Road Safety & Vision Zero Plan

[W. K. Lis]

Toronto ought to build more pedestrian overpasses, especially around highway ramps.

Trucks are limited to a maximum height of 4.1 metres. Usually, they add some extra clearance. Overpasses would have to be over that height. Underpasses for pedestrians on the other hand should have the clearance of the tallest basketball player. The tallest human on record is at 2.72 metres, so I would use 3 m for underpasses.

 

[BurlOak]

Trucks are limited to a maximum height of 4.1 metres. Usually, they add some extra clearance. Overpasses would have to be over that height. Underpasses for pedestrians on the other hand should have the clearance of the tallest basketball player. The tallest human on record is at 2.72 metres, so I would use 3 m for underpasses.

I believe Trucks can pay a nominal fee and go up to 14' (4.27m). Because of vehicle bounce, usually 150mm is added. in order that the road can be resurfaced twice, they add another 100mm. That bring would to 4.5m Many of the old bridges were 15' (4.57m clearance). Now, the required clearance is 4.8m for solid bridges (i.e. bridge not damaged if hit by truck), 5.0m for typical girder bridges (which will sustain some damage, but not come down if hit), and 5.3m for pedestrian bridges that are light enough that they would come down if hit.

For pedestrian (and bike) clearances, 2.7m is the requirement, but I agree if we want to attract top NBA free agents it should go up to 3.0m. It also avoids the claustrophobic feeling. If you want emergency vehicles to be able to go through, you might go up to 3.6m. Similar height is needed for a horse trail - which we only need to worry about if Toronto hosts a Grey Cup and the Stampeeders make it.

 

[vic]

On a seperate note.... There are four crosswalk signals that were placed at warden & hydro trail. Remember, this is a crosswalk signal for a 3 metre gap. there are crosswalks that cross arterial roads without signals sometimes. View attachment 191607

Your post reminds me of this spot on Dundas St. just east of Islington where there are beg-buttons installed for crossing two driveways. Probably because it's in the middle of a T-intersection...but still... that's hilarious / bizarre.
Google Map location: https://goo.gl/maps/RAV6UttWqDyM5LWCA

 

[innsertnamehere]

View attachment 192618

Your post reminds me of this spot on Dundas St. just east of Islington where there are beg-buttons installed for crossing two driveways. Probably because it's in the middle of a T-intersection...but still... that's hilarious / bizarre.
Google Map location: https://goo.gl/maps/RAV6UttWqDyM5LWCA

My personal favourite is King and Sudbury. It's a more standard driveway access on the south side of the intersection with pedestrian crossing signals.. to a driveway that has been blocked over with jersey barriers for at least the last 5+ years. The small parking lot it accesses has another entrance and people used to use the lot as a cut through to Sudbury south of King (it does a little jog on King St.), so the landowner blocked off this entrance. Features a "Pedestrians obey your signals" sign to boot. Quite possibly the single most ignored piece of road signage in the city - and that is saying something.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Toronto drivers - exhibit 1 - from CBC:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/car-into-house-mississauga-1.5205953

Makes you wonder how these folks get their license - much less keep them.

AoD

 

[W. K. Lis]

Toronto is far, far, far behind other cities around the world.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Watch as 100s of Kids & Parents Bicycle to one Amsterdam School

From link.

In the United States (and Canada)— even in car-minority New York City — our children’s lives are entirely framed by the automobile.

And most often, their deaths are framed by them, too.

In the U.S., of course, motor vehicle crashes are the leading cause of death of children up to age 19. Yet all too often, parents say they drive their children around — to school, on errands, to recreation — to keep them safe.

Reminder: if the roads aren’t safe for our kids, it’s because of the drivers, not the roads.

The roads aren’t going away any time soon, so clearly we need to use them better, so parents can feel safe letting their kids walk or bike to school — which is where Streetfilms comes in.

Yes, we sent the Orson Welles of the streets, Clarence Eckerson Jr., to Amsterdam for yet another primer on how basic, short-haul transportation is handled in countries that care about their children’s lives.

Take a moment to watch — and picture how it could be here, if we had proper leadership and the political will to put cars back in their place: away from our kids.

 

[Admiral Beez]

One of the biggest issues I see as a pedestrian, cyclist, motorcyclists and car driver is the lack of discipline at intersections. Pedestrians ignore the red flashing and countdown signals, ignoring the rules that they are not to enter the road space during this time. Cyclists ignore almost every stop sign on residential streets, treating them as yield signs, at best. Automobile users trying to turn right at the correct time, when the pedestrian signal is red are blocked by people walking into the road space. Then there are the pedestrians who walk out mid block when then are a short walk to a legal crossing. I'm all for putting signaled crossings and breaking up the mega blocks.

And can we please stop it with the dead-end separated bicycle lanes? Separated bicycle lanes should be like train tracks or roads, they never stop, instead they're linked together. Meaning that you don't just drop two kilometers of separated track here or there, and then have no lane at either end.

IMO, the best fix is what they use in Manhattan, cops. In Manhattan they use traffic cops to manage the flow. And it works, very well in my experience driving and walking there. The police stop the pedestrian from entering the road space during the automobile cycle, and vice versa. If Toronto can have parking enforcement officers, we can have traffic enforcement officers. No need for expensive TPS regular constables.

Can we stop looking at small northern European cities as the model for Toronto? I've cycled in Amsterdam, but unless we want to tear up and reconfigure all the roads, it's not realistic. Find me a city of >3 million residents where >1/2 million suburban SFH-dwelling non-residents commute into each day (mostly by car), with our climate that we should model ourselves after. Chicago has a similar climate, commuting culture and population, what are they doing right?

