Transit Fantasy Maps

[rbt]

Wow, so the ECLRT has been pushed back to 2022 now? Did it always take this long to building a subway line?

Yes. ECLRT isn't a simple 6km extension and is heavily intertwined with what happens to the SRT which continually gets bumped due to council being indecisive. Together it is about 28km of new line.

Within current law (limited work hours, construction safety standards, etc.) and political environment (still futzing with basic choices on the SRT portion) it's not an unreasonable timeline. It could be faster but I think Metrolinx has learned people have a low tolerance for construction.

I think the TTC was in much better shape to deal with projects the scope of Eglinton than Infrastructure Ontario/Metrolinx were; but Queen's Park disagrees.

 

[sixrings]

my map

 

[Translude15]

Here's some depressing news. Toronto has gone without 11 years without any subway expansion. That's the longest without any expansion in our history. Before 2002, we opened new subways every 4 years.

Yonge (Union Station to Eglinton) — March 30, 1954
(9 years)
University (Union Station to St George) — February 28, 1963
(3 years)
Bloor-Danforth (Keele to Woodbine) — February 26, 1966 (Feb 25)
(2 years)
Bloor West (Keele to Islington) — May 11, 1968 (May 10)
(N/A)
Danforth East (Woodbine to Warden) — May 11, 1968 (May 10)
(5 years)
Yonge North (Eglinton to York Mills) — March 31, 1973 (Mar 30)
(1 year)
Yonge North (York Mills to Finch) — March 30, 1974 (Mar 29)
(4 years)
Spadina (St George to Wilson) — January 28, 1978 (Jan 27)
(2 years)
Bloor West (Islington to Kipling) — November 22, 1980 (Nov 21)
Danforth East (Warden to Kennedy) — November 22, 1980 (Nov 21)
Scarborough RT (Kennedy to McCowan) — March 24, 1985 (Mar 22)
(2 years)
North York Centre Station — June 18, 1987
(9 years)
Spadina (Wilson to Downsview) — March 31, 1996 (Mar 29)
(6 years)
The Sheppard Subway — November 24, 2002 (Nov 22)
(11 years)
Today

It really is a shame the Eglinton West subway was cancelled back in 1995. Incredibly short-sighted in retrospect.

 

[EnviroTO]

Here's some depressing news. Toronto has gone without 11 years without any subway expansion. That's the longest without any expansion in our history. Before 2002, we opened new subways every 4 years.

If you don't consider the SRT a subway and North York station as an expansion there was a time worse. I see things the other way around, while it would have been nice to see the Sheppard LRT open next year as originally planned, we are still seeing a record investment in transit with Spadina extension, UP Express, Union Station projects, and Eglinton LRT all under construction right now. Also, there is no plan to stop building, instead the SRT replacement and Sheppard LRT are going to be built in some way with funding committed and no party suggesting cancellation outright. How can I be depressed now about how long it has been since the last transit expansion with so much underway. The only time I get depressed is when people change the plan because a changed plan pushes out the timeline for delivery and until a shovel is in the ground and the money has been committed through construction contracts the timeline could keep getting pushed out.

 

[EnviroTO]

it will be 14 before a new opening... then 6 for the ECLRT, then 3 for Scarborough, then (hopefully) 1 for the DRL, then (hopefully) less than 1 for the Yonge Extension

No contract has been signed for Scarborough and not EA has been done for the DRL. An assumption of delivery for ECLRT makes sense but there is no point expecting delivery times on the others. Sheppard LRT and Eglinton West subway has taught us how quickly things can be delayed 5 to 20 years.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Beginning shortly, the TTC will be numbering our Yonge-University-Spadina, Bloor-Danforth and Sheppard subway lines. They'll also be numbering our Scarborough Rapid Transit line.

Our routes will now be numbered as:

1 Yonge-University-Spadina
2 Bloor-Danforth
3 Scarborough Rapid Transit
4 Sheppard
5 Eglinton
6 Sheppard East
7 Finch West

This presumable means that our Eglinton, Sheppard East and Finch West LRT lines will now be included on our Subway/Rapid Transit Route Maps.

This is part of the TTCs effort to improve customer service.

 

[Johnny Au]

Beginning shortly, the TTC will be numbering our Yonge-University-Spadina, Bloor-Danforth and Sheppard subway lines. They'll also be numbering our Scarborough Rapid Transit Line.

Our routes will now be numbered as:

1 Yonge-University-Spadina
2 Bloor-Danforth
3 Sheppard
4 Scarbrough Rapid Transit
5 Eglinton
6 Sheppard East
7 Finch West

This presumable means that our Eglinton, Sheppard East and Finch West LRT lines will now be included on our Subway/Rapid Transit Route Maps.

Actually, Scarborough RT is Route 3 and Sheppard line is Route 4.

 

[BurlOak]

Actually, Scarborough RT is Route 3 and Sheppard line is Route 4.

If LRT's are being numbered, shouldn't Spadina and Harbourfront be Line 4 and 5, Sheppard Subway 6 and St. Clair 7. Then if Eglinton is connected to the SRT, the whole thing could be Line 3.

 

[innsertnamehere]

The streetcar ROW are probably considered too slow to allow to be numbered. besides, they already are numbered as 512, 510, 509, etc.

 

[Dan416]

Is there really any point in numbering the SRT at this point?

 

[TheTigerMaster]

If LRT's are being numbered, shouldn't Spadina and Harbourfront be Line 4 and 5, Sheppard Subway 6 and St. Clair 7. Then if Eglinton is connected to the SRT, the whole thing could be Line 3.

No I don't think so. Spadina and Harborfront don't fit the "profile" of LRT in Toronto. The ECLRT will be a completely different beast. If the TTC modifies Spadina to have subway-like spacing, signal priority and other things, then it could be on the map.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Is there really any point in numbering the SRT at this point?

Why wouldn't it be?

 

[rbt]

Is there really any point in numbering the SRT at this point?

There is not a funded extension of the subway yet. That might change on October 9th, but today the LRT upgrade to the SRT is the only funded option and still the fallback unless someone else commits money.

I also assume signage will change with the Spadina extension coming live. SRT will still exist then and possibly for 6 to 8 years after that point if the subway option is funded.

It will have been been 16 years between the Soberman report mentioning subway extension as an option through to it actually being made live iff it is funded.

 

[andrewpmk]

There is not a funded extension of the subway yet. That might change on October 9th, but today the LRT upgrade to the SRT is the only funded option and still the fallback unless someone else commits money.

I also assume signage will change with the Spadina extension coming live. SRT will still exist then and possibly for 6 to 8 years after that point if the subway option is funded.

It will have been been 16 years between the Soberman report mentioning subway extension as an option through to it actually being made live iff it is funded.

My guess is that 3 would end up being reassigned to the Downtown Relief Line.

Also if the Sheppard light rail is ever built, I would expect it to be numbered 4A or something similar.

 

[BurlOak]

There is not a funded extension of the subway yet. That might change on October 9th, but today the LRT upgrade to the SRT is the only funded option and still the fallback unless someone else commits money.

I also assume signage will change with the Spadina extension coming live. SRT will still exist then and possibly for 6 to 8 years after that point if the subway option is funded.

It will have been been 16 years between the Soberman report mentioning subway extension as an option through to it actually being made live iff it is funded.

It is interesting that the Soberman report stated that the B-D subway extension was by far the worst solution, followed by the LRT. The use of SkyTrain was clearly the best choice.

http://www.toronto.ca/srtstudy/pdf/srt-strategic-plan-report.pdf