Visiting Toronto .. must see locations?

[jn_12]

I spent an entire summer doing nothing but talk to tourists. Literally. It was my job. I have a pretty strong grasp of what tourists enjoy when they come to this city and what makes them utterly disappointed. The PATH is one of those things that utterly disappoints. Sorry, but who travels to a city to watch people search for deodorant and a good book for the Go Train ride home? Not only do people not want to do this, the ones that do get suckered into going down there say that they wasted their time.

Here's a newsflash for you as well... Office workers in Toronto behave in much the same way as any other North American city. You can go ahead and care about some minute nuance such as whether they drink Starbucks or an alternative, but that's your prerogative. It certainly isn't what the vast majority of people want to do.



UrbanDreamer: I can't believe you said to avoid Queen St from Yonge to Spadina. If you really want them to avoid shopping then that's one thing, but both City Halls in found in between these streets. Don't you think people might want to see them?

 

[urbandreamer]

Well, considering I can't stand NCH and the cheesy retail strip from U-ave to Spadina (except groovy for tiger brand shoes) and have little interest in teenagers from Scarborough or Mississauga, then maybe you'll understand my boycott of the area.

 

[Desolate]

By the way, some Toronto/Philly analogies:

Kensington Market = Italian Market (but more West Indian/hipster)
Queen Street West = South Street (but longer)
Ossington and Queen = Northern Liberties
Bloor/Yorkville = Rittenhouse Square

Thanks.

Very Helpful.

 

[Desolate]

Thanks everyone.

This was exactly what I was hoping for.


For the record Philadelphia has a smaller version of PATH so that would be interesting to me.

It's small but it does something very similar. Looking forward to just seeing how extensive it is. I'm a bit of a transit nerd.


I do really appreciate it.

I'm coming next week for 4 days starting Thursday so I can wander during work hours.


Weather isn't an issue. Philly's just as cold. Philly also has it's rough spots but I'm not small or scared and know what to look for.


I have an excellent sense of direction and live blocks from a restored PCC streetcar line so I will check out yours.

Any recommendations for using the local transit?

Should I stick to cabs?

 

[Desolate]

Two specific requests if I may.


A great bar near the hotel.

A great steak restaurant near the hotel.

A good nightclub (if possible) for the 25+ crowd.



and how far are the casinos. Not for me but the people I'm meeting are well.. poker guys.

 

[syn]

^Definitely use the TTC. It's pretty convenient.

You could pickup a couple of day passes for about $18 total (I think they're $9.00 each).

 

[Tewder]

I'd recommend

Avoid: Yonge St, east to Parliament, Queen St West from Yonge to Spadina, the office district and anything north of Eglinton

Urbandreamer: I thought about Kensington Market and the Beach too but at this time of year I think there are probably better options.

Also, I think Queen Street should be appreciated in its entirety (so maybe including the Beach too if time permits) which includes the less trendy and more commercialized areas, and which absolutely should include Nathan Phillips Square (old and new city halls), Osgoode Hall, and the Four Seasons Centre etc.

 

[Tewder]

Two specific requests if I may.


A great bar near the hotel.

A great steak restaurant near the hotel.

A good nightclub (if possible) for the 25+ crowd.



and how far are the casinos. Not for me but the people I'm meeting are well.. poker guys.

Not sure what kind of music or scene you like but the Reservoir Lounge on Wellington East is nice for live music with a retro jazz/swing vibe. It's crowded and fun with mixed ages and little attitude, and people will even cut a rug there when the place gets going. Best bet is to cab it from your hotel though, or Yonge line to King and about a 5 minute walk from there just google it or look for the 'flat iron' building and you will find it opposite in the street north of it.

Barbarians steak house is probably walking distance from your hotel. It is 'old school' style and has been around since the 40s or 50s so there's some pedigree to it.

just a couple of ideas, but again knowing a bit more about your taste would help.

 

[CDL.TO]

It's small but it does something very similar. Looking forward to just seeing how extensive it is. I'm a bit of a transit nerd.

Any recommendations for using the local transit?

Should I stick to cabs?

Transit nerd? You're in good company on this forum! Have any particular interests?

First thing, the TTC is usually convenient and is completely safe.

