Toronto Bike Share

[DSC]

Is this going to change things here?

MONTREAL - The president of bike-sharing service Bixi announced he will quit after five years at the helm, saying he can no longer guarantee that Montreal taxpayers won’t have to shoulder its deficits.

Radio-Canada reported that Roger Plamondon thinks it’s impossible for the service to remain financially independent from the city if it can’t profit from its international sales.

Plamondon’s decision was confirmed by Michel Philibert, spokesperson for Société de vélo en libre-service (SVLS), the company that manages Bixi.

Since the provincial government ordered Montreal to sell off Bixi’s international sales arm – the most profitable part of the system – Montreal may be stuck with its deficits.

Bixi borrowed $37 million from Montreal to find its expansion, and secured a $71 million loan guarantee.

And instead of a $2 million profit this year, the service will be left with a $3 million deficit despite a 25-per cent increase in users, Plamondon told Radio-Canada.

City hall had promised that taxpayers would not have to swallow the debts, as sales of the Bixi systems to other cities would eventually pay the shortfall.

Ariane Lareau, spokesperson for the city of Montreal, said “this changes nothing for Montrealers,” but did not comment on the financial details of the service. She said the city is negotiating how the debts will be handled.

She added that Plamondon won’t leave until the contract to install the system in New York City is complete. Bixi announced in September that it would provide 10,000 bikes and 600 stations to America’s largest city later next year.

Bixi took a lashing this summer after Jacques Bergeron, the city’s auditor general, listed a litany of mistakes by Bixi’s creators and administrators: there was no business plan, feasibility study or risk analysis done before the bicycle service was set up. Bixi ended up costing far more than it should have, Bergeron’s report said.

This negative media exposure may have cost Bixi some sales internationally, Plamondon noted. Of the 9,000 bikes it hoped to sell this year, it only moved 5,600.

rrocha@montrealgazette.com

© Copyright (c) The Montreal Gazette


Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/news...cial+warning/5698849/story.html#ixzz1dV8Il8GF

 

[reaperexpress]

Is this going to change things here?

MONTREAL - The president of bike-sharing service Bixi announced he will quit after five years at the helm, saying he can no longer guarantee that Montreal taxpayers won’t have to shoulder its deficits.
(...)

I don't see anything good coming out of this, but I hope it won't hurt Bixi Toronto too much.

But that's exactly the point. To be successful they have to expand. I'm still confused as to why they chose the one part of the inner-city which probably doesn't have the bike riding tradition as the others. I'd use Bixi 100x more if only it went to places I like visiting: Distillery District, West Queen West, King West, King East, Annex, Koreatown, Yorkville (past Bloor).

The ridership statistics and memberships are impressive for a system implemented in an unsuitable location. It will explode if it expands east and west.

Exactly. The longer they wait before they expand, the longer they will run a deficit.

 

[rbt]

Is this going to change things here?

No. Bixi Toronto has a different setup than the other Bixi implementations.

Bixi Toronto will live or die on its own. It is best looked at as a fully independent franchise that licences the technology.

 

[reaperexpress]

No. Bixi Toronto has a different setup than the other Bixi implementations.

Bixi Toronto will live or die on its own. It is best looked at as a fully independent franchise that licences the technology.

True, Bixi Toronto is not directly affected, but the media and city councillors could easily use the situation in Montreal against Bixi Toronto.

 

[rbt]

True, Bixi Toronto is not directly affected, but the media and city councillors could easily use the situation in Montreal against Bixi Toronto.

They could but they don't really need to. Bixi Toronto is already disliked by the executive committee and probably won't get any more funding. They're not getting the membership purchases required to survive and many customers may not renew next year (some on this forum have even mentioned it) so their revenue base may not grow.

Politically it is far easier to simply say nothing and let Bixi Toronto from lack of revenue.

Frankly, there is too much overhead for it to survive as a business. They took roughly $10,000 in loan for each bike. That's a lot of trips to pay off without even considering operating costs.

 

[GraphicMatt]

I don't think it's that disliked by exec. Minnan-Wong rode a BIXI when he was doing media hits to promote his bike plan.

BIXI hit some snags under the Miller council because some wanted to spurn the Montreal company and create a bike share out of the street furniture contract with Astral, if I remember correctly.