 

[ADRM]

Pedestrians ignore the red flashing and countdown signals, ignoring the rules that they are not to enter the road space during this time.

I hate when people focus on this; the Transportation Department has not timed the signals to be aligned with that perspective, so it's essentially irrelevant.

And it makes total sense that cyclists yield at stop signs -- the HTA is designed for motorists and doesn't apply well to cyclists in many ways, which is exactly why the notional direction for TPS officers is to ignore enforcement of this.

I lived in Manhattan for years and can tell you for certain that they have not cracked the traffic nut. It's kind of crazy that some people in the GTHA have tricked themselves into believing that traffic is as bad here as it is in Manhattan or LA, to pick two.

Couldn't agree more on the pig-headedness of the dead-ending of the cycle tracks (and the inexplicable proliferation of unprotected bike lanes, too).

 

[nfitz]

I lived in Manhattan for years and can tell you for certain that they have not cracked the traffic nut. It's kind of crazy that some people in the GTHA have tricked themselves into believing that traffic is as bad here as it is in Manhattan or LA, to pick two.

LA? I haven't found LA hard to drive - I felt it was a bit easier than Toronto. Sure, you get big traffic jams on expressways, similar to Toronto - but I found less congestion and an easier drive off the expressway. Anecdotally, I've found Toronto traffic the second-worst I've seen in Canada/USA.

 

[W. K. Lis]

One of the biggest issues I see as a pedestrian, cyclist, motorcyclists and car driver is the lack of discipline at intersections. Pedestrians ignore the red flashing and countdown signals, ignoring the rules that they are not to enter the road space during this time. Cyclists ignore almost every stop sign on residential streets, treating them as yield signs, at best. Automobile users trying to turn right at the correct time, when the pedestrian signal is red are blocked by people walking into the road space. Then there are the pedestrians who walk out mid block when then are a short walk to a legal crossing. I'm all for putting signaled crossings and breaking up the mega blocks.
...

Once the automobile took over the streets for themselves, the laws were changed or created to benefit the motorist and not the pedestrian.

A good bad example are the pedestrian traffic signals. Used to be no pedestrian signals. People crossed on the green.

From link.

The pedestrian signals were added as a "safety" measure. Then came the countdown timers, which legally speaking, cut down the time pedestrians had to cross the street. All for the benefit of the motorists.

 

[Admiral Beez]

And it makes total sense that cyclists yield at stop signs -- the HTA is designed for motorists and doesn't apply well to cyclists in many ways, which is exactly why the notional direction for TPS officers is to ignore enforcement of this.

I'd like to see two rules changed for cyclists. First, all residential one way streets are exempt for bikes, and no special painted lanes required. Simply add "bicycle exempt" on every feasible one way street. In live in Cabbagetown, and to cycle to my house I have to ride up two blocks just to come back down to my house. The few times I do ignore the rules and cycle against the one way street I've been told off by auto users, I suppose because I look friendly enough, since others I see going the wrong way look scary enough to me and might just punch you in the nose. The delay here is we seem to need new painted lanes or clearance from parked cars, but forget that, just make it legal and the users of the space will figure it out.

Second, yes, make all stop signs yield signs for cyclists. Make that the law, so that automobile users know it. I hate stopping at stop signs on my bicycle, but I always do it, since it's the law. Same as on my motorcycle or in my car. I can't simply choose to ignore the the laws I don't like. Instead I'd like to see those laws changed.

I hate when people focus on this; the Transportation Department has not timed the signals to be aligned with that perspective, so it's essentially irrelevant.

It's not. It's the law. You're not to enter the crossing when it's red, you can still be in the crossing until it counts down. Assuming we want crossing signals, what's the alternative, make it white until the traffic light turns red, without warning?

Unless the cars are jumping the sidewalk, pedestrians are being hit when they enter the road space. If we treated that road space like we do train tracks or other dangerous crossing, we might put down our phones, keep an eye out and attend to our safety. The road space, like the sidewalk space, is not shared space. We say we want it to be shared space, but really the safest roads for pedestrians aren't roads at all, in the sense that the cars are entirely removed or heavily curtailed from the space.

 

[PinkLucy]

One of the biggest issues I see as a pedestrian, cyclist, motorcyclists and car driver is the lack of discipline at intersections. Pedestrians ignore the red flashing and countdown signals, ignoring the rules that they are not to enter the road space during this time. Cyclists ignore almost every stop sign on residential streets, treating them as yield signs, at best. Automobile users trying to turn right at the correct time, when the pedestrian signal is red are blocked by people walking into the road space.

I'm downtown these days as much as I used to be, but when I went to the Lion King the other day, there were police at pretty much every intersection between Union Station and the Princess of Wales guiding right-turning cars and stopping pedestrians from crossing when they shouldn't.

 

[Leo_Chan]

And can we please stop it with the dead-end separated bicycle lanes? Separated bicycle lanes should be like train tracks or roads, they never stop, instead they're linked together. Meaning that you don't just drop two kilometers of separated track here or there, and then have no lane at either end.

Does this also apply to cycle tracks that merge with sidewalks at intersections?

Leslie St and Greenhill Ave in Richmond Hill:

 

[robmausser]

Once the automobile took over the streets for themselves, the laws were changed or created to benefit the motorist and not the pedestrian.

A good bad example are the pedestrian traffic signals. Used to be no pedestrian signals. People crossed on the green.

From link.

The pedestrian signals were added as a "safety" measure. Then came the countdown timers, which legally speaking, cut down the time pedestrians had to cross the street. All for the benefit of the motorists.

Thats slowly changing though. You have the scramble intersections at yonge/dundas etc, and im noticing intersections where all the lights for cars stay red for 5 seconds+ after the pedestrian signal changes.