1233 Queen East | ?m | 8s

[chriskayTO]

It's nice to see that the TTC is finally admitting that the way the doors open and close is not right: http://toronto.openfile.ca/blog/cur...w-subways-have-buggy-doors—-theyre-working-it

I'm curious if this has anything to do with the bankrupt door company making shoddy product, or if this is purely a software issue.

Also, in nearly every TR I've been on there seems to be at least one set of doors out of service.

 

[picard102]

I'm curious if this has anything to do with the bankrupt door company making shoddy product, or if this is purely a software issue.

Probably more to do with jackasses blocking the doors.

 

[chriskayTO]

Probably more to do with jackasses blocking the doors.

If that's the case, doors on other models would be constantly out of service, too.

 

[caltrane74]

The latest trianset I have seen is: 5541-5546.

 

[rfid]

Some features I would have liked to have seen on these trains:
- an active LED route map that dynamically updates as the train moves through the route (though I guess our system is simple enough not to necessitate one)
- an announcement as soon as the doors OPEN indicating the direction, route, and next station (I am not sure the reasoning behind our double announcing the next stop when the doors are already closed, after leaving and upon arriving at the station)

Those that have seen other subways will know what I am talking about

 

[JoeParez]

- an announcement as soon as the doors OPEN indicating the direction, route, and next station (I am not sure the reasoning behind our double announcing the next stop when the doors are already closed, after leaving and upon arriving at the station)

Those that have seen other subways will know what I am talking about

What's the point of this though? The subway system isn't complex enough to warrant that kind of information. If you're on the Yonge line heading south to Union, you should know by now that the final destination is Downsview heading north. It's not like we have trains A through X going to multiple destinations. The only time I believe this would be needed is if the TTC actually schedules short turned trains and when you get on the train, it tells you you're going to get off at SCW (for example); but since the TTC like to randomly short turn trains, then there is no point. Or even real-time delay announcements (which are slowly happening).

At some point, riders have to start taking responsibility for their trips and not have to rely on a subway train to tell them where they're going. It pisses me off to no extent to see someone lose their shit on a bus/streetcar because they got on the "C" branch bus instead on the "A" branch. If you had read the destination sign in the first place, you would've known!

For example, last year I was at the CNE and I boarded a bus which clearly stated "EXPRESS TO BATHURST STATION" - and people were ringing the bell to get off at Queen! 'You missed my fucking stop, you idiot!' yelled one woman -- the entire bus yelled back 'It's going to Bathurst station!'. But she didn't care, of course it's the TTC's fault that she's the idiot.

Sorry that I went off on a tangent.

 

[car4041]

- an announcement as soon as the doors OPEN indicating the direction, route, and next station

In off-peak hours, the doors are often not open long enough for an announcement like that -- and our system is so incredibly simple that I don't really think it's necessary for the doors to be held so that such an announcement can play at every station. Maybe just at interchange stations, the only place where there's any potential for confusion. Otherwise I think it would be annoying to hear "This is a northbound Yonge-University-Spadina train to Downsview" over and over and over. The constant "Please stand clear of doors" is annoying enough -- isn't that what the chimes and flashing lights already mean, as anyone who ever rides more than one stop would immediately learn?

(I am not sure the reasoning behind our double announcing the next stop when the doors are already closed, after leaving and upon arriving at the station)

Announcing the next stop after departure confirms that you're on the right train. Announcing the stop upon arrival prompts those who are exiting to move toward the doors (or wake up, in some cases!)

My biggest pet peeve with the new trains: the door chimes are played through the general PA system rather than actually coming from the door. I can see how this would reduce maintenance, but as Joe Fiorito pointed out in a recent column, it means that the chimes are way louder inside the train than outside, which is the opposite of the way it should be and subjects the passengers to unnecessary noise. The last note of the chimes also cuts off quite abruptly rather than ringing out naturally like it does on the older trains. Also, on some of the new trains, the orange lights in the doorways don't start flashing until after the chimes have sounded and the doors are actually closing, which is a bit too late to do much good. Some of the new trains correctly flash the lights while the chimes are sounding, though sometimes they only start halfway through the chimes.

 

[CDL.TO]

At some point, riders have to start taking responsibility for their trips and not have to rely on a subway train to tell them where they're going. It pisses me off to no extent to see someone lose their shit on a bus/streetcar because they got on the "C" branch bus instead on the "A" branch. If you had read the destination sign in the first place, you would've known!

For example, last year I was at the CNE and I boarded a bus which clearly stated "EXPRESS TO BATHURST STATION" - and people were ringing the bell to get off at Queen! 'You missed my fucking stop, you idiot!' yelled one woman -- the entire bus yelled back 'It's going to Bathurst station!'. But she didn't care, of course it's the TTC's fault that she's the idiot.

Although I don't disagree, I'm a little sympathetic because I see TTC vehicles with incorrect destination signs on a daily basis. A northbound Spadina streetcar signed to "King", a Downsview-bound train signed to "Finch", or a southbound Sherbourne bus signed to "South Dr" are all frequent sights.