For subways, my suggested tour would be to do this:
- Ride the Yonge (yellow line) from downtown north, and grab a window seat. The line has a couple open-air sections, and you can see the Davisville subway yard on the west side of the line around Davisville station.
- Get off at Sheppard station, and transfer to the Sheppard line (purple line, opened in 2002). Check out the tile art on the Sheppard line platforms at Sheppard station. Consider getting off at Bayview to check out the visual illusions.
- Ride to the end of the line at Don Mills and catch the 190 Scarborough Centre Rocket bus, which will take you straight to Scarborough Centre station on the SRT (blue line) in 15-20 minutes.
- Ride the SRT south/towards Kennedy. The line was very high-tech when it opened in 1985. The whole line is open-air, but there isn't much to see.
- Transfer to the Bloor-Danforth subway (green line) at Kennedy. You can ride back downtown all the way on the subway. But I would suggest either getting off at Main Street station and get on a 506 Streetcar that will take you back to Yonge and Carlton (by your hotel) through Little India and other neighbourhoods, or getting off at Broadview and getting on either a 504 King or 505 Dundas streetcar, either of which will take you downtown.
- This trip can all be done on one fare.

Other things worth checking out on the subway system are:
- Downsview station.
- The rest of the Spadina line (yellow line, Spadina-Downsview), which is about half open-air and features some nice stations (some of which, however, aren't in the greatest state of repair).
- Museum station.
- The Bloor-Danforth line between Castle Frank and Broadview stations runs along the lower deck of the Bloor Viaduct, offering impressive views of the Don valley below.

Streetcars are also a great way to check out the city.
- Here's a map of the streetcar lines.
- Here's the Wikipedia article.
- The 503 and 508 are rush-hour only, the 502 is infrequent and unreliable, and the 512 is closed for reconstruction west of St. Clair West station. Other than that, you're safe.
- Lines are frequent (each scheduled every 5-8 mins or so during the day), but traffic and poor management means that you can find yourself waiting for longer than that.
- Consider checking out the underground streetcar-subway transfers at Spadina, Union, and St. Clair West stations.
- 510 Spadina, 509 Harbourfront, and 512 St. Clair (Between St. Clair and St. Clair West stations) run in their own lanes in the middle of their respective streets.
- The 501 and 506 give you a nice tour of different neighbourhoods.

Anyway, that's enough from me. Please post any questions you may have!

 

[CDL.TO]

I spent an entire summer doing nothing but talk to tourists. Literally. It was my job. I have a pretty strong grasp of what tourists enjoy when they come to this city and what makes them utterly disappointed.

You did this as a job? I've been long wondering about actual tourist impressions of the city. Would you be willing to write a descriptive post (you could start a new thread) about people's impressions, your impressions, people's comments, and conclusions of the study? Where did people actually go, what did they find actually worthwhile, what was a waste, what did they think of the city? I know I would find it immensely interesting, and I know others would as well.

I'll even buy you a beer at the next forum meet.

 

[jn_12]

I'm actually going to be doing a presentation in class about this in the next few weeks. It'll also include what I learned from working on Tourism's "frontlines" in Niagara Falls, what I learned from working with the Ministry of Tourism's Policy Unit, and the minimal stuff I've learned working for Porter. When I get around to typing things up I'll definitely share that with you guys.

It was both a hard and great experience doing that research for the City. It basically involved me just approaching people after they used the InfoToGo vehicle for information. That can be tough if you're shy or worried about bugging people, and they're always skeptical. I also would help out in the InfoToGo vehicle, which was much more about answering tourists' questions about the city. So I learned a lot about tourism doing both.

But ya I'll try and put something comprehensive up in the near future.

 

[Long Island Mike]

Visiting Toronto-Using the TTC and Philadelphia Concourse info...

Desolate: Check the TTC fares-depending on the time and length of your visit a Weekly Pass or Day Pass would definitely be the way to go with the TTC. CDL: Good TTC trip ideas-I'd use that posted info myself on a future visit!

Urbandreamer: Those areas you posted to avoid interest me much-do you actually mean AFTER DARK as I suspect? I would be much surprised to see some of those areas listed UNSAFE IN DAYTIME-care to comment?

I have spent much time in Philadelphia-I have been a visitor on a regular basis there for more then 30 years and I lived in the area between 1993-2000.

