Star: Flaherty - Transit Money not Firm

[Mike in TO]

Let's just hope the money gets spent on something in the end and spend soon not ten years from now.

There was federal money for infrastructure in Ontario in the last federal budget (although the exact amount is up to debate). Flaherty is actually being very smart about this politically, rather than signing off on the subway he's basically 'keeping the money in play', which leaves many options open to him. Essentially the money needs to be allocated towards a project by April 1, 2007 or it goes into general revenue - but until then there really isn't anything out there to make Flaherty to rush a decision.

Although the merits of extending the subway to Vaughan are debatable, I think these people who want expansion, but not to Vaughan need to rethink their position. The fact of the matter is the current provincial government will be there until 2007 and given the current political strength of the government, Sorbara will likely be Finance Minister until at least 2011. This is the #1 priority whether you like it or not, so in my opinion it's best to build the damn thing so we can move on and debate the next subway expansion priority.

Until the Spadina extention is built, no other subways will be as long as the current government is in power and I would expect John Tory to promise to go ahead with the Spadina Subway if he is elected. He will need a very pro Toronto platform if he is to succeed and he has promised to run in a Toronto riding himself.

 

[afransen TO]

I'd feel better if it wasn't so blatantly self-serving for Sorbara to be pushing it.

 

[bizorky]

It would help if there would already be an established long-term plan for where subways and LRT's would go. Create a plan and say that over the next 10 to 15 years the infrastructure is to be put into place. That way we would not end up with a transit system built in a piecemeal fashion and dependent on the political flavour of the day. It would also show commitment to the eventuality of transit.

 

[TdotTrickyRicky]

^We can't have that it would just make too much sense.

 

[Antiloop33rpm]

^A solid plan would be very beneficial to to Toronto (and the GTA at large). Ottawa is probably the best example I can think of off hand for a Canadian city which has developed a very solid and realistic plan for its transit future. It would be hard to prove that this has directly resulted in better funding, but when you consider the level of nonsense that planners in that city are up against having a solid plan which they could work from must have certainly helped.

I still believe that one of the biggest problems facing Toronto and the GTA is cooperation and coordination. I know that the GTAA is ment to help resolve many of these issues but its frustrating to read through news articles and see neighboring cities and municipalities bickering and acting like children over many issues (such as transit). Until this problem is dealt with I really see the same situation playing out year after year where transit projects are purely political and their implemenation or failure depends on who does or doesn't get elected.

 

[ahrvojic]

I still believe that one of the biggest problems facing Toronto and the GTA is cooperation and coordination.

If you ask me, not only is that *the* biggest problem, but also the source of pretty much all our other problems.

One way to solve this would be with a complete overhaul of the GTA's regional municipalities, including the option of their dissolution and the creation of one new one (Metro revival?) to reflect the region's high interdependence. It would probably also make sense to cast off the solidly rural portions (e.g. Caledon) to surrounding counties, which would probably serve their interests better as well. It wouldn't have to be a full-blown amalgamation, but there will have to be some sort of real political integration before cooperation and coordination can come naturally.

Essentially, what I'm thinking is that we have to build the right framework before things can organically develop in the general direction we'd like them to. Then again, I see the GTA's eventual integration as inevitable; it's more a question of whether we're going to do it the easy way or the hard way.

 

[ahrvojic]

Article

Fund new subway line, Ottawa told
Wavering on extension `just insanity'
City `paralyzed' without more transit