That said, people still need to take responsibility. Read the sign and if you suspect it might be wrong, ask the driver.

 

[JoeParez]

Although I don't disagree, I'm a little sympathetic because I see TTC vehicles with incorrect destination signs on a daily basis. A northbound Spadina streetcar signed to "King", a Downsview-bound train signed to "Finch", or a southbound Sherbourne bus signed to "South Dr" are all frequent sights.

That said, people still need to take responsibility. Read the sign and if you suspect it might be wrong, ask the driver.

Entirely true.
Today on my way to work I saw the 165 Weston Road North bus that said it was going "to Steeles" -- it was going to Wilson Station and was already south of Steeles.

 

[ShonTron]

In off-peak hours, the doors are often not open long enough for an announcement like that -- and our system is so incredibly simple that I don't really think it's necessary for the doors to be held so that such an announcement can play at every station. Maybe just at interchange stations, the only place where there's any potential for confusion. Otherwise I think it would be annoying to hear "This is a northbound Yonge-University-Spadina train to Downsview" over and over and over.

You hear that on Chicago L trains, but that's part of the at-times ridiculous ADA act, but at least in the Loop and where the Brown, Purple and Red lines share stops on the North Side, there can be multiple trains going in different directions stopping on the same platform. Across the US, the buses say the route and destination from a speaker over the front doors every time they open, as do OC Transpo buses (useful at least on Albert and Slater and parts of the inner Transitway for visually-impaired passengers). There are times they are useful, but not on Toronto's subway. Our subway doesn't even need side destination signs.

 

[car4041]

Although I don't disagree, I'm a little sympathetic because I see TTC vehicles with incorrect destination signs on a daily basis. A northbound Spadina streetcar signed to "King", a Downsview-bound train signed to "Finch", or a southbound Sherbourne bus signed to "South Dr" are all frequent sights.

Indeed. Do they even change the destination signs on the H-series and T1 subway trains? It seems like they just leave one end as "Downsview" and the other end as "Finch", so that the back of the train always displays the wrong destination. It can be disorienting to go down the escalator to the northbound platform at St. Clair West and see the back of the waiting Downsview train signed as "Finch". I feel like I've seen Rockets signed this way too, but I'm not sure.

(Not to mention the sign on the back of the streetcar. I saw a 521 the other day!)

 

[rfid]

Announcing the next stop after departure confirms that you're on the right train. Announcing the stop upon arrival prompts those who are exiting to move toward the doors (or wake up, in some cases!)

That's why it's better to announce the next stop when the doors open, so you can confirm you're going on the right train, rather than being trapped on the wrong one! Arriving at announcement is fine; the next stop one is redundant if the doors already closed.

I think when Toronto's LRT network gets complex enough it might warrant all of the above (route, destination, next station announcement when the doors open and active LED map).

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Indeed. Do they even change the destination signs on the H-series and T1 subway trains? It seems like they just leave one end as "Downsview" and the other end as "Finch", so that the back of the train always displays the wrong destination. It can be disorienting to go down the escalator to the northbound platform at St. Clair West and see the back of the waiting Downsview train signed as "Finch". I feel like I've seen Rockets signed this way too, but I'm not sure.

(Not to mention the sign on the back of the streetcar. I saw a 521 the other day!)

I've seen TRs do this as well. It really makes no sense.

 

[CDL.TO]

Indeed. Do they even change the destination signs on the H-series and T1 subway trains? It seems like they just leave one end as "Downsview" and the other end as "Finch", so that the back of the train always displays the wrong destination.

In regular operation there is no need to change the signs, but the subway yards at Wilson and Greenwood have loops. It would suggest that some operators fail to check their destination signs when leaving the yard.

I've seen incorrect destination signs on subway trains countless times. Most people don't notice because they have no reason to. I remember groggily standing on the southbound platform at Bloor when a train pulled into the opposite platform signed to Downsview, then a train pulled into my platform signed to Finch. I was on the right platform, it was both of the trains that were wrong!

 

[car4041]

That's why it's better to announce the next stop when the doors open, so you can confirm you're going on the right train, rather than being trapped on the wrong one! Arriving at announcement is fine; the next stop one is redundant if the doors already closed.

In principle I agree that an announcement prior to the doors closing would serve a purpose, but I still think it would slow things down a (tiny) bit -- as it is now, at minor stations off-peak, it's common for the door-closing chimes to sound immediately after the doors open. But sure, five more seconds at each station wouldn't be a huge hardship if the extra announcements really are needed.

Personally I find it bloody annoying having to sit through the rather verbose announcements on the Tube in London. They make sense in Central London where there are lots of tourists and the network is complex (and the time taken by the announcements is required for boarding anyway), but in the outer areas, everyone boards the train in like 2 seconds and yet you have to sit there and listen to the voice say "Please mind the gap between the train and the platform. This is an eastbound Piccadilly Line service to...Cockfosters. Please mind the closing doors" at every single stop before the doors can begin to close.