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Ontarians heading east?

Admiral Beez

Admiral Beez

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There’s never been a market like this’: Why so many Ontarians are moving East during the pandemic https://outline.com/XVkyeV​


I know how this goes, we felt the excitement of moving eastward and in 2004 we moved to Fredericton, buying a big house for under $195k. But we also planned to escape if/when we missed the city and wanted to return to TO; so we kept the Toronto house as a rental, knowing that if we sold we‘d never get back into the TO market.

The people in this article sold their house for $1.2m and bought for about half of that. And that sounds great, they’ll likely put the other $600k into retirement saving, maybe pay off a car loan or some debt. But that’s it, you’re irrecoverably committed.


ww
 
One of my now former coworkers is a British immigrant and moved to PEI last year. I think I get it. Many of the reasons why someone would leave the UK for Canada are not reasons to live in a city like Toronto.
 
I've met a number of people in the last few years who wanted to or planned to move "out east", with New Brunswick being very popular. I even know someone in the UK who wants to move there. My response is to lay down the reality of winter. Rural winter out east, you're trapped. Definitely would be cool to live near the coast, but climate-wise BC has it beat.
 
44 North said:
I've met a number of people in the last few years who wanted to or planned to move "out east", with New Brunswick being very popular. I even know someone in the UK who wants to move there. My response is to lay down the reality of winter. Rural winter out east, you're trapped. Definitely would be cool to live near the coast, but climate-wise BC has it beat.
Click to expand...

Not sure what you mean by 'trapped', but it depends on where they are. A buddy moved to the Annapolis Valley NS a few years ago. He's used his snowblower 2-3 times each winter. A lot of the west coast - lower mainland - certainly has the climate if the rain doesn't get you down, but you're not moving there for cost of living relief.
 
Admiral Beez said:

​

There’s never been a market like this’: Why so many Ontarians are moving East during the pandemic https://outline.com/XVkyeV​


I know how this goes, we felt the excitement of moving eastward and in 2004 we moved to Fredericton, buying a big house for under $195k. But we also planned to escape if/when we missed the city and wanted to return to TO; so we kept the Toronto house as a rental, knowing that if we sold we‘d never get back into the TO market.

The people in this article sold their house for $1.2m and bought for about half of that. And that sounds great, they’ll likely put the other $600k into retirement saving, maybe pay off a car loan or some debt. But that’s it, you’re irrecoverably committed.


ww
Click to expand...

Smart move. Getting back into any high cost market from a lower one would be a barrier.
 
wow hard to even imagine prices this low , makes you really hate Toronto/GTA lol..
20210427_012614.png
 
It makes you wonder if some of those houses could even be built today for those prices, or if the land is effectively worth nothing.
 
^ While there a lot of variables (serviced, zoning, location, etc.), a quick scan of Fredericton listing seems to suggest a 'typical vacant lot' goes for in the area of $50-60K. I imagine a vacant residential building lot in Toronto, should one exist, might be a tad more.

Again, a lot of variables, but the Interweb suggests that it costs about $150/sf to build a new house in NB (stock plans), so a 'typical' 2000sf house could be put on a 'typical' lot for about $300K. Of course, per any bubble that is going on down there, and pre the current spike in building material costs.
 
zang said:
Don’t blame the city. Blame people who buy housing strictly to make a profit on the turnover. Blame greed.
Click to expand...
yes I'm pissed at those people as well lol..., but I don't blame them , most people buying investment properties for long term. its also the government faults for making it so hard to build anything in Toronto with all the red tape and development fees taxes etc.. that just gets passed down to buyers at the end and reduces supply.
example Humberwood Heights project they could of starting selling in 2015 , but the approval process dragged on with the city for so long until Oct 2018 when they started selling and its still not built , so 7-8 years to build a townhouse in Toronto lol...

if government really wanted to they could fix this really fast
with stuff like 1) double property tax on investment properties 2)increase capital gains tax on the sale of investment properties by a lot
3)require city to inspect any basement apartments before they can be rented out. trust me I went to some many open houses , how could these people even rent out these basements and have no shame ,

but government will not do anything , because many of them probably own multiple investment properties , so they don't want to see too much supply
 