I wanted to comment on the posted map of the Center City Concourses-how old is it? There are parts that are now closed off-like the part under North Broad Street from City Hall N to the Race-Vine Broad Street Subway station.

The only area with substantial retail shops to be comparable with the Toronto PATH system is the area NW of City Hall going towards SEPTA's Suburban Station.

Other parts of the CC Concourse-like the wide-open South Broad concourse to the BSL's Walnut-Locust Station and the two PATCO legs under Locust Street have minimal retail areas-mostly just access to places up above. The concourses under Market Street from the BSL past 13th and 11th Street Stations are basically again just access to places up above-like Gallery West and the Market East Station on the 11th street N side or 1234 Market-SEPTA HQ and Wanamaker's/Macy's at 13th Street S.

Which part of Philadelphia do you live in? I am a regular visitor to the Fox Chase area these days. Is that streetcar you mean part of SEPTA Route 15 or 23(in Chestnut Hill)?

Post me back and by all means ENJOY TORONTO-I feel you will really like it!
Long Island Mike

 

[CDL.TO]

Urbandreamer: Those areas you posted to avoid interest me much-do you actually mean AFTER DARK as I suspect? I would be much surprised to see some of those areas listed UNSAFE IN DAYTIME-care to comment?

It's not like that. It's based on other reasons than safety. Based upon urbandreamer's posts, I would say that he says this because:

- "Queen Street from Yonge to Spadina" is corporate. Between University and Spadina is basically an outdoor shopping mall where suburbanites come and go shopping. Like a New Yorker avoiding Times Square.
- "the office district". Corporate, nothing but office buildings. Like a New Yorker having no reason to go downtown unless he works there.
- "anything north of Eglinton". Suburban. Like Long Island.
- "Yonge St, east to Parliament". Okay, a little sketchy in places, particularly at night. However, this location also includes St. Lawrence, a fantastic neighborhood any time of day or night.

Frankly, I don't think it's very good advice and you would probably be best to ignore it.

 

[adma]

I spent an entire summer doing nothing but talk to tourists. Literally. It was my job. I have a pretty strong grasp of what tourists enjoy when they come to this city and what makes them utterly disappointed. The PATH is one of those things that utterly disappoints. Sorry, but who travels to a city to watch people search for deodorant and a good book for the Go Train ride home? Not only do people not want to do this, the ones that do get suckered into going down there say that they wasted their time.

Here's a newsflash for you as well... Office workers in Toronto behave in much the same way as any other North American city. You can go ahead and care about some minute nuance such as whether they drink Starbucks or an alternative, but that's your prerogative. It certainly isn't what the vast majority of people want to do.

If you want to know what kinds of people...well, the sorts of people who'd be posting to UT and who have an affinity for the kinds of issues that UT deals with. Just like, I'd assume, Desolate (and his "For the record Philadelphia has a smaller version of PATH so that would be interesting to me" quote indicates as much).

You have to remember. "The vast majority of people" that you dealt with in the name of tourism are not those sorts of people. They'd glaze their eyes at concepts like "civic tourism" or "psychogeography" or "urban exploration" or whatever. And conversely, those who are those sorts of people also happen to be the sort who'd find visiting the local tourist bureau to the kind of utter disappointment and waste of time that you attribute to PATH--except as a backup tokenism, they've bypassed the Tourism Toronto realm entirely.

However, I do agree on an underlying point--maybe less about PATH, than the well-meaning tourist marketing thereof like it was some kind of CN Tower-type potboiler attraction or something.

And to return to

Sorry, but who travels to a city to watch people search for deodorant and a good book for the Go Train ride home?

Well, not that I'd travel specifically *for* it, but I'd get a certain incidental Baudelairian Philadelphia pleasure from watching people search for deodorant and a good book for the SEPTA ride home.

And if you wouldn't, that's your problem.

And I so hope that in the process of LED-ing and juicing-up the PECO Building, they don't trash the old scrolling lettering style holus bolus...

 

[JasonParis]

A neighbourhood that hasn't been mentioned, however will be the one you will be staying on the fringe of, is the Church & Wellesley gaybourhood. Regardless of your persuasion, it's well worth a visit...and perhaps more.