In any case, the whole project has never been given a chance to live up to its potential thanks to the limited roll-out and service area.

 

[k10ery]

Frankly, there is too much overhead for it to survive as a business. They took roughly $10,000 in loan for each bike. That's a lot of trips to pay off without even considering operating costs.

Wasn't it 1000 bikes for $5 million? That's 5000 per, and a lot of it is to cover initial operating losses I'm sure.

 

[rbt]

Wasn't it 1000 bikes for $5 million? That's 5000 per, and a lot of it is to cover initial operating losses I'm sure.

Maybe, that's a lot better. I had thought it was closer to $10 million.

It doesn't really matter what the loan was for; it's still divided over 1000 pieces that can generate revenue.

 

[DSC]

More on Bii Montreal at: http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Mixed+results+after+Bixi+third+season/5734745/story.html

 

[Jonny5]

Per the papers today, Bixi is moving some of it's stations to have a wider dispersion. They will be operating all winter.

http://www.thegridto.com/city/local-news/where-bixis-moving-to/

 

[canmark]

Citigroup paying $41 million to sponsor NYC's bike share program (starting this summer), to be called Citi Bike.

The Citi Bike program, presented by the mayor and Citigroup Chief Executive Officer Vikram Pandit at City Hall today, will offer 10,000 bikes branded with the New York-based bank’s logo at 600 docking stations in Manhattan, Brooklyn and Long Island City, Queens.
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Similar systems exist in Paris, with 20,600 bicycles; Barcelona, which has 6,000; and Hangzhou, China, which offers as many as 60,600, according to Paul DeMaio, a manager of MetroBike LLC, operator of the Arlington, Virginia, portion of Washington’s 1,500-bike system.

Other U.S. cities with installed or intended systems include Boston, Philadelphia, San Francisco, Phoenix, Denver and Chicago, the department said.

BIXI of Montreal operates a 5,120-bicycle system in that city, and others in Toronto, Ottawa and London in the U.K., where it offers 9,200 bikes at 687 stations.

New York will share any profits from the rentals with Portland, Oregon-based Alta Bicycle Share, chosen as its operator in September. The company works with governments, colleges and private companies in North America, Australia, Europe and the Middle East, according to its websites.
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The system will have an annual membership cost of $95, with options for day and weekly use. Members must be at least 16 and may use the system for trips of as long as 45 minutes. Riders using Citi Bikes for longer periods will be charged extra fees, the mayor’s office said.
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The Transportation Department has distributed more than 50,000 free helmets since 2006 and installed more than 390 lane- miles of bicycle routes since 2002, for a total of more than 700 miles of bike lanes, including parks and greenways, according to the department’s website.

 

[Tulse]

Here's a new twist on bike sharing: Social Bicycles. The twist is that instead of the docking stations containing all the electronics, the individual bikes do, which means they can be locked up anywhere, instead of at specific custom stations.

I can envision all sorts of potential problems with this model, but I wonder if it isn't ultimately cheaper and more flexible to implement, since it doesn't necessitate acquiring locations and building stations.

 

[timeo]

I can envision all sorts of potential problems with this model, but I wonder if it isn't ultimately cheaper and more flexible to implement, since it doesn't necessitate acquiring locations and building stations.

It definitely is cheaper, though not as cheap as you think it is. Bikes are less than $1,000, but there's still the underlying costs of telecommunications infrastructure, building bike racks etc. Also, it's just a better idea to go with B-Cycle or BIXI than SoBi in logistical terms.

 

[Tulse]

It definitely is cheaper, though not as cheap as you think it is.

The SoBi folks say that Bixi costs $5000 per bike for infrastructure, primarily the stations, which is a cost that SoBi doesn't have. Of course, the SoBi bikes are presumably more expensive, because of their built-in electronics, and they must have costs associated with cell/GPS communications for each bike. And I just don't understand how one could rely on these bikes for regular transportation, since you never know in advance where they'll be.

 

[PinkLucy]

Since they have GPS/communications, I suspect you'd use some kind of app to locate an available bike, just as you can now check out how many bikes are available at Bixi stations. Still, I think I prefer knowing where the stations are to hoping that a bike has been left somewhere near where I need it to be.