Danforth Line 2 Scarborough Subway Extension

[TheTigerMaster]

I eagerly look forward to the continuation of this incessant debate once Staff confirm the 1-stop subway costs more than the $3.56 Billion allocated to the original 3-stop subway.

 

[cplchanb]

Why then did they waste the whole morning in council still debating the merits of the Scar. subway plan? Shouldnt they have been having people testifying on funding models?

 

[smallspy]

one of the councillors just asked: "cant we just flip a switch and go back to LRT?"

Byford: "(gives technical reasonings why its not possible)"

In reality in Byfords head: "You are f_cking dumb, lady"

Facepalm of some of these councillors who live on dreamland. Leave it to the experts!

Except that isn't true, either. The EA has long been complete for the LRT. It hasn't even been started for the subway.

My take on this morning session so far...

• Scarborough Centre is the only city centre not connected by subway.

York and Etobicoke Centres are on the phone - they are wondering where their subways are.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.

 

[cplchanb]

so Byford just stated that the price difference for LRT vs subway now including inflation and SRT shutdown is only a few hundred million....

 

[LNahid2000]

so Byford just stated that the price difference for LRT vs subway now including inflation and SRT shutdown is only a few hundred million....

I'm still finding that very hard to believe. How are other cities able to build LRT for so much cheaper? It's like someone skewed the numbers to favour the subway.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Why then did they waste the whole morning in council still debating the merits of the Scar. subway plan? Shouldnt they have been having people testifying on funding models?

Well before we can talk funding, we need to know how much this'll cost, which is why there was testimony on the cost of this $2 Billion $2.9 Billion $3.2 Billion $3.4 Billion $3.6 Billion, 1-stop subway extension.

More details on funding will be forthcoming later this year, in City Finance presentations.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

I'm still finding that very hard to believe. How are other cities able to build LRT for so much cheaper? It's like someone skewed the numbers to favour the subway.

Big part of the price increase is due to inflation. Original LRT costs were estimated in $2010, while this is now estimated somewhere around $2025. The province's LRT funding commitment would be adjusted for inflation as well, so the budget shortfall for the LRT should still be well below that of the subway.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Big part of the price increase is due to inflation. Original LRT costs were estimated in $2010, while this is now estimated somewhere around $2025. The province's LRT funding commitment would be adjusted for inflation as well, so the budget shortfall for the LRT should still be well below that of the subway.

The price of the LRT should now be somewhere around $2.7 Billion (actually, it's less than that, given new info today), while the subway is in the $3.5 Billion to $4.5 Billion range. $3.5 Billion is no cost escalations due to detailed design, $4.5 Billion is the worst anticipated scenario for cost escalations.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

TTC has confirmed that, despite what Lying Tory has said, the LRT maintenance costs would have been covered by the Province, as per the Master Agreement.

 

[salsa]

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Just in, TTC has confirmed that there is nothing preventing the LRT construction from starting at Sheppard while work at Kennedy for Eglinton Line is complete. The construction timelines for the LRT have been overestimated, meaning that it could started be completed years sooner. The new timelines also means that the cost of the $2.7 Billion LRT would have been overstated by hundreds of millions of dollars.

 

[salsa]

Why must John Tory lie so much?

Because just like with the Gardiner debate, when the facts do not align with his misguided agenda, lying and casting his opponents as the real villains is the only card he knows how to play.

 

[cplchanb]

Someone brought up the merits of Elevated!!

 

[sixrings]

Finch subway too?

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Just in, TTC has confirmed that there is nothing preventing the LRT construction from starting at Sheppard while work at Kennedy for Eglinton Line is complete. The construction timelines for the LRT have been overestimated, meaning that it could started be completed years sooner. The new timelines also means that the cost of the $2.7 Billion LRT would have been overstated by hundreds of millions of dollars.

Bizarrely, Byford has admitted the TTC arbitrarily decided that the LRT and subway would have the same construction completion dates. He also says that the LRT timeline is not realistic.

This is terribly misleading, as the construction timeline has significant impacts on project costs. So the $2.7 Billion LRT price estimate is NOT accurate and has likely been overstated by hundreds of millions.