TTC: Streetcar Network

[DSC]

Yeah, their plan doesn’t even include the new Don River.

Well, they have used an aerial photo as background so that cannot show what is not there (yet). The actual precinct boundaries are there and they leave 'spaces' for the new river mouth.

 

[Yoshimura]

Streetcars clogged Queen St during the winter storm a few days ago.
I was rolling at 2km/hour.

The new streetcars are one of the biggest robberies in Ontario history.

Just had to vent that.

 

[nfitz]

Streetcars clogged Queen St during the winter storm a few days ago.
I was rolling at 2km/hour.

The new streetcars are one of the biggest robberies in Ontario history.

How? Surely the new pantographs on the new streetcars will reduce the problem that occurs every 2-3 years when there's a good ice storm.

Ice storms and streetcars have been an issue since Toronto replaced the horses with electric wires in the 1890s. How is this related to the new streetcars, which are finally providing a technological improvement to the issue, after over over 120 years of trolley poles?

 

[thettctransitfanatic]

How? Surely the new pantographs on the new streetcars will reduce the problem that occurs every 2-3 years when there's a good ice storm.

Ice storms and streetcars have been an issue since Toronto replaced the horses with electric wires in the 1890s. How is this related to the new streetcars, which are finally providing a technological improvement to the issue, after over over 120 years of trolley poles?

It's quite ironic that we have been using trolley poles for that long. In that time, new countries were created, new technology, and lots of time has passed.

 

[Jonny5]

Streetcars clogged Queen St during the winter storm a few days ago.
I was rolling at 2km/hour.

The new streetcars are one of the biggest robberies in Ontario history.

Just had to vent that.

I was rolling down Queen East of Yonge about that speed today, but it was because of an endless parade of delivery trucks puling in and out, paralell parking cars that needed three attempts to do it, left turning cars, taxis/Ubers picking up and dropping people off, cars blocking intersections (notably at Jarvis). It's a mess every day from Yonge to Jarvis.

 

[thettctransitfanatic]

I was rolling down Queen East of Yonge about that speed today, but it was because of an endless parade of delivery trucks puling in and out, paralell parking cars that needed three attempts to do it, left turning cars, taxis/Ubers picking up and dropping people off, cars blocking intersections (notably at Jarvis). It's a mess every day from Yonge to Jarvis.

Maybe we need a Queen Pilot Project? But, the business owners will be SO triggered by it.

 

[Rainforest]

I was rolling down Queen East of Yonge about that speed today, but it was because of an endless parade of delivery trucks puling in and out, paralell parking cars that needed three attempts to do it, left turning cars, taxis/Ubers picking up and dropping people off, cars blocking intersections (notably at Jarvis). It's a mess every day from Yonge to Jarvis.

Yeah. Streetcars aren't the cause of the downtown streets being so slow; the sheer volume of general traffic is. Arterials that have no streetcars are clogged just as much.

 

[amnesiajune]

This map design will likely what we shift to as theres no chance of fitting Eglinton and Finch over the doors.

I think it's less about fitting the new lines above the doors, and more about deciding what gets included and what doesn't. That was an easy decision when the system was fully grade-separated, but it's a lot harder when surface LRT and part-underground/part-surface LRT gets added to the system..

I feel like we're going to go through a few iterations of the new system map. If local streetcar routes (including the 502 & 503 that don't run most of the time) and the airport express bus are being included on the map, why are other express buses being left off? My guess is that by the time the Eglinton LRT is open, it'll be the 504, 509, 510, 512 and the all-day/every-day express bus routes.

Maybe it might make those north of St Clair demand streetcars.

More likely: This will come across as yet another signal to people in the poorer, immigrant-majority parts of the city that they don't matter and they're not "really" a part of Toronto (except when the city's wealthier residents want to parade our diverse population to the rest of the world).

 

[Rainforest]

I think it's less about fitting the new lines above the doors, and more about deciding what gets included and what doesn't. That was an easy decision when the system was fully grade-separated, but it's a lot harder when surface LRT and part-underground/part-surface LRT gets added to the system..

I feel like we're going to go through a few iterations of the new system map. If local streetcar routes (including the 502 & 503 that don't run most of the time) and the airport express bus are being included on the map, why are other express buses being left off? My guess is that by the time the Eglinton LRT is open, it'll be the 504, 509, 510, 512 and the all-day/every-day express bus routes.

Yes. IMO, the system map should maintain a consistent level of details across the service area.

At the crudest level, it should have subways, plus new light rail lines, plus those legacy streetcar lines that run in a R.O.W. (Spadina, WW West, St Clair).

At the medium level, it could be subways, plus all LRT and streetcar lines, plus the major bus routes (expresses and the 10-minutes network).

It really doesn't make sense to show all streetcar routes, but leave a Great Void north of St Clair.

 

[amnesiajune]

At the crudest level, it should have subways, plus new light rail lines, plus those legacy streetcar lines that run in a R.O.W. (Spadina, WW West, St Clair).

At the medium level, it could be subways, plus all LRT and streetcar lines, plus the major bus routes (expresses and the 10-minutes network).

I think the problem is having a map that's too crowded (and streetcars do overcrowd the map when all of them are included). At some point there needs to be a "is this rapid transit?" filter, and I think just the grade-separated streetcars and all-day express buses pass that test, especially express buses that link different parts of the subway to each other (for example the 925, 939, 941, 984 and 985 buses)

 

[W. K. Lis]

I think the problem is having a map that's too crowded (and streetcars do overcrowd the map when all of them are included). At some point there needs to be a "is this rapid transit?" filter, and I think just the grade-separated streetcars and all-day express buses pass that test, especially express buses that link different parts of the subway to each other (for example the 925, 939, 941, 984 and 985 buses)

There are no express buses along the underground construction of Eglinton Crosstown LRT (Weston to Kennedy), because of the many single-lanes and obstructions. The 905 Eglinton East Express terminates at Kennedy Station, for example, and goes no further west.

From link.

 

[lead82]

The 905 express route would be a perfect LRT line but it curious why the stops are a good distance apart when compared with the LRT plan for Eglinton-Malvern LRT, which has twice as many stops as necessary.

 

[W. K. Lis]

The 905 express route would be a perfect LRT line but it curious why the stops are a good distance apart when compared with the LRT plan for Eglinton-Malvern LRT, which has twice as many stops as necessary.

See the Eglinton East LRT at link, and the thread at link.

 

[smallspy]

The 905 express route would be a perfect LRT line but it curious why the stops are a good distance apart when compared with the LRT plan for Eglinton-Malvern LRT, which has twice as many stops as necessary.

Because the LRT would replace most of the surface buses, whereas the express is an overlay that runs alongside those existing buses.

Dan

 

[lead82]

Yes that is true but the LRT is sold as rapid transit. The problem is that with too many stops it won’t be. It needs to be. Toronto already does great at slow local transit. What we lack is rapid transit to get people across large distances fast.