Suddenly...Windmills! Millions of them!

[Ervin]

I was watching a video of the Gardiner (this one) and noticed the windmill that stands at the exhibition place. This got me thinking, wouldn't it be pretty great if Toronto had a bunch more of these scattered around? The reason is that as I see it, windmills are the ultimate symbol of clean energy. They're cool, and the very sight of one turning yells in to your face that place is progressive. Plus it has the added benefit of, you know... Clean energy.

There are a few places that could fit a handful of these, not too many (unlike the thread title suggests), just a couple of them. One good place would be along the west part of the Gardiner between the rail tracks and the freeway, where there's quite a lot of unused space that will likely never be used. The last of these windmills could be smacked right next to Fort York, a nice combination of the modern and the historic. A few more could be fit on the west side of the Gardiner, again between the road and the rail.

If the Olympics are to come in 2020 or 2024, a few could be placed in Toronto Island Park and Tommy Thompson Park (that name is so weird that I felt weird just typing it out). A few big ones could be easily seen from Port Lands, the likely place for at least some of the venues. This would give Canada a pretty good image.

Any thoughts on this? Perhaps a reason why something like this hasn't already been done?

 

[Redroom Studios]

it seems that atleast in Canada the big turbine projects are being placed in rural areas. I agree with your view on them and would love to see lots more here in our urban areas as well. For some odd reason there are still significant numbers of people that dont like them. I remembering reading about some project to place a number of them offshore in Lake Ontario. There's quite a number of such projects around the world... I know I have seen this from the air when flying over Liverpool England.

 

[Ervin]

Hear about those as well. The whole world needs more of these.

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

In Almodóvar's film "Volver" there's a great scene shortly into the film as the main charactors are traveling back from the small village of Almagro into Madrid. Hundreds of tall, white windmills spin against the sky and fields along the desolate highway as they make their way into the modern capitol city, it's very dramatic - and beautiful. We need these here, we're so behind much of the world in harnessing the power of the wind.

 

[kettal]

is Toronto windy enough to make it worthwhile? Sure it may look cool, but if the same windmill will spin more on the other end of Lake Ontario, then that is where he belongs.

 

[Ervin]

Well of course full scale wind farms belong in windier places, but that's no reason to not place a handful single windmills around Toronto. The one at exhibition seems to be spinning all the time, though not that fast.

 

[Ervin]

On another note, how about covering the huge amounts of roof space that malls and shopping centres have, and covering them in solar panels? Toronto gets pretty sunny most of the year. Perhaps the government could subsidise the companies that do this, or pay them for the electricity that they feed into the grid.

 

[Jimbits]

Toronto Hydro Energy Services is constructing an anemometer in the lake:

http://www.torontohydroenergy.com/generation_offshore.html

But one should note from the web page:

No decision to proceed with a potential offshore wind farm has been made. Any further projects (i.e. an offshore wind farm) are subject to a separate environmental assessment process with full agency and public participation.

 

[AnnetteMeetsJane]

I haven't stood near the windmill at The Ex, but in general windmills are noisy when turning properly. That makes them unpopular neighbours in urban settings.
AmJ

 

[W. K. Lis]

When I was at the CNE, standing near the windmill as it turns, I did not hear anything from it. The Lake Shore traffic is louder.

 

[AnnetteMeetsJane]

When I was at the CNE, standing near the windmill as it turns, I did not hear anything from it. The Lake Shore traffic is louder.

Which makes me wonder if it actually generates much. I have some experience of working wind turbines in the UK (Wales), and the ones I have been around produced a lot of low frequency noise - I felt it on my body rather than "heard" it and there was also higher frequency noise which I believe was "air spill" as the air moves over the turbine blades. I actually like the look of wind turbines (most people who lived around the wind turbines didn't). Perhaps the technology has improved. I am as eco-conscious as the next person, but my experience tells me that they are sited away from population centres in the UK for noise reasons as well as optimal wind sites.

Anyway here is a copy of the (now old) city report on the topic of wind turbines and noise - they deemed it a not insurmountable problem if the siting was appropriate: http://www.windshare.ca/documents/AppD-CityofTorontoNoiseReport.pdf

 

[W. K. Lis]

There are newer designs than the one at the CNE.

Check out this link for a better explanation.

 

[Eug]

Well of course full scale wind farms belong in windier places, but that's no reason to not place a handful single windmills around Toronto.

Yes there is. It's a waste of money if not appropriate for the location, and in some areas they can be an eyesore and can generate unwanted noise.

You put windmills in windy areas that can generate significant power from wind, not all over the place because it's trendy to be pseudo-green.

I remembering reading about some project to place a number of them offshore in Lake Ontario. There's quite a number of such projects around the world...

If you're talking about the Toronto Hydro one, IMO this is a "LOOK AT ME I'M FAKIN' IT GREEN" initiative. There was a provincially commissioned study completed by Helimax in 2008 looking at potential offshore sites in Ontario that would be feasible for wind farms. The proposed area by Toronto Hydro was not one of them. Yet, Toronto Hydro wants it there. One can only conclude it's because Toronto Hydro doesn't have access to the other provincial sites, and doesn't want to miss out on the PR of being pseudo-green. Your tax dollars at work...

 

[W. K. Lis]

Check out their FAQ at this link.

From the FAQ:

What about the noise from turbines that’s in the news, and what about birds?
Traditional turbines have reported issues with vibration caused when the wind passes over and behind the blades, referred to as cavitation. The HWT deflects the wind in a completely different manner, alleviating this characteristic. Unlike traditional turbines that are difficult for birds to see as the tips is virtually transparent, the HWT turbine’s design, color, and enclosed border system help make the turbine more distinguishable to wildlife.

Looks to me that with newer turbines, the noise will be less.

 

[adma]

I haven't stood near the windmill at The Ex, but in general windmills are noisy when turning properly. That makes them unpopular neighbours in urban settings.
AmJ

Well, it isn't just a matter of "noisiness". Attractive as they may be from a distance, an Ex-type windmill would make an awfully overbearing neighbour within a hemmed-in urban setting, as much as any hydro or transformer substation.

Heck, if you've noticed whatever windfarms exist around Ontario, they tend to be within fairly barren settings, or generate the same...