TTC: Jane (LRT) RapidTO

[W. K. Lis]

Black Creek and Jane St do not meet do they? I have taken Black Creek from Lawrence south to Eglinton a few times. Where does it meet Jane St? It meets Tretheway (an ugly street if there ever was an ugly street). Ok, just checked google and saw it does hit Jane once Black Creek turns into the 400. But then for people who want to continue to go south on Jane to Bloor what happens there?

And I guess cars would only have 1 lane. Boy I can see the uproar or should I say hear it

Black Creek Drive changes its name, twice, before ending at Jane Street.

First as Humber Blvd. (where they get complaints about basement floodings) and then as Alliance Avenue.

Most do turn off at Weston Road, to get to the Lake Shore, but it gets congested.

Think they should add HOV lanes to Black Creek Drive and Highway 400, for buses and taxis, do they can bypass the congestion to get to the Mount Dennis transit hub.

 

[Wrench]

Yes a few riders will use the new steeles connection to YU line & few more will take the new Finch lrt to keele stn. But anybody south of there isn't going to go back up north then transfer to finch.
Most will want to go south to the ECLRT !
Which by the way phase one ends @ Weston rd not Jane st just like the
St. clair line ending before it should have!
If you connect the Jane LRT or SRT
Short (cut) Rapid Transit to the ECLRT!
I Guarantee most people going south east will use this line.
The Wilson BRT is a very busy st. Just like Lawrence ave during rush hrs busses are packed going East & West.

 

[Wrench]

Black creek dr connects to Jane st. @ the top end as you approach the start of the 400 hwy.
It has a exit ramp just north of Maple leaf dr.
If Metrolinx wanted to do this lRT on the cheaper scheme of things then just have one station built @ Lawrence.
North west corner lots of rm. there again also all the way down the west side south to Mt Dennison!
Very cheap in own elevated ,grade separated rail corridor.
Don't need to stop @ Tretheway dr.
Has a con. To ECLRT all ready at new Keelesdale stn.
Next stn. North would be Falstaff
So maybe they can figure out a way south but that may be a subway which would con. To the new DRL line extension!
Year maybe 2022
Cross your fingers

 

[W. K. Lis]

Way back in 1910/1911, there were napkin drawing plans for a proposed streetcar on Jane Street (South Kingsway also had the Jane Street name back then, so could have had a streetcar as well). Maybe even continuing east on St. Clair.

Unfortunately, the mayor of the time (1910), George R. Geary, was against spending money, so nothing happened. Only the St. Clair, Danforth, and Gerrard streetcars being built at the time, continued on. We also didn't get a subway until 40 years, despite the referendum results showed the voters wanting a subway.

 

[pstogios]

Way back in 1910/1911, there were napkin drawing plans for a proposed streetcar on Jane Street (South Kingsway also had the Jane Street name back then, so could have had a streetcar as well). Maybe even continuing east on St. Clair.

Unfortunately, the mayor of the time (1910), George R. Geary, was against spending money, so nothing happened. Only the St. Clair, Danforth, and Gerrard streetcars being built at the time, continued on. We also didn't get a subway until 40 years, despite the referendum results showed the voters wanting a subway.

How are the napkin drawings of 106 years ago relevant to today?
I didn't know this was history class.

 

[DonValleyRainbow]

I'm still not so sure why Phase I has to be Eglinton to Bloor. Why not start north of Eglinton, where it will be on surface and cheaper to implement?

 

[muller877]

Way back in 1910/1911, there were napkin drawing plans for a proposed streetcar on Jane Street (South Kingsway also had the Jane Street name back then, so could have had a streetcar as well). Maybe even continuing east on St. Clair.

Unfortunately, the mayor of the time (1910), George R. Geary, was against spending money, so nothing happened. Only the St. Clair, Danforth, and Gerrard streetcars being built at the time, continued on. We also didn't get a subway until 40 years, despite the referendum results showed the voters wanting a subway.

Very cool. Was this before or after the train up South Kingsway was disbanded? Were they planning to convert the old train ROW into a LRT?

 

[W. K. Lis]

How are the napkin drawings of 106 years ago relevant to today?
I didn't know this was history class.

Shows that some forward thinking people a hundred years ago were thinking rail is a good transit option. For those who don't know the history of the Jane bus, here's some little tidbits. Shows there has been some transit for decades on Jane Street. Instead of going with streetcars, the TTC went with buses in the early years. Now it's time for rail.

When the TTC was born in 1921, the first TTC bus did end up mostly following the "Annette" route in the diagram, but as a "Humberside" bus.
1921:

One year later, it was extended.
1922:

"Jane" did get its own named bus route in 1925:

"Jane" got extended to St. Clair & Keele by 1927:

It "disappeared" by 1947 (replaced by Annette and Runnymede routes).

The modern 35 Jane route would reappear by 1950, looping in the north, close to where the new Mount Dennis Station will be for the Crosstown LRT, at Eglinton & Weston, but in the south it would loop around Annette and Willard and Montye. It would get to Jane & Bloor by 1954.

See this link and link, for more information.

 

[ShonTron]

Back in 1910-1911, buses weren't yet a major transit mode, so of course any proposed transit in that area would have been streetcars. I don't think Jane Street, and never did think, that Jane makes much sense for LRT; that was the most ridiculous part of the Transit City proposal.

 

[W. K. Lis]

From an article dated October 23, 2014, at this link:

The 504 King averages 65,000 daily riders.

The 32 Eglinton West averages 49,000 riders. Both the 35 Jane and 36 Finch West have similar ridership levels placing them second and third respectively among the busiest bus routes. That's from 2013 data (link), today Jane Street is served by both the 35 Jane and the 195 Jane Rocket.

The 510 Spadina averages 44,000 riders.

The 501 Queen averages 43,000 riders.

The 29 Dufferin averages 40,000 riders.

Jane Street has grown up. If both Eglinton and Finch West are getting light rail, Jane should be next, but instead its Sheppard East (27,100 riders).

 

[WislaHD]

Sheppard East is next because of political concerns. Nothing more.

The issue with Jane Street is that building an LRT has technical problems, that might only be overcome by expensive alternatives. Toronto has other pressing transit concerns that justify the high pricetag more. If Jane was as simple to build as Finch West, then I don't think it would be at the end of the list of Transit City lines.

 

[DonValleyRainbow]

Sheppard East is next because of political concerns. Nothing more.

The issue with Jane Street is that building an LRT has technical problems, that might only be overcome by expensive alternatives. Toronto has other pressing transit concerns that justify the high pricetag more. If Jane was as simple to build as Finch West, then I don't think it would be at the end of the list of Transit City lines.

Jane should be as easy to build as Finch West, north of Eglinton. This is the point I have been trying to make.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

The ROW for Jane does become very narrow somewhere north of Eglinton. That'll be a challenge.

 

[W. K. Lis]

There were many options for the Jane LRT. The most expensive would have been tunnels for south of Eglinton, tunnels from south of Weston to Wilson, and an open right-of-way in Eglinton Flats and north of Wilson to the Spadina Subway extension at Pioneer Village Station (Steeles West) or Highway 407 Station. The least expensive would be a right-of-way that takes away a traffic lane. The least expensive was not taken very well by most, even by penny-pinching Councillors.

 

[crs1026]

Doing the northern section alone would be worthwhile once ST/RER has more stops south of Eglinton. I suspect that much of the through business heading to Jane station is heading eastwards. ST/RER at Mount Dennis would be a logical transfer and shorter/faster than going all the way to Jane and Bloor before turning east. With that option in place, loads might be a lot lighter on the south end.

- Paul