peaceful GO ride even though Finch Station offers a far cheaper and more frequent and flexible ride downtown. It's less cozy, to be sure, but it's gonna be "easier" for anyone living south of Highway 7, 9 times out of 10.
Everyone who insists that what this area really needs is RER GO and not a subway fails to miss the most obvious, glaring issue: the competition with TTC - even with the double fare, traffic on Yonge etc - has already awarded the heavy "market share" to local transit. GO basically has a niche market in this area, or the sheer force of geography would have made it one of the system's busiest lines.
Undead
Senior Member
Finch is about the same or slightly more expensive when factoring in the YRT fare (or parking) to get to the station.
But yes, it's slightly ironic RH GO in its current form is being pushed as an alternative to Line 1. This would only entrench GO's downtown focus when we're trying so hard to leave this model behind.
This line is just a bit of an odd duck because of the track ownership and flooding issues. You think the Line 1 extension is expensive, wait till you see the bill for making GO RH a true 2WAD line on par with the subway.
But yes, it's slightly ironic RH GO in its current form is being pushed as an alternative to Line 1. This would only entrench GO's downtown focus when we're trying so hard to leave this model behind.
This line is just a bit of an odd duck because of the track ownership and flooding issues. You think the Line 1 extension is expensive, wait till you see the bill for making GO RH a true 2WAD line on par with the subway.
TJ O'Pootertoot
Senior Member
Yes, but if you never go north of Eglinton and just look at a Google map, those aren't factors requiring consideration.
And it's true that paying a double fare (or parking at Finch, for that matter) can definitely negate cost as a factor but that's the choice people are making. And still, if you're going south, you don't have to travel north up to GO (or, at the other end, north from Union, up to your job at King or Bloor or St. Clair etc.) but the real thing is that if you miss your subway train, there will be another one in about 2 minutes. If you miss the GO train, you're waiting either one hour (if you're lucky) or 24 hours; there's only 3 at rush hour in the morning and 4 coming back right now.
Anyway, it's basically like 90% of the people in the area have chosen to drink Coke and some people keep saying "you guys should drink Pepsi. People who live like you do, you're really Pepsi people."
"No, we're good with Coke."
"OK, but what if we gave you LOTS of Pepsi?"
"Erm, no thanks. More of it won't help, actually., except it will certainly make things better for the people who do drink Pepsi..."
GO is an important option. But as an option, not as the sole north-south transit mode.
Sandpit
Active Member
On the other hand, the 61 bus only runs in one direction, and only on weekdays.
superelevation
Active Member
I think the reasonable question to ask is, how far do other lines go from the city center? In London a lot go fairly far north and west. At the same time, a subway extension in a rail corridor for low cost could have a pretty high cost benefit compared to even the Richmond Hill Line getting limited improvements.