Aug. 23, 2006. 06:30 AM
KEVIN MCGRAN
TRANSPORTATION REPORTER

Toronto and York Region leaders are urging Ottawa to help fund the extension of the Spadina subway line after Finance Minister Jim Flaherty hinted the federal government was wavering on the issue.
"It would be in their interest to participate," said Howard Moscoe, a Toronto councillor and TTC chairman. "It will serve a region (federal Conservatives) want to have some votes in.
"It's an important project for all of us. .. .They need to in some way demonstrate their commitment, not simply to Toronto or York Region, but to cities in general. Their agenda for cities has remained non-existent."
Flaherty told the Star on Monday there was no "firm" federal money for the TTC's $2 billion expansion project.
The province has set aside $670 million for the 6.2-kilometre line that would stop at York University and cross over into Vaughan.
"The subway coming to Vaughan is not just for Toronto and Vaughan, it is important for the whole region," said Vaughan Mayor Michael Di Biase. "We are building a huge transit hub for the entire Greater Toronto Area. People can come from north and east and west and just zoom downtown."
Di Biase was optimistic the Tories would fund the subway and bus-only lanes and light-rail transit in York.
"It will happen. Jim Flaherty himself told me: `I'm not going to earmark $670 million for a subway. It will be an infrastructure package we will give to Ontario, then Ontario will give part of that money to the subway.'"
Vaughan city council has written Flaherty to try to impress on him just how important the subway extension is.
Moscoe said he sent Flaherty a letter last week requesting federal funds after hearing him say Ottawa hadn't been asked to help.
Moscoe said the minority Tories would make a mistake if they didn't fund the project.
"If they think they can win this country and ignore the cities, they made a serious miscalculation.
``The cities are the engine that make this country run. They have not had a strong urban agenda in the past and it's time they begin to build one."
It's believed the Ontario government wants shovels in the ground before the next election in just more than a year. And the federal Conservatives may be holding back "good-news" announcements until they're ready to campaign.
Toronto Councillor Glenn De Baeremaeker, who is also a TTC commissioner, said the federal Conservatives' lack of commitment to transit funding is "just insanity."
"This city will be paralyzed. There'll be literally a 24-hour-a-day, seven-day-a-week rush hour on every single road. ... This is the economic engine of the country, and our engine will seize unless we can move around within the city, and we need public transit to do that."

 

[janschot]

Level-headed Politicking

After the change of heart from the Scarborough councillors the other day, towards adopting the streecar idea, I was starting to feel good about transit planning in the city. Finally the politicians are paying attention to what most transit advocates have been saying - that spending all the money on one marginally useful subway line is a bad idea.
But councillor Glenn De Baeremaeker doesn't inspire confidence when he says if there isn't transit investment "There'll be literally a 24-hour-a-day, seven-day-a-week rush hour on every single road".
I find it hard to believe that there will ever be 24-hour-a-day rush hour on any road in Toronto ever, even for one day. For gridlock to take over every single road would require a huge influx of automobiles from outside the city and intensive planning.
You don't win arguments by making absolutely ridiculous statements like these.

 

[Mark Dowling]

Re: Level-headed Politicking

zooming downtown on a subway? How many stops would there be between VCC and Union - there's 14 between union and downsview I think, another 4? to Steeles and then another 3-4 to VCC.

What Vaughan needs is a ramped up GO service if they want to "zoom downtown"

 

[billonlogan]

Re: Level-headed Politicking

I was listening to an interview this morning on The John Oakley Show on AM640 with Minister of Finance Jim Flaherty on whether or not the Feds are waffling on promised TTC funding.
You can hear it here.
He seems more interested in a regional transportation plan like building a new highway north of the Oak Ridges within the next 20 years.

 

[Antiloop33rpm]

Re: Level-headed Politicking

I have a better plan. Keep the Federal government out of provincial jurisdiction and let Toronto and Ontario decide what it needs and wants to develops in local and regional transportation infrastructure.

 

[cacruden]

Re: Level-headed Politicking

I whole-heartedly agree. The province should pay for it.

 

[billonlogan]

I get the impression from Flaherty whatever funding is provided to the province for infrastructure and transportation will have conditions attached.

 

[doady]

I whole-heartedly agree. The province should pay for it.

Who are you agreeing with? No one said this. The province is paying for it, exactly the one third of the cost, like the other level of governments should. But our transit hating Conservative government refuses to pay their 1/3 share for not only the Spadina extension, but also for Brampton and Mississauga's BRTs. It is sad, our federal government spends a lot less on transit than even the US government does.

 

[cacruden]

Keep the Federal government out of provincial jurisdiction

Keep out of a jurisdiction means not meddling in it at all .... funding is part of the equation. The province has exactly the same ability to raise funds as the federal government does. So I am agreeing with you.

Now, politically we know that that will never happen...

If the federal government is providing funding -- they should and will have a say. That is how the federal government ended up with a say in Health-care.

So,

Are you saying the federal government should just be a piggy-bank?

Be careful,

Because for consistency... if that is the case -- Ottawa should have no say in Health-care as well...