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zang said:
Don’t blame the city. Blame people who buy housing strictly to make a profit on the turnover. Blame greed.
Click to expand...
If they are making a profit on a quick turnover it means the house was priced too low to begin with. That's not greed, it's stupidity by the seller. But the reality is probably far more complex than that. There's surplus investment money with nowhere else worthwhile to go. Government can cut that back by finding or creating something better for people to spend it on, or by spending it for people and taxing those costs back. No particular political party seems to want to take on that task.
 
44 North said:
I've met a number of people in the last few years who wanted to or planned to move "out east", with New Brunswick being very popular. I even know someone in the UK who wants to move there. My response is to lay down the reality of winter. Rural winter out east, you're trapped. Definitely would be cool to live near the coast, but climate-wise BC has it beat.
Click to expand...
Very true. In Fredericton it would start snowing in November and not stop until May. After we moved in my work shipped me to Israel and then China, so my poor wife was alone in the snow with two infants. You really are in the middle of no where in much of NB. We did however enjoy seaside trips to St. Andrews and St. George, and on my 1969 Triumph motorcycle I loved riding the rural landscape, paper map in hand sorting out where to explore next. That said, had we instead moved to Lunnenberg or Mahone Bay NS we might still be there. Fredericton reminded me more of Timmins, ON than martime,
 
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44 North said:
I've met a number of people in the last few years who wanted to or planned to move "out east", with New Brunswick being very popular. I even know someone in the UK who wants to move there. My response is to lay down the reality of winter. Rural winter out east, you're trapped. Definitely would be cool to live near the coast, but climate-wise BC has it beat.
Click to expand...
Funnily, the wife and I have been talking about retiring in part to the UK. I love old trains and seaside living and north Yorkshire has both and relatively affordable homes and rentals.

www.nymr.co.uk

North Yorkshire Moors Railway - NYMR

Railway Conservation. Run by Volunteers. Not for Profit.
www.nymr.co.uk www.nymr.co.uk

Visit Whitby | Whitby Accommodation, Attractions & Tourist Information

Whitby accommodation, restaurants, attractions, tourist information, news and events. Official website of the Whitby & District Tourism Association
www.visitwhitby.com www.visitwhitby.com

🏖 Whitby | Holidays in Whitby | Places to Stay, Things to Do

Holidays in Whitby are becoming more popular year after year as it’s definitely a town that offers something a little different to your ‘typical’ coastal resort.
www.discoveryorkshirecoast.com

With much of my Canadian family falling off the perch, I’ve been wanting to reconnect with my English side, history and ethnicity. Only challenge is the wife can’t stay indefinitely without resident papers. But we‘re more thinking four months a year or so. If I was staying I’d look at this https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/105651374

But again, we’d not sell our Toronto house. We’re close to the streetcar and medical centres, both important as we age.
 
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Admiral Beez said:
Very true. In Fredericton it would start snowing in November and not stop until May. After we moved in my work shipped me to Israel and then China, so my poor wife was alone in the snow with two infants. You really are in the middle of no where in much of NB. We did however enjoy seaside trips to St. Andrews and St. George, and on my 1969 Triumph motorcycle I loved riding the rural landscape, paper map in hand sorting out where to explore next. That said, had we instead moved to Lunnenberg or Mahone Bay NS we might still be there. Fredericton reminded me more of Timmins, ON than martime,
Click to expand...

There's a reason they jokingly call NB the 'drive-through' province; you drive through it enroute to someplace else. Those first and last snow dates are not uncommon for a lot of this country (first or last snowfalls, not accumulation on the ground) with the exception of southern Ontario and the lower mainland BC. Even in the GTA, the lack of snow is a relatively recent, in climate terms, condition. When I was a kid, things like a 'white Christmas', snow banks deep enough to carve out forts, etc. were simply a given.

I still don't get the "trapped" argument.
